ACT Brumbies v British and Irish Lions (18/06/13)

[munstermuffin]

I hope this squad doesn't indicate that Murray will take the scrum half bench spot... Gatland would be seriously shooting himself in the foot by selection BOTH philips and murray

Would disagree as Youngs has been poorest of 3 and Gatland may like to keep same type with fresh legs.

 

[j'nuh]

Would disagree as Youngs has been poorest of 3 and Gatland may like to keep same type with fresh legs.

No?

Going through gaps against low-quality opposition doesn't make you a good scrum-half. Phillips wasn't nearly as loved before the Barbarians match as after it. (It's saying something that he had his best international game in such a long time against poor opposition.) So he went through the fringes of a poor defence; it's not going to work anywhere near as successfully against Australia, and shouldn't be seen as something to get excited about.

Youngs has had the cleanest pass and the best box kick on this tour, so he starts for me.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

No?

Going through gaps against low-quality opposition doesn't make you a good scrum-half. Phillips wasn't nearly as loved before the Barbarians match as after it. (It's saying something that he had his best international game in such a long time against poor opposition.) So he went through the fringes of a poor defence; it's not going to work anywhere near as successfully against Australia, and shouldn't be seen as something to get excited about.

Youngs has had the cleanest pass and the best box kick on this tour, so he starts for me.

Phillips - Great runner, Decent service, poor box kick.
Youngs - Great service, Decent box kick, poor runner.
Murray - Great Box kick, Decent runner, poor service.
(Exaggerated, none of them are poor in these areas but just in comparison to each other)

That's how I'd see the three of them, I'd have Phillips starting with Youngs on the bench due to Murray being very bad at controlling the pack, the pace of play and himself in the opponents 22.

 

[Rich Taff]

Phillips - Great runner, Decent service, poor box kick.
Youngs - Great service, Decent box kick, poor runner.
Murray - Great Box kick, Decent runner, poor service.
(Exaggerated, none of them are poor in these areas but just in comparison to each other)

That's how I'd see the three of them, I'd have Phillips starting with Youngs on the bench due to Murray being very bad at controlling the pack, the pace of play and himself in the opponents 22.

Phillips is going to be the starting 9, no real doubt about that. I think Murray has been disappointing so far. Has been way too slow to the breakdown, and service is pretty slow. Youngs has a quick pass, but his box kicking has been awful (from what I've seen). He telegraphs it so much, and usually overkicks it. Also, if he's not pressured into doing something and has time to think, he seems to second guess himself a lot.

I'd expect Phillips start, with Youngs on bench.

 

[Aristodemus]

I think Youngs' box kicks are great, and his pass is the best of the three. Phillips would be my last choice as SH from this squad. I know he will start though.

 

[Thingimubob]

Love that people seem to forget how good he played in his last big international against England - the guy is a great big match player, always stands up and is counted in the big pressure games.. Ive always rated his box kicking, feel it slightly redeems the slow passing. Honestly don;t know how many times I've said this on here, so cba going into it all over again...

Youngs is great when he turns up, but I feel he can be quite inconsistent at the best of times Definitely my bench SH though.

 

[munstermuffin]

To be honest as long as Phillips is fit he will be on field unless result is decided.

 

[InsaneAsylum]

At the expense of other teams during a WC? No they do not play for free. They get the same 33 percent from the Network deal Aus and NZ got. You want to increase revenue stop trying damage limitations go out and make rugby popular at schools

probably worth discussing this elsewhere as you make a valid point. I'm not sure if you've been to Melbourne before but it's nowhere near as easy as simply making rugby popular in schools as it is in the south Africa or new Zealand. Melbourne kids heros are AFL players not rugby Players, and despite that, rugby is growing thanks to the rebels being around, albeit slowly growing.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Cmac... Youngs is a poor runner?! That's the main reason youngs was picked for this tour! For his ability to exploit gaps and beat defenders.

The aspects of his game I'd question are his decision making, and the quality of his kicking. And to be clear, I'm not saying youngs should start, but that his ability to inject pace off the bench is why he has to be there. I'm actually a fan of Murray, but when the three scrum halves for the tour were announced it was immediately clear that Murray was going to have to do something special to get into the test squad, since he's not entirely dissimilar to Philips, who gatland will always prefer. And I think so far Murrays game has been a bit messy, with mistakes creeping in. Additionally, whilst Philips arguably should start, it's youngs who has played the toughest conditions/games so far, and in that sense he's perhaps the best prepared.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

This has no bearing on the convo, I just like the try.
I think cmac is confusing #9 running and forwards running Youngs is a great nippy little runner, whereas Phillips and Murray are stronger runners - different types, but all pretty good imo.

I'd have Philips starting and Youngs off the bench.

 

[McTallshort]

The Scrum halves have been like the tight heads on this tour, none have really stuck their hand up for selection and Philips (like Jones) is getting the test place by default.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

This has no bearing on the convo, I just like the try.
I think cmac is confusing #9 running and forwards running Youngs is a great nippy little runner, whereas Phillips and Murray are stronger runners - different types, but all pretty good imo.

I'd have Philips starting and Youngs off the bench.

If you buy into the 'This gif says so, therefore its true' line of thinking, then it definitely is relevant to the conversation

 

[ZeFrenchy]

Don't you love it when the camera man buys the dummy pass...

 

[Bodges]

So will goal-kicking duties go to Hogg or Twelvetrees?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

It'll be Hogg, I reckon.

 

[munstermuffin]

So will goal-kicking duties go to Hogg or Twelvetrees?

Presume Hogg as he's more a possibility of having to use it.

As for test games was talking to a relation of an Irish palyer and barring injury it seems Zebo isn't in 23 for Saturday so it seems Maitland and Cuthbert are starters. Although it said on this mornings news that North has 90% chance of making it and Bowe may shockingly start.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

A Cuthbert/Maitland wing partnership....talk about leaky defence.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

(Exaggerated, none of them are poor in these areas but just in comparison to each other)

Cmac... Youngs is a poor runner?! That's the main reason youngs was picked for this tour! For his ability to exploit gaps and beat defenders.

The aspects of his game I'd question are his decision making, and the quality of his kicking. And to be clear, I'm not saying youngs should start, but that his ability to inject pace off the bench is why he has to be there. I'm actually a fan of Murray, but when the three scrum halves for the tour were announced it was immediately clear that Murray was going to have to do something special to get into the test squad, since he's not entirely dissimilar to Philips, who gatland will always prefer. And I think so far Murrays game has been a bit messy, with mistakes creeping in. Additionally, whilst Philips arguably should start, it's youngs who has played the toughest conditions/games so far, and in that sense he's perhaps the best prepared.

I didn't mean any of them are poor in these areas but in comparison to Murray and Phillips, Youngs is not as effective running with the ball or running support lines which both Phillips and Murray are very good at. I think that quality and speed of the service from the scrum half is the most important skill, followed by the box kick and then running. None of the three players have excellent service but Murray's is bad so that rules him out of a test spot in my opinion. Youngs is probably the most skilled of the three players but Phillips is the best.

 

[nealn]

Presume Hogg as he's more a possibility of having to use it.

As for test games was talking to a relation of an Irish palyer and barring injury it seems Zebo isn't in 23 for Saturday so it seems Maitland and Cuthbert are starters. Although it said on this mornings news that North has 90% chance of making it and Bowe may shockingly start.

So sounds like a 90% chance of North and Cuthbert starting with Maitland covering the back 3 on the bench and if North fails Maitland to jump to the 15 and Zebo to make the bench? Hope Bowe isn't rushed back... Love the guy but would rather he came back for the 2nd test having had the benefit of a bit more training rather than rushed into the lineup.

 

[Tony Manx]

Thought Michael Winner had died....................?