[2016 Super Rugby] SA Transfers & General Discussion

[TRF_stormer2010]

Will any of those forwards be first choice though? I can see only Maku, Marvin and Lizo get game time and only off the bench or as injury/rotation replacement.

Gelant, Ulengo and Paige should probably start in the backs in any case so great. You guys really have depth at center. I can't see Stighling getting a game not with you being able to shift Kriel back at 15 and have Odendaal and Serfontein at center. There is also Dries Swanepoel who is probably going to be a talent wasted on the bench if he even makes it to the bench.

 

[TRF_heineken]

Will any of those forwards be first choice though? I can see only Maku, Marvin and Lizo get game time and only off the bench or as injury/rotation replacement.

Gelant, Ulengo and Paige should probably start in the backs in any case so great. You guys really have depth at center. I can't see Stighling getting a game not with you being able to shift Kriel back at 15 and have Odendaal and Serfontein at center. There is also Dries Swanepoel who is probably going to be a talent wasted on the bench if he even makes it to the bench.

Well Werner Kruger is now moving to Europe, which opens up a spot for Ox as he can play at both sides of the scrum. Maku will be the back-up to Strauss as Visagie is still injured at the moment. Marvin Orie will be the number 1 pick I think at lock. Of all the locks in the squad, he got the most game time in the warm-up and even captained the team in Zimbabwe.

Stighling impressed last week, but yeah, I think he and Swanepoel are the most likely of players to miss on the 23-man squads for matches and will probably come in if someone gets injured.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

Suprised by what you said about Orie, then checked your squad again and I can't believe the amount of quality locks you guys have gone through since the 'blood brothers' (and Rossouw) left!

 

[TRF_heineken]

Suprised by what you said about Orie, then checked your squad again and I can't believe the amount of quality locks you guys have gone through since the 'blood brothers' (and Rossouw) left!

Yup!

Last year was a real punch in the gonads for the Bulls. Paul Willemse and Jacques Du Plessis got offers to play in the NH and Victor "retired" and went to Northampton. The only lock left was Hattingh that played Super Rugby.

But

RG Snyman and Jonathan Jenkins who were the Lock partners of the U20 Bokkies came together to the Bulls and Orie has been soaring in the age-group levels. Then we also have Irne Herbst who played for Tuks last year and was part of the U20 Bokkies that won the trophy alongside Jan Serfontein.

We certainly lost quality in that position, but I'm very excited about our young prospects. And I hope Orie shows you what he can do. For a lock he has some insane ball skills.

 

[unrated]

Every year i hope the injury bug wont catch in pre season, and every year it strikes. If its not players that go overseas it is the injuries from preventing our squads every year from reaching their potential best first XV.
Luckily it forces us to continuously bring new talent up to Super Rugby.

Jacques Potgieter looks like he is going to miss Two months of Super rugby

 

[TRF_heineken]

Every year i hope the injury bug wont catch in pre season, and every year it strikes. If its not players that go overseas it is the injuries from preventing our squads every year from reaching their potential best first XV.
Luckily it forces us to continuously bring new talent up to Super Rugby.

Jacques Potgieter looks like he is going to miss Two months of Super rugby

yeah. I also saw that Facebook post of him in the hospital with his stunning girlfriend by his side. Sounds like he's out for 8 weeks.

 

[TRF_heineken]

http://www.sport24.co.za/Rugby/SuperRugby/lood-de-jager-to-join-bulls-20160705

I have mixed feelings about this signing. I am a big fan of Jake Harper... errr, I mean Lood, but it concerns me that he's coming to the Bulls, for the sake of the steps we have taked to get our youngsters battle hardened and performing at Super Rugby level.

RG Snyman and Jason Jenkins have been amazing for the Bulls this season and at 20 years old, both of them have bright futures ahead. Perhaps Lood is a replacement for Grant Hattingh, who is off to Japan, and my guess is that Marvin Orie (who has been a real dissapointment for me personally) is not up to standard as was expected.

Glad to have a Springbok staying in SA for another year, as I would've thought there was a bunch of lucrative offers for him from abroad as well. The 12-month contract is something that can be amended in future, so first step of luring him to Pretoria is done.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

It'll be interesting to see how Lood fares for the Bulls. The Stormers are full but I feel he'd do better in a coastal team rather than a Highveld team. The Bulls are sorted for locks now. Wonder what the Lions will do next season. Franco Mostert fitted their game so well. I understand though despite him already being unveiled he is desputing his contract and is looking to stay at the Lions or something to that effect?

If Mostert moves off we are in a weird situation in that between the Stormers and Bulls we'd have the country's top 6 locks (locally based) IMO even if the likes of Snyman Shickerling and Jenkins are green. Man, we have a ton of lock talent overseas. Its seems a Top 14 team is not a Top 14 team without at least 1 Saffa lock. We have all of Bakkies Botha, Paul Willemse, Jacques du Plessis, Jandre Marais, Gerhard Mostert, Franco Mostert, Franco van der Merwe, Flip van der Merwe, Francois van der Merwe, Juandre Kruger and Andries Bekker AWOL who are all test rugby level locks. Nevermind Quinn Roux and Bernard le Roux who are already playing test rugby for other countries.

 

[TRF_heineken]

It'll be interesting to see how Lood fares for the Bulls. The Stormers are full but I feel he'd do better in a coastal team rather than a Highveld team. The Bulls are sorted for locks now. Wonder what the Lions will do next season. Franco Mostert fitted their game so well. I understand though despite him already being unveiled he is desputing his contract and is looking to stay at the Lions or something to that effect?

If Mostert moves off we are in a weird situation in that between the Stormers and Bulls we'd have the country's top 6 locks (locally based) IMO even if the likes of Snyman Shickerling and Jenkins are green. Man, we have a ton of lock talent overseas. Its seems a Top 14 team is not a Top 14 team without at least 1 Saffa lock. We have all of Bakkies Botha, Paul Willemse, Jacques du Plessis, Jandre Marais, Gerhard Mostert, Franco Mostert, Franco van der Merwe, Flip van der Merwe, Francois van der Merwe, Juandre Kruger and Andries Bekker AWOL who are all test rugby level locks. Nevermind Quinn Roux and Bernard le Roux who are already playing test rugby for other countries.

It was Franco Mostert's wedding this past weekend. Maybe there is still a chance of him staying, and that's why the Lions maybe pulled out of the contest for Lood, especially now that Mostert is also a springbok.

As for Andries Bekker, he has mentioned before that he still has ambitions to play for the Boks again. So perhaps we'll see him back in SA sooner than we think.

 

[TRF_heineken]

http://www.sport24.co.za/Rugby/SuperRugby/bulls-open-cheque-book-for-kings-hooker-20160720

Bulls have signed Edgar Marutlule and Shaun Adendorff.

Great move to sign the hooker, who will in all likelihood get regular game time in the Currie Cup when Strauss is away with the Bokke.

Happy to see Adendorff back at the Bulls too, he was one of those guys that just had something to him that made me want to watch what he can do as a player.

 

[Bull]

I'm also not too convinced about the signing of Lood because we have 2 very good locks but maybe the Bulls are aiming for another Danie, Bakkies, Victor combo.

 

[WaterboySA]

If Lood fits into the team, he will be the nr1 lock choice. This will give him the self believe to be the nr 1 lock in the Bok team again.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

I'm also not too convinced about the signing of Lood because we have 2 very good locks but maybe the Bulls are aiming for another Danie, Bakkies, Victor combo.

Well they had it with Paul Willemse, RG Snyman and Jacques du Plessis. I understand the Bulls couldn't offer the two that left the same type of money Montpellier did and they probably weren't gonna stay around with Etzebeth, PSdT and De Jager having the inside track for the Bokke so no lure there. Its just something we (the SA SR teams and fans) have to accept. It does make one a tad bitter though looking at the Top 14 where the pair of Willemse and Du Plessis are the top lock pair in the tournament. WP Nel and CJ Stander are probably the premier players in their positions and the likes of Johan Goosen, Ashley Johnson, Francois Louw, Ruan Pienaar etc etc etc etc etc are key players for their respective teams.

 

[TRF_heineken]

I'm also not too convinced about the signing of Lood because we have 2 very good locks but maybe the Bulls are aiming for another Danie, Bakkies, Victor combo.

With Lood coming to the Bulls, and Orie leaving to the Lions, was I think a planned move for a long time. Remember Orie wanted to leave the Bulls 2 years ago, and since then he has struggled to get regular game time, and is being overshadowed by the new incumbents.

It seems to me that the Bulls are starting with something that could possibly be something great for the future. They are making in my opinion great signings for next year to build on what has been in my view a pretty successful campaign for such a young squad.

Our team could possibly look like this next year:

1. Trevor Nyakane
2. Adriaan Strauss
3. Lizo Qoboka
4. Lood De Jager
5. RG Snyman
6. Jannes Kirsten
7. Jacques Potgieter
8. Arno Botha

9. Rudy Paige
10. Handre Pollard
11. Jamba Ulengo
12. Jan Serfontein
13. Jesse Kriel
14. Travis Ismaiel
15. Warwick Gelant

16. Edgar marutlule
17. Pierre Schoeman
18. Marcel van der Merwe (if available)
19. Jason Jenkins
20. Lappies Labuschagne
21. Piet van Zyl
22. Tiaan Schoeman
23. SP Marais

That is a pretty good team if you ask me.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

I wish I could speculate but while the Bulls have 8 players confirmed as leaving and 4 confirmed as being signed up the Stormers only have a few leaving and none coming in so far so very little movement. That said we should look quite a different outfit next year after the 7s.

Confirmed as leaving for the 2017 season:
Vincent Koch
Schalk Burger
Nic Groom
Jean Kleyn

We'll certainly miss the depth and experience of both Burger and Koch but we have more than able direct replacements if we can keep fit. Groom is already not a 1st choice starter.

So far the matchday 23 would probably look something like:

1 Oli Kebble (I am hoping we might lure Kitshof back dangling the Bok carrot and something can be organized about getting him released)
2 Bongi Mbonambi
3 Frans Malherbe
4 Eben Etzebeth
5 PS du Toit
6 Siya Kolisi
7 Sikhumbuzo Notshe
8 Nizaam Carr
9 Louis Schreuder
10 Rob du Preez
11 Seabelo Senatla
12 Damian de Allende
13 Juan de Jongh / Huw Jones
14 Cornal Hendricks / Kobus van Wyk / Lionel Zas
15 Cheslin Kolbe

16 Scarra Ntubeni
17 JC Janse van Rensburg / Ali Vermaak
18 ?
19 JD Shickerling
20 Jano Vermaak?
21 ?
22 Jean-Luc du Plessis
23 Jaco Taute

My summary;

Percieved weaknesses:
Props: Beyond Malherbe and Kebble the depth in quality isn't there aymore with Kitshff gone and Koch on the way out. Hope we can make a plan here as Malherbe is serially injured. An area of strnegth could easily become an area of concern.
Hooker: While I was flabbergasted at their selection for the Bokke and we have much better hookers in SA Mbonambi and Ntubeni are fine at SR level, add to our quota tally and know the ropes here. Its not as if our pack is lacking. Not an area of strength though.
Lock: Only the Chiefs can claim to equal us in this department with Bird and Retallick and we'll see on the weekend which pair gets the better. JD Shickerling is a promising young ock to do bench duty. Even with Jean Kleyn leaving we are well stocked unless we suffer multiple injuries.
Loose forward: I am hoping we get a good signing here. Kolisi, Notshe and Carr are all fine players but I question the combination and lack of impact without the ball. We need at least one loosie that can add presence at the breakdown, compete on opp ball and dominate the collision. Depth and experience might also be tested if we don't get someone in shore up this department.
Halves: Groom is leaving, I don't know if Vermaak is looking like adding much and then there is ony Schreuder who is alright but won't swing games. We have to keep our eyes open. I wish we could've signed up u20 Bok scrumhalf James Hall from the Kings. Between Rob du Preez and Jean Luc du Plessis we finally have quality and quality in depth and young enough to expect them to only get more rounded with experience (hpefully). So a bit of a mixed bag here.
Centers: Damian de Allende.. he'll probably go to Japan again and come back injured or overworked again. De Jongh also solid but with an asterisk or two next to his name. Huw Jones is a Scottish international now and that'll probably count against him. Here I am hoping we can snap up one of the Lions centers. Between Mapoe, Janse van Rensburg, Vorster, Mnisi and Hanekom (though I don't want Mnisi or Hanekom- then Id rather promote a WP youngster) they have more than they can effectively make use of.
Outside backs: Here is where I expect a lot of changes. Kolbe and Senatla will be back from Rio with the SA 7s squad and should add a lot of penetration working off of each other. If Hendricks can overcome his illness to take up the no. 14 jersey we have a slight but deadly back three. Taute and van Wyk can add some bulk when/if needed and Lleyds and Zas are tested back-up utility backs. No issues here IMO. I am backing Senatla to be up there with the top try scorers. If anything we are overstocked and possibly a little light weight?.. might we see Kobe go to 9 seeing as we need a player there and we have Taute and Lleyds to cover 15? Might be worth experimenting.

 

[TRF_heineken]

A lot can still happen, most teams usually try to sign a few more guys during the Currie Cup premier division tournament just before that 31 October Deadline.

I think after the Rio 7's we might see a few surprizes. My hope is that Francois Hougaard return to the Bulls or at least be available for Super Rugby, depending on his contract with Worcester.

The other thing is to wait and see what happens with the Craven week players. I see there is already an article that the Bulls and Lions are starting to snap up the WP guys, with WP snoozing on getting their contracts in place (if there are even contracts in place??).

I think Thelo Wakefield is the worst administrator after Cheeky Watson, and it's a pity there seems to be this laziness at WPRU. Damian Willemse was the standout player at the Craven week, and should have been the first guy the WP signed.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

A lot can still happen, most teams usually try to sign a few more guys during the Currie Cup premier division tournament just before that 31 October Deadline.

I think after the Rio 7's we might see a few surprizes. My hope is that Francois Hougaard return to the Bulls or at least be available for Super Rugby, depending on his contract with Worcester.

The other thing is to wait and see what happens with the Craven week players. I see there is already an article that the Bulls and Lions are starting to snap up the WP guys, with WP snoozing on getting their contracts in place (if there are even contracts in place??).

I think Thelo Wakefield is the worst administrator after Cheeky Watson, and it's a pity there seems to be this laziness at WPRU. Damian Willemse was the standout player at the Craven week, and should have been the first guy the WP signed.

Preach!

If I were looking at getting WP and the Stormers somewhere I'd have signed Willemse and groomed him to play at 13 like Racing has done with Johan Goosen to get the T14 ***le. Adding 5kgs in a year or two he could be the perfect foil to De Allende's power and give us that play maker at 13 to unleash the likes of Senatla, Kolbe and Hendricks which we don't currently have.

 

[Bull]

With Lood coming to the Bulls, and Orie leaving to the Lions, was I think a planned move for a long time. Remember Orie wanted to leave the Bulls 2 years ago, and since then he has struggled to get regular game time, and is being overshadowed by the new incumbents.

It seems to me that the Bulls are starting with something that could possibly be something great for the future. They are making in my opinion great signings for next year to build on what has been in my view a pretty successful campaign for such a young squad.

Our team could possibly look like this next year:

1. Trevor Nyakane
2. Adriaan Strauss
3. Lizo Qoboka
4. Lood De Jager
5. RG Snyman
6. Jannes Kirsten
7. Jacques Potgieter
8. Arno Botha

9. Rudy Paige
10. Handre Pollard
11. Jamba Ulengo
12. Jan Serfontein
13. Jesse Kriel
14. Travis Ismaiel
15. Warwick Gelant

16. Edgar marutlule
17. Pierre Schoeman
18. Marcel van der Merwe (if available)
19. Jason Jenkins
20. Lappies Labuschagne
21. Piet van Zyl
22. Tiaan Schoeman
23. SP Marais

That is a pretty good team if you ask me.

Isn't Lappies leaving? 2 guys I rate highly are Roelof Smit and Hanro Liebenberg and personally I hope they don't get messed around.

 

[TRF_heineken]

Isn't Lappies leaving? 2 guys I rate highly are Roelof Smit and Hanro Liebenberg and personally I hope they don't get messed around.

Lappies is coming back for Super Rugby... I like Roelof a lot too, but there are still areas in his game to improve on.

Adendorff on the other hand has X-factor like Jaco Kriel, and that's why I'm glad he's back at the Bulls. His speed and strength could be a great asset for the Bulls next year.

 

[welshglory]

I wonder if the South African Union and Provinces have considered transfer fees for their players. I'm not sure on the legality in rugby but it would be something to look at.