5 vital players for each country ahead of the world cup?

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Re Launch - I don't see him as a 6 per se but as long as the current situation persists whereby we have 5 terrific locks and only a couple of interesting blindsides, I'd be more than prepared to think pragmatically and do what's best for the team.

I say this despite massively disagreeing with all the other shoe-horning projects our coaches have embarked upon such as 3 full-backs, 3 6.5s etc...

 

[j'nuh]

Is there actually any specific distinction between the way England uses their locks and 6 anyway? I mean, Robshaw clearly makes more tackles and receives more ball as a link player (showing a higher number of passes and runs) than the 4/5/6, and Morgan/Vunipola are generally expected to make as many carries in the loose as is physically possible compared to the 4/5/6 (showing a high number of runs and meters made), but I hardly notice the difference between the way the 4/5/6 plays. They are all filling the same purpose in the squad. That is, mainly to make a tidy number of tackles, to ruck for own ball, to support the ball carrier and to carry in the tight...

 

[goodNumber10]

England are the only nation in the world that seem to care about a tackler at 10. It's a good skill for any player to have, but there are more important things for a 10 to have first. For example, you have tackling as one of your traits before in-game kicking, positional awareness, link play, distribution and ability to take to the line?

*sigh* whatever!

This is a list of vital players, not players who are questionably selected by the coach. If Wood picks up an injury in the run up to the WC, I'm not going to lose any sleep over it, in the same way I would if Wilson picked up an injury. (To be totally honest, I'd be quite happy for injury to force someone else into Wood's position.)

Regardless the discussion has moved on since then. I think an on form Wood is world class and our best option at 6 - you don't fair enough. Not sure why you seem to think i owe you an explanation for MY choices.

Best 6 in the world in 2012? He only played 3 games, one from the bench, that year? Ahead of Flouw? Strange choice.

Read my edit - pre-2012. Pre injury he was immense.

 

[j'nuh]

*sigh* whatever!

Regardless the discussion has moved on since then. I think an on form Wood is world class and our best option at 6 - you don't fair enough. Not sure why you seem to think i owe you an explanation for MY choices.

You should probably expect good and bad criticism on opinions that you post? I mean, I suppose we could all be yes men and slap each other on the backs for outstanding choices, but this place would probably quickly get boring if everyone agreed? Pretty sure there would be nothing to talk about then...

 

[TommiG88]

I feel wood has not advanced as much I was expecting from his early promise. I think wood was better than robshaw at first but robshaw has just moved on whilst wood hasn't so much.

 

[goodNumber10]

I feel wood has not advanced as much I was expecting from his early promise. I think wood was better than robshaw at first but robshaw has just moved on whilst wood hasn't so much.

Exactly, and for Robshaw to truly be as effective as he can be we need Wood to be back to his best, he's really important to us getting on top. Against New Zealand in "the win" he was outstanding, against Australia 2013 he was immense.

If we're not going for an out and out fetcher than we need a 6 that can allow Robshaw to roam a bit wider. We saw bits of that on Saturday, wood clicked at times and Robshaw went wider and got in early. It's a bit like why they loved Johnson the first year when Wood was injured.

 

[j'nuh]

I feel wood has not advanced as much I was expecting from his early promise. I think wood was better than robshaw at first but robshaw has just moved on whilst wood hasn't so much.

Under MJ, I wanted to see 6. Robshaw 7. Wood, with both to continue in their traditional 6 and 7 roles. When Robshaw moved to 7, he didn't lose any of the talents that he had as a 6, still makes a tremendous number of tackles and has high work rate and low penalty count, but he's gradually improved his link play and breakdown ability. I rate the hell out of the guy now. His main downfall is that people expect a fetcher at 7 and he doesn't fit that image. (Which is why I wish we would play a fetcher. Put a 6 on Robshaw's back and people will cream themselves over him.)

Wood, on the other hand, lost a lot of his breakdown ability over the years since he moved to 6, and I thought that was what made him stand out. He used to be Warburton-like at the breakdown; he wasn't fast in at the breakdown as such, like Tipuric contests breakdowns, it was that he got himself into a really powerful position and no one could move him. He seems to have lost that over time. I don't even see him try to do it any more. And he didn't really improve any other part of his game to make up for it. If he could go back to what he was like under MJ, I'd have him in a heartbeat.

 

[TheSaffycen]

I must admit I can't see how Wood can be described as vital to our world cup chances. His work in the breakdown (even at his best) isn't something that couldn't be replicated by Kvesic/Fraser honestly. It will be interesting how valued Wood is if Burgess really kicks on at 6/8 as Lancaster clearly wants Burgess to play for England asap. Also if we say look how good Wood was against NZ then Tuilagi has to be considered as a vital player.

 

[Peat]

Players whose fitness is key to England

1. Corbs
2. Tuilagi
3. Launchbury
4. Robshaw
5. Eh...

Players whose form is vital to us

1. Care
2. Ford
3. Tuilagi
4. Cole
5. Brown

 

[goodNumber10]

It will be interesting how valued Wood is if Burgess really kicks on at 6/8 as Lancaster clearly wants Burgess to play for England asap.

watch them move him to 8.

 

[j'nuh]

I must admit I can't see how Wood can be described as vital to our world cup chances. His work in the breakdown (even at his best) isn't something that couldn't be replicated by Kvesic/Fraser honestly. It will be interesting how valued Wood is if Burgess really kicks on at 6/8 as Lancaster clearly wants Burgess to play for England asap. Also if we say look how good Wood was against NZ then Tuilagi has to be considered as a vital player.

To be honest, I think that the England squad has tons of vital players:

Hartley/Webber
We need two hookers on match day, and unless Tom Youngs really steps up when coming back from injury, we are going to need these two to be fit.

Wilson/Cole
Brookes hasn't looked bad to be fair. But I think everyone knows that these are our clear first-choice tightheads.

Attwood/Lawes/Launchbury
Would be gutted if any of these three got injured in the run-in to the WC. There is a ton of respectable players that we could pick after these three, Parling and Kruis are certainly decent options, but we have three potentially world-class players here, and you can't replace that level of class.

Robshaw
Yeah, we can bring in a fetcher. But what flanker does England have that will replicate Robshaw's link play? Also think he has the highest work rate going for an English flanker.

Care
None of our 9s are perfect, but Care's the best of them. Get him in form, and we have a respectable option at 9.

Ford
Wouldn't be that important if Cips was in the squad. Do not trust Farrell nor Myler to get the backline going.

Tuilagi
The one nailed-on centre. The guy is class, but he needs to be a and not the attacking option. And he needs to be coming in on a flat pass from someone like Ford or Eastmond. Then we will see the best from him.

May
We have a lot of wing options now, but May's the only one to have nailed a shirt so far. Class in attack and defence. If he can work on his aerial game, he'd be a complete winger for me.

Brown
Because we are paper thin on fullbacks.

------

Recently I was saying that Corbs is England's best player. Get him fit and back to his best and he would also be a vital player. But, as far as I know, Corbs has barely even gotten any game time under the new scrummaging rules, that's how much he has been out of the game for the last two years. I'm not sure whether he'll get back to the point where he's clearly ahead of Marler and Mullan to be honest. Maybe marginally. But will he match Marler's loose work to make it worth it? Lots of questions over Corbs and his lack of recent match time imo. Although on top form, he would be a welcome addition to an already strong scrum!

 

[ratsapprentice]

Robshaw
Yeah, we can bring in a fetcher. But what flanker does England have that will replicate Robshaw's link play? Also think he has the highest work rate going for an English flanker.

Kvesic.

 

[CarferFragen]

For Argentina:

1 - Nicolás Sánchez
2 - Agustín Creevy
3 - Juan Martín Fernández Lobbe
4 - Marcos Ayerza
5 - Juan Figallo

 

[Ospreylian]

For Wales:

Taulupe Faletau (I'm not sure I've ever seen this guy have a bad game, at least not in a Wales jersey. He is the unsung hero. Dan Baker is shaping up to be a great replacement, but I fear that Wales would miss Faletau's incredible work-rate if he was not present at the WC)
Dan Biggar (the Autumn tests showed that if Biggar gets injured there are currently no obvious replacements that would fit seamlessly into this current Welsh set-up. It's a mystery how Priestland is still anywhere near the Welsh set up by now, Hook is up and down, Anscombe obviously hasn't played enough for club yet so time will tell, I would love to see Morgan get another shot at some point, Sam Davies too but needs a lot of getting up to speed internationally, Patchell has looked patchy (see what I did there) in recent times, there's always Owen Williams I suppose)
Rhys Webb (this is a similar situation to fly half, no obvious back-ups. Phillips had a shocking time during the Autumn. Rhodri Williams has potential but I feel is too much of a live wire and unreliable on the big stage for the moment. Lloyd Williams.... well, just Lloyd Williams. Martin Roberts... meh. If Gareth Davies hadn't got injured there could be a lovely Webb/Davies battle for the 9 jersey going on right now, let's hope he can pull it together in time for the WC. What has happened to Knoyle? Let's start a petition to get Peel at the WC )
Alun Wyn Jones (possibly the single most vital player in the squad. Forms the back bone of the forwards, and the team as a whole. His passion is unmatched, he is an inspiring leader, and a partnership of Charteris-Ball just does not have anywhere near the same bite to it)
Leigh Halfpenny (I think Leigh has reminded us this Autumn why he is so valuable to Wales. He might not do anything flashy these days, which is a shame and something I think he should work on, but boy has he saved our skin time-after-time. That tackle on Etzebeth was potentially match-winning, and to see that kind of a hit being made from someone so short on such a giant was pleasing. To have two solid kicking options around the park is a big advantage too. I just feel that if Liam Williams keeps up his form he hopefully will be able to push Cuthbert out of his right wing spot. But if Halfpenny is injured before the WC, I do fear that it will be Williams at fullback and Cuthbert on the wing, and I just have run out of patience with Cuthbert, especially in defense. He's just not up to standards at the moment and is probably being selected on past glories)

 

[chippieolamus]

Have you not noticed the massive increase in effectiveness of our set-piece this series, since Attwood has come in?

This is the first series where our maul and scrum has been consistently dominant... in fact, has had any real dominance for a long time.

True, but I just feel that Launchbury is too crucial to leave out. I know people are saying that we should play him at 6, but I'm not sure whether he has experience there?

 

[ratsapprentice]

I'm not suggesting leaving Launchbury out at all - he comes straight back in, Lawes moves to the bench.

 

[j'nuh]

For Wales:

Taulupe Faletau (I'm not sure I've ever seen this guy have a bad game, at least not in a Wales jersey. He is the unsung hero. Dan Baker is shaping up to be a great replacement, but I fear that Wales would miss Faletau's incredible work-rate if he was not present at the WC)
Dan Biggar (the Autumn tests showed that if Biggar gets injured there are currently no obvious replacements that would fit seamlessly into this current Welsh set-up. It's a mystery how Priestland is still anywhere near the Welsh set up by now, Hook is up and down, Anscombe obviously hasn't played enough for club yet so time will tell, I would love to see Morgan get another shot at some point, Sam Davies too but needs a lot of getting up to speed internationally, Patchell has looked patchy (see what I did there) in recent times, there's always Owen Williams I suppose)
Rhys Webb (this is a similar situation to fly half, no obvious back-ups. Phillips had a shocking time during the Autumn. Rhodri Williams has potential but I feel is too much of a live wire and unreliable on the big stage for the moment. Lloyd Williams.... well, just Lloyd Williams. Martin Roberts... meh. If Gareth Davies hadn't got injured there could be a lovely Webb/Davies battle for the 9 jersey going on right now, let's hope he can pull it together in time for the WC. What has happened to Knoyle? Let's start a petition to get Peel at the WC )
Alun Wyn Jones (possibly the single most vital player in the squad. Forms the back bone of the forwards, and the team as a whole. His passion is unmatched, he is an inspiring leader, and a partnership of Charteris-Ball just does not have anywhere near the same bite to it)
Leigh Halfpenny (I think Leigh has reminded us this Autumn why he is so valuable to Wales. He might not do anything flashy these days, which is a shame and something I think he should work on, but boy has he saved our skin time-after-time. That tackle on Etzebeth was potentially match-winning, and to see that kind of a hit being made from someone so short on such a giant was pleasing. To have two solid kicking options around the park is a big advantage too. I just feel that if Liam Williams keeps up his form he hopefully will be able to push Cuthbert out of his right wing spot. But if Halfpenny is injured before the WC, I do fear that it will be Williams at fullback and Cuthbert on the wing, and I just have run out of patience with Cuthbert, especially in defense. He's just not up to standards at the moment and is probably being selected on past glories)

I know he's only just come on the scene, but what about Samson Lee? I don't think he's Wales' best player, but I think he's the most vital for Wales behind Webb and Biggar. Would be very worried about Rhodri Jones starting at tighthead.

 

[chippieolamus]

I'm not suggesting leaving Launchbury out at all - he comes straight back in, Lawes moves to the bench.

Hmmm. I don't know, personally I think the reason for our lineout improvement in the last 1-2 years is because of Lawes. The idea of Launchbury at 6 interests me however, I'd like to see how a back 5 of Lawes, Attwood, Launch, Robshaw and Morgan would do.

 

[psychic duck]

I know he's only just come on the scene, but what about Samson Lee? I don't think he's Wales' best player, but I think he's the most vital for Wales behind Webb and Biggar. Would be very worried about Rhodri Jones starting at tighthead.

He's more vital than either of those two.

 

[Ospreylian]

I know he's only just come on the scene, but what about Samson Lee? I don't think he's Wales' best player, but I think he's the most vital for Wales behind Webb and Biggar. Would be very worried about Rhodri Jones starting at tighthead.

Yeah, tbh the last position was a toss up between Lee and Halfpenny tbh. Lee is another underrated one, a bit like Faletau. He had a quietly superb Autumn and has nailed the shirt. Having said that I would be very disappointed but not devastated if he were to get injured before the WC, because I think Rhodri can do a job there. Also, I still think Adam Jones has a bit more left in the tank and I think he could probably still hold his own if we needed him too.