[2021 Six Nations] England Squad

[TRF_Olyy]

England fans: We want to try a different flyhalf to Ford/Farrell and we want Robson to get at least half an hour

England fans: No...wait

 

[ncurd]

England fans: We want to try a different flyhalf to Ford/Farrell and we want Robson to get at least half an hour

England fans: No...wait

 

[g6mcg]

If you buy into the argument that Jones is solely targeting 2023, is it worth it?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

If you buy into the argument that Jones is solely targeting 2023, is it worth it?

I've never bought into that argument tbh

I can understand people saying we're not using fancy backs moves because we're focusing on defence or our kicking game or whatever, but we're severely lacking in real basic skills.
Like, just because we're not focusing on attack doesn't mean multi-multi-cap internationals should not be able to pass the ball to hand etc.

There's something really wrong in the side atm, and I don't think it's 4D chess mind games from EJ - that excuse just sounds like when everyone was saying Schmidt was hiding his cards ready to release his supreme game plan at the RWC

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

I've never bought into that argument tbh

I can understand people saying we're not using fancy backs moves because we're focusing on defence or our kicking game or whatever, but we're severely lacking in real basic skills.
Like, just because we're not focusing on attack doesn't mean multi-multi-cap internationals should not be able to pass the ball to hand etc.

There's something really wrong in the side atm, and I don't think it's 4D chess mind games from EJ - that excuse just sounds like when everyone was saying Schmidt was hiding his cards ready to release his supreme game plan at the RWC

This.

There is a world of difference between not revealing specific strike moves and simply not being able to compete in any meaningful way at all. Strike moves don't just come off the training ground and work, they need to be put into practice in games. Hell we aren't even doing the tactics from 2016 of not being all that flash but simply being extremely difficult to beat, which is what you would aim for if you were trying to keep attack moves hidden. Every aspect of England's play is atrocious and our defence has got worse year on year under Jones.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

There were injuries today and Slade and Malins were ruled out. We were already without the likes of Lawes, Launch, Underhill and Willis. Kruis' stock has also risen by the game.

But that doesn't excuse how incoherent we've been over the tournament and since the last RWC. It doesn't excuse Jones for sticking with the old guard and not making sure the back ups are sufficiently experienced. It doesn't excuse some of his bizarre decisions or what seems to be from the outside poor man management.

We do have good players although maybe not as good, or in the depth, that we've liked to think. But when good players serially underperform, it's a pretty good sign that the coach isn't getting through to them - they're either over complicating things or have lost the dressing room. Here I reckon there's a bit of both.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Most issues with personnel are of our own doing, though - I have very minimal sympathy

Halfbacks ****? Didn't look at replacing them
8 ****? Didn't look at playing the form 8 in the Prem (/European player of the year) - who could have also gone to 6 if we needed a replacement there
Lock I have some more sympathy with because we were missing a lot, and Hill was due his starts anyway, based on club performances

There's issues with the scrum but that's a trickier area. Marler is very easily our best scrummaging loosehead, but is unavailable - Genge probably should have gotten some starts, but I'm not entirely convinced by his scrummaging at international level. Obano the same - should've been used more, but don't think he's the answer. Mako shouldn't have been such heavy favourite at 1 considering his game time and form, though.
I don't think there's a 1/17 combo in the world that can handle the Furlong/Porter double whammy

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

A loose head that couldn't scrum, a lock who doesn't know the rules (maybe two of them), an 8 that can't break the line, a 9 that can't pass, a 10 that has no composure, a 12 who can't step, run or pass off both hands, a 15 who can't catch or tackle.

That sums up what Jones chose to select.

 

[Wendigo7]

A loose head that couldn't scrum, a lock who doesn't know the rules (maybe two of them), an 8 that can't break the line, a 9 that can't pass, a 10 that has no composure, a 12 who can't step, run or pass off both hands, a 15 who can't catch or tackle.

That sums up what Jones chose to select.

Who would you select instead then? :S

 

[Reiser99]

Who would you select instead then? :S

I feel like ripping into England and EJ tomorrow, but in answer to this I'll ask another question. Do you stick with players that are shown to be struggling and hope they come good or do you give other unproven players a chance? I feel that EJ could easily have dropped Mako once he saw how out of form the Sarries players were, but he chose to bring him in knowing he would probably struggle. While I get there are no obvious players that are proven we will never know if Jones keeps sticking with his favourites regardless of their form and all it does is screw England over when they aren't as then we have no other options as no one else has been given a chance.

 

[Crash Hamster]

England finished tournament better than we started - Jones

England head coach Eddie Jones says Ireland were too good for his side today after a 32-18 defeat in their final game of the 2021 Six Nations.

www.bbc.co.uk

Apparently we're in the process of changing the team...

So, I say again, EJ had a free shot at this; he had the ideal excuse not to pick Sarries players; how much worse could we have done?

But at least we finished better than we started.

WTF, FFS and bar.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Who would you select instead then? :S

I mentioned above that I have some sympathy at loosehead and lock, but we have plenty of options at 8/9/10 to go at
12 we should've tried Lawrence properly, and if we wanted someone with some more experience/a better distributor then looked at Devoto (ideally EJ wouldn't have binned Redpath),
15 we should've looked at Watson a while ago - sympathy towards to the late change today, but with the way Daly has been playing we should've put Watson at 15 and A.N Other on the wing (plenty of good wings in the prem atm, just none of them have been looked at by England) - even Marchant on the wing would've been a viable option really

 

[TRF_Olyy]

England finished tournament better than we started - Jones

England head coach Eddie Jones says Ireland were too good for his side today after a 32-18 defeat in their final game of the 2021 Six Nations.

www.bbc.co.uk

Apparently we're in the process of changing the team...

So, I say again, EJ had a free shot at this; he had the ideal excuse not to pick Sarries players; how much worse could we have done?

But at least we finished better than we started.

WTF, FFS and bar.

That headline has made be unreasonably angry

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Who would you select instead then? :S

Easy, the form players with the sarries lot on the bench for the Scotland game.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Dupont Dupont, my kingdom for Dupont!

 

[Wendigo7]

To be fair his interview assessment is fairly spot on to me there. I'm massively disappointed but, I'm not in disagreement with him.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Given my new found hobby for making charts, here is another:



Tries for, against and difference. Again since 2016, with an exception in 2019 we are seeing a steady and consistent decline in the try difference under Jones. Everything from points difference to try difference indicates a downwards trend under Jones. He is destroying the team.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

England taking the (potential) grandslam off of France is silver lining on the **** sandwich that was this year

 

[Crash Hamster]

"14-man Ireland thump dismal England" is the headline on the BBC website. While the BBC don't always call rugby correctly, that's a better summary than Jones'.

 

[Wendigo7]

RFU concerns me at the moment. I don't like what their doing at senior level and you don't hear anything about whether Jones is under pressure or not.

I don't think he's under any at all whatsoever.