A Political Thread pt. 2

[ncurd]

It's not people going to trump that's the issue.

I feel like the dems trying to appease the right is what fucks them. It's the low voter turnout. Harris isn't even a moderate, the left in America is disenfranchised with politics it's as simple as that

We are obviously all looking at this from a foreign policy point of view and I agree, I absolutely didn't want to see Trump (Musk) get anywhere near power but he won convincingly. There is an American military analyst I follow on YouTube, he's very pro Ukraine/NATO, doesn't get involved in politics but calls out disinformation on both sides and certainly isn't a fan of Musk but on a recent podcast he was asked what kept him awake at night and he said the southern border. He said there is no control and anyone should be sending people without being checked and this to him was a worry.

If this is how most Americans think then it's easy to see why Trump won and in time I think we will come to realise that Harris wasn't that good a candidate either.

I was speaking to an American friend at the weekend and after a few drinks in she admitted she'd voted Republican in the past not at Presidential level or Senate she's from Delaware so has been voting Biden all her life. She says the main driving factor is fear of the the left and nobody in the UK really understand that.

And if the left can't be arsed to get out bed to vote fuckers like Trump out in thier droves out then I'm not really sure they exist.

 

[Reiser99]

I think far more than here, there is a narrative written by politicians and spread by the media. For these people voting they genuinely believe what they are told and they are bombarded by this narrative so it becomes true.

 

[ncurd]

Look at the UK we wanted to destroy our right wing and the left voted tactically and efficiently and reduced them to a puddle and it didn't require a mass movement to do it or even a particularly uplifting candidate. Just a need to destroy them at all costs.

I think one of the major factor is Biden takes over mid Pandemic, does well with economic downturn but ultimately its a tough battle (see Brown 2010) and right get back in able to blame Biden for it. Not looking to us to see what happens if the right stay in charge and they really do burn it to the ground.

 

[McTallshort]

I was speaking to an American friend at the weekend and after a few drinks in she admitted she'd voted Republican in the past not at Presidential level or Senate she's from Delaware so has been voting Biden all her life. She says the main driving factor is fear of the the left and nobody in the UK really understand that.

And if the left can't be arsed to get out bed to vote fuckers like Trump in thier droves out then I'm not really sure they exist.

Speaking to a couple of French friends a few weeks ago and they both said the left scared them more then the National Front

 

[ncurd]

Speaking to a couple of French friends a few weeks ago and they both said the left scared them more then the National Front

Its insane but then we have our Reform voters.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

I hate him and Musk with a passion

Those two and Trump really are just scum personified, insane the hero worship they get

Same, Bryson Dechambeau got a mention too and same with him.

They're all insecure narcissists with terrible social skills. It would be interesting to see a study as to when and how these became likeable traits to a large number of people. Social media and possibly the trend of people living with their parents longer and longer would be my guess.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

She says the main driving factor is fear of the the left and nobody in the UK really understand that.

Is that a cold war hangover?
The amount of communist talk over the last few months has been crazy considering the Democrats would be centre-right anywhere else in the world

 

[General Melchett]

I think a lot of it comes down to the fact that Christianity is by far the dominant religion in America and Christians by their very nature are conservative people. They're not as progressive as Europe/Canada/Australia and the prospect of having a lefty woke communist female President (how she was portrayed by Team Trump) is just not something they can get on board with.

 

[Saintjay]

Listening to the radio. The Dems going to have a blood bath. One Dem commentary being they are stuck as the party of Holywood whilst rural and working class areas went Republican.

Looking at the Republican stats they were saying Trump picked up more young women and minority voters than they've done in a long time.

 

[Reiser99]

Maybe in the long term this might lead to some genuine changes in American democracy...

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I think a lot of it comes down to the fact that Christianity is by far the dominant religion in America and Christians by their very nature are conservative people. They're not as progressive as Europe/Canada/Australia and the prospect of having a lefty woke communist female President (how she was portrayed by Team Trump) is just not something they can get on board with.

Crazy the spin jobs they can do on people considering Harris is a Christian and Trump is as far from as you can get

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Maybe in the long term this might lead to some genuine changes in American democracy...

You'd hope so, but probably not

I hope the Labour party are watching this and learning - next GE is years away, but they don't want to follow the Dems path

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Biden really screwed them by clinging on as long as he did so that Harris was the only possible candidate - if they'd spent the last 4 years building up someone else they could have done so much better,
Walz kinda came out of nowhere on the political landscape and seems to be a genuinely likeable/good politician who polls very well individually - what if they'd invested the last 4 years into making him the presidential candidate instead?

Last time round Biden had the pop of being very popular as Obama's VP, Harris had the legacy of failing massively when trying to run as the Dem nominee previously, and being generally unpopular as Biden's VP

The momentum was just fine when Harris

I was speaking to an American friend at the weekend and after a few drinks in she admitted she'd voted Republican in the past not at Presidential level or Senate she's from Delaware so has been voting Biden all her life. She says the main driving factor is fear of the the left and nobody in the UK really understand that.

And if the left can't be arsed to get out bed to vote fuckers like Trump out in thier droves out then I'm not really sure they exist.

The fear of the left is such a bs excuse, Harris is anything but left.
She didn't lose votes because she is left the people that voted trump were never gonna vote for Harris.


I mean you can blame the left all you want but when no party is representing you then it's hard to get motivated, Starmer voter numbers were terrible and he only won because the tories had power and made a mess. Western politics have to come to terms that a real left is forming and the bigger that gets the more that needs to be factored by centralists

Harris was in the lead in the polls to begin with it wasn't until she started trying to pander to the right after trump stop debating that she dropped points

 

[ncurd]

Is that a cold war hangover?
The amount of communist talk over the last few months has been crazy considering the Democrats would be centre-right anywhere else in the world

I guess so? She's my age-ish a tad older so early to mid 40's. So her youth is Clinton a bit like mines Blair and it also easy as a 'kid' to turn against the government of the day. Ironically part of the reason I was Lib Dem for so long was Blair introducing tuition fees. The American's are also more two party than just about every other Western major power.

The real question is radicalisation of the youth which is happening Europe as well but the UK appears quite an outlier. Whilst Millennials tend to be strongly left-wing and showing no signs of drifting rightwards thats not happening with Zoomers in most Western countries.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

I think a lot of it comes down to the fact that Christianity is by far the dominant religion in America and Christians by their very nature are conservative people. They're not as progressive as Europe/Canada/Australia and the prospect of having a lefty woke communist female President (how she was portrayed by Team Trump) is just not something they can get on board with.

Nothing to do with Christianity it's just the amount of openly racist people is so much higher now.

I bet church numbers haven't increased

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Owen Jones practically cheering for Trump on twitter, such an odious little worm

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Owen Jones practically cheering for Trump on twitter, such an odious little worm

Yep the left eats itself

Jones ideal world is Trump and Farage in power I feel just so he can say he's right

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Maybe in the long term this might lead to some genuine changes in American democracy...

It won't history will repeat


Trump will cause social issues, higher turnout next election and a safe democrat will win.


The best that will happen is after trump I can't think of a politician with his charisma to take over

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Maybe Trump will modify the constitution to allow any US citizen, and not just natural born, to become president and Musk will have a crack
I could see Don Jr having a pop, but I feel like people see through how much of a weasel he is, he doesn't have the same aura Trump has with his supporters

Maybe Dana White will have a go

 

[ncurd]

She didn't lose votes because she is left the people that voted trump where never gonna vote for Harris.

I mean you can blame all you want but when no party is representing you then it's hard to get motivated, Starmer voter numbers where terrible and he only because the tories had power and made a mess. Western politics have to come to terms that a real left is forming and the bigger that gets the more that needs to be factored by centralists

Harris was in the lead in the polls to begin with it wasn't until she started trying to pander to the right after trump stop debating that she dropped points

I agree with some of this Harris 100% didn't lose because she couldn't court any right wing voters they don't give a damn this what I mean by fear of the left. These people are never never going to vote for a mix raced Democratic women. She could threaten to bomb Mexico for every immigrant crossing the border and it would make no ounce to the dial.

I just don't believe being more left wing would of led to a victory either. As I said if the left can't be arsed to defeat Trump who are they going to be arsed for? (as I write this literally the only person in the office who voted for Brexit is saying how terrible this is) Then you have the issue that how far to left do you move before loosing what American laughably call moderates?