[2019 Six Nations] England Squad

[MikeTheNative]

I think selection was fine for England today, I don't understand why Jones doesn't trust his bench though. You could see the tide turning in the 2nd half but Robson and Ford who could have made an impact in attack where left on the bench.

 

[Chief Pete]

EJ obviously does not trust LCD (maybe with good reason) and my impression is he select's him simply because he has to have a hooker on the bench, he's banking on Hartley coming back and hitting the ground running for the RWC...

Also think that he picked Robson over Care but weirdly if he had Care on the bench today he'd have brought him on...

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Just seen on Twitter that Hartley has had another knee surgery that's added 12 weeks to his recovery

I'd be surprised if he plays again in general let alone plays in the world cup.

Need to look at other options at hooker, LCD isn't trusted and, frankly, has never looked up to international level in his cameos

 

[Chief Pete]

Need to look at other options at hooker

Who would you put next in line?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Who would you put next in line?

Literally no idea.
We persisted with Hartley too much - he was clearly first choice so we should have been giving proper game time to others instead of getting them 90s off the bench.


Taylor should've been up there but is almost constantly injured. There's the Worcester(?) Hooker who's been around the squad.

It's a bit of a mess tbh, if George goes down we've got a guy who isn't trusted at all and then.....who knows

 

[Every Time Ref]

Just seen on Twitter that Hartley has had another knee surgery that's added 12 weeks to his recovery

I'd be surprised if he plays again in general let alone plays in the world cup.

Need to look at other options at hooker, LCD isn't trusted and, frankly, has never looked up to international level in his cameos

Don't overreact, 12 weeks is just a bogstandard ban to him

 

[Jashay]

Literally no idea.
We persisted with Hartley too much - he was clearly first choice so we should have been giving proper game time to others instead of getting them 90s off the bench.


Taylor should've been up there but is almost constantly injured. There's the Worcester(?) Hooker who's been around the squad.

It's a bit of a mess tbh, if George goes down we've got a guy who isn't trusted at all and then.....who knows

Singleton, right? Seems like a decent shout

 

[Chief Pete]

Literally no idea.
We persisted with Hartley too much - he was clearly first choice so we should have been giving proper game time to others instead of getting them 90s off the bench.


Taylor should've been up there but is almost constantly injured. There's the Worcester(?) Hooker who's been around the squad.

It's a bit of a mess tbh, if George goes down we've got a guy who isn't trusted at all and then.....who knows

On ability it's Taylor, if it's not and Hartley is a no go then it's George, LCD and a possibly uncapped 3rd choice, the only guy's I can think of who are doing well in the prem are Singleton and Mikey Haywood, not ideal but as you say we're badly underdeveloped here.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Webber is on fire this season (would definitely take him over Haywayd), but that's in a "Oh ****, literally all of our hookers ate at that dodgy sushi restaurant last night and now we need to fly someone in to start tomorrow" type of situation, I wouldn't bring him into the EPS

 

[Chief Pete]

Webber is on fire this season (would definitely take him over Haywayd), but that's in a "Oh ****, literally all of our hookers ate at that dodgy sushi restaurant last night and now we need to fly someone in to start tomorrow" type of situation, I wouldn't bring him into the EPS

Think Haywood is injured anyway...Going to be Singleton if Hartley out.

 

[ratsapprentice]

On ability it's Taylor, if it's not and Hartley is a no go then it's George, LCD and a possibly uncapped 3rd choice, the only guy's I can think of who are doing well in the prem are Singleton and Mikey Haywood, not ideal but as you say we're badly underdeveloped here.

On ability it's LCD. Comfortably. By, like... a really, really long way.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

On ability it's LCD. Comfortably. By, like... a really, really long way.

....really?

At best they're even, but Taylor has better darts, scrummaging and breakdown play. LCD quicker, bit higher workrate and a better carrier, but to suggest hes a really really long way better is crazy.
Especially considering his poor lineout and anonymous England caps.

 

[Pom in Exile]

Literally no idea.
We persisted with Hartley too much - he was clearly first choice so we should have been giving proper game time to others instead of getting them 90s off the bench.

Taylor should've been up there but is almost constantly injured. There's the Worcester(?) Hooker who's been around the squad.

It's a bit of a mess tbh, if George goes down we've got a guy who isn't trusted at all and then.....who knows

Bit like scrum half really

 

[Chief Pete]

On ability it's LCD. Comfortably. By, like... a really, really long way.

I was talking 3rd choice behind George and LCD, if Hartley's missing.

 

[Bill]

Just seen on Twitter that Hartley has had another knee surgery that's added 12 weeks to his recovery

I'd be surprised if he plays again in general let alone plays in the world cup.

Need to look at other options at hooker, LCD isn't trusted and, frankly, has never looked up to international level in his cameos

this is very, very bad news.

 

[ratsapprentice]

....really?

Yes.

Throwing is the only area I see his competitors being better than him.

Taylor's great.

 

[Scotty]

Last week May was our attacking weapon and then this week we kicked so often to nowells side. Cannot fault any of the players for their defence, the tackle count was unreal, Curry was everywhere and u cant think of anyone who noticably didnt put in a shift in defence.

But that level of defence for phase after phase is not sustainable, Wales used iy against us, getting knocked about but tiring us out and getting the bennefits at the end.

Our defence is fine we now for 2 weeks need to work on our attack, ball in hand or kicking we need 2 weeks of getting it there or we will tire ourselves out in defence and give the ball back to them in attack which is what we did yesterday IMO.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Genge sitting out some training with an ankle issue. Doesn't sound serious, but we don't need him to go down.

Given that he didn't come on until so late, wonder if it was worse than we were led to believe.

Not generally a huge fan of emptying the bench for the sake of it, but yesterday it needed to be done.

 

[MikeTheNative]

Last week May was our attacking weapon and then this week we kicked so often to nowells side. Cannot fault any of the players for their defence, the tackle count was unreal, Curry was everywhere and u cant think of anyone who noticably didnt put in a shift in defence.

But that level of defence for phase after phase is not sustainable, Wales used iy against us, getting knocked about but tiring us out and getting the bennefits at the end.

Our defence is fine we now for 2 weeks need to work on our attack, ball in hand or kicking we need 2 weeks of getting it there or we will tire ourselves out in defence and give the ball back to them in attack which is what we did yesterday IMO.

England's defence was very good. So good in fact that Wales didn't even really bother to attack with ball in hand, they played a number of phases until there was a chance to kick. Jones talks a lot about kicking should be 'attacking the space'. Wales covered this very well yesterday so there wasn't really much but Youngs and Farrell kept kicking it straight at Williams and Anscombe who was always in the back field helping out.

 

[Bill]

A few thoughts I've had since the game :

1. Sinckler and Curry are very good players.
2. Moon is a good prop, but not good enough to win 1/4, 1/2, finals at WC, so EJ might have to send in a special request to a certain Mr Marler.
3. I hope big Court's injury doesn't rule him out of the WC. We need all 4 of our top class locks.
4. BV isn't as effective as he used to be (think of the first half against france in that high scoring game in the last round a few years ago where for a long while it seemed to be him against France with him winning). He needs to put the weight back on and be used for 50-60 minutes then replaced.
5. Although he bottled one key pass, I thought Youngs did ok. In particular when he showed the speed of mind to get over the goal line to avoid a scrum 5 wales. Came out of the game pretty even in terms of credit/debit for me.
6. Farrell has had an absolute nightmare under pressure. forward passes, charge downs, kicks out on the full etc. For me this has got to be EJ's main concern after yesterday's game. Suggests that he isn't capable of performing in WC 1/4, 1/2, final, which presents a major problem. Suspect EJ will brush it under the carpet and pretend it didn't happen, in which case we might as well start cheering for the other home nations already.
7. EJ obviously took the approach of backing the guys he'd selected to see the game through. This is all very well and good, but it was blatantly obvious that the whole team was stuck in a kind of paralysed quick sand throughout the 2nd half, and were incapable of turning it round.
8. If England are going to have a chance at the WC, they will need all their big players fit, and will need to find a way of getting momentum back in games after it goes. They are clearly some way off the level we hoped they were after the first 2 rounds.