[2017 RBS Six Nations] Round 1: England vs. France (04/02/2017)

[TheSaffycen]

Missed the whole second half on a call out, on the radio they said Itoje done well when he went second row and Teo was good when Farrell went 10? Don't know how accurate that was

 

[Peat]

Missed the whole second half on a call out, on the radio they said Itoje done well when he went second row and Teo was good when Farrell went 10? Don't know how accurate that was

Ran straight and reasonably hard, save for one good line for the try. He was good but nothing more. Thought Itoje kept on playing roughly the same to be honest.

 

[Lé Ddanno]

Utterly ****ing appalling, the entire pack was anonymous and gave the rest nothing to work with. Breakdown work was non existent.
That said, the French were sublimely quick at every ruck and really caught us cold.

Never thought I'd say it, but Haskell needs to start to give us a bit of dog or, if you like, clean up the mess that Robshaw would usually deal with. There was a real difference when he arrived.

Rant off; I'll still take ugly wins and finding a way to win. I just hate having to watch it when I know we're capable of something better

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Referee had a rulebook for England and a different one for France. Held both sides to different standards. Kept England in it.

WTF first French 3 points was after a blatant forward pass, England pinged for "diving" on the ball out of the ruck (never heard of that before), another penalty. Ref was bad but not biased, certainly not in favour of England.

 

[Lé Ddanno]

Referee had a rulebook for England and a different one for France. Held both sides to different standards. Kept England in it.

No.

 

[munstermuffin]

A team that plays on the limit and often crosses it...

And that answers my question to you by????????

I can't ask my question any simpler and you still can't answer?
I asked simply how ref was a disgrace or got law wrong?

Your replies are
1. Try insult me
2. Say I don't support Munster
3. Because they cross line.

Guess that in itself is answer.

 

[munstermuffin]

Referee had a rulebook for England and a different one for France. Held both sides to different standards. Kept England in it.

To be fair he punished England at times and was accurate in his judgements. I'm not saying he was 100% perfect but I didn't think he was a factor in result

 

[jackass11]

corny just annoyed that ireland lost so spouting all sorts - ref had no clue at times about either team!

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Muffin, I might not use the word disgraceful but I didn't like his interpretation much. Basically right now I feel that referees are seeing themselves as simple conduits for world rugby directives without any ability to interpret. And ok so I get that's the idea of directives but in all previous downward messages we have seen referees carry them out to varying degrees of zealousness, and I think there are justifiable interpretations from a referee which respect the important of safety in the game whilst also allowing for the role of bad luck and and context. At the moment no officials are feeling able to stick their head above the parapet and allow for a bit more common sense but eventually one of the more senior referees probably will and then maybe it will happen increasingly.

 

[die_mole]

Muffin, I might not use the word disgraceful but I didn't like his interpretation much. Basically right now I feel that referees are seeing themselves as simple conduits for world rugby directives without any ability to interpret. I think there are justifiable interpretations from a referee which respect the important of safety in the game whilst also allowing for the role of bad luck and and context. At the moment no officials are feeling able to stick their head above the parapet and allow for a bit more common sense but eventually one of the more senior referees probably will and then maybe it will happen increasingly.

cause if they don't follow the directives they stop getting games

 

[McTallshort]

Missed Robshaw and Billy V.

Haskell has to start and Itoji is a 2nd row not back row

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

cause if they don't follow the directives they stop getting games

I hear you but don't believe it's so simple. I think there was sufficient ambiguity in the factors e.g fickou momentum and the fact that may was simply pulling horizontally to make a simple penalty a defensible decision. I don't agree that he had no choice at all or that without a card he would have been off games for the remainder of the tournament

 

[jackass11]

Ref didn't favour one side so not sure what the conversation is about!

 

[munstermuffin]

Sorry Henry the disgrace bot was Tommi referencing ref. I respect your argument. Your right in that some refs don't understand why they have to carry out a law but they're clear on what they've to do.
If they don't they will be dropped but as I said that ref today is highly regarded and will likely get Lions test.
And I'd say if you slow down game and look at game pure neutral I'd say you'd see ref got 85-90% of calls perfect

 

[Reiser99]

Having just got back from the pub, Itoje is better in the second row (however if he keeps improving what a player he will be), Wood is the past and if we keep playing him, we will just go backwards. Overall, I just keep thinking the saying that champions know how to to win ugly, because that was as ugly as it gets.

 

[corny]

WTF first French 3 points was after a blatant forward pass, England pinged for "diving" on the ball out of the ruck (never heard of that before), another penalty. Ref was bad but not biased, certainly not in favour of England.

France were on the receiving end far more imo.

If you watch the game back watch how he refereed the maul and the scrum. Matt Mullan came on, collapsed two scrums and won two penalties as a result. England were illegal at almost maul coming in from the side. Got away with every time. France did it once and got pinged. Marler was under pressure the whole game and yet the ref picked out the French player for causing the 'instability'. The ruck? He was itching to penalise French players for holding on even though sometimes English hands weren't even near the ball. Itoje won one IIRC. He didn't ref France like that. In fact i remember a French player over the ball for an age before he eventually won it. Obvious holding, no quick whistle.

Like i say all this removed the most platforms for France into the game. For England? Well Matt Mullan falling flat on his face let Farrell establish field position for Teo's try.

Home ground, weak and poor ref. It happens.

 

[Every Time Ref]

I can't blame the ref for the Jonny May incident, he did his job and applied the laws. It's the laws themselves, and more than that the culture of the sport, which makes that tackle a yellow card which I am angry at.

On Itoje - one poor game at 6 as part of the worst team performance by far he has ever been part of is not enough to write him off as an international flanker

 

[munstermuffin]

I can't blame the ref for the Jonny May incident, he did his job and applied the laws. It's the laws themselves, and more than that the culture of the sport, which makes that tackle a yellow card which I am angry at.

On Itoje - one poor game at 6 as part of the worst team performance by far he has ever been part of is not enough to write him off as an international flanker

Well that is a completely different argument and I agree. There does need to be a rethink on some things.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

France were on the receiving end far more imo.

If you watch the game back watch how he refereed the maul and the scrum. Matt Mullan came on, collapsed two scrums and won two penalties as a result. England were illegal at almost maul coming in from the side. Got away with every time. France did it once and got pinged. Marler was under pressure the whole game and yet the ref picked out the French player for causing the 'instability'. The ruck? He was itching to penalise French players for holding on even though sometimes English hands weren't even near the ball. Itoje won one IIRC. He didn't ref France like that. In fact i remember a French player over the ball for an age before he eventually won it. Obvious holding, no quick whistle.

Like i say all this removed the most platforms for France into the game. For England? Well Matt Mullan falling flat on his face let Farrell establish field position for Teo's try.

Home ground, weak and poor ref. It happens.

ie you are looking at this through biased specs. He gave 2 penalties against England that weren't and gifted France 6 points. He yellow carded May for the softest of "beyond the horizontal" cases. He let the French lie on the wrong side of the ruck all the time and let more than one French incident of crossing go unanswered. To try to claim he influenced the result in favour of England is laughable. This is sounding a lot like you being bitter the Scots beat you so finding some way to justify the fact we didn't have an upset like you did.

 

[Reiser99]

I think Itoje can play back row, however he does need more experience and to have a better pack. However just remember his age. If (big if) he keeps improving he will be world class and possibly one of the best players ever. He's so athletic.