[2016 Super Rugby] Lions vs. Blues (Round 12) 14/05/2016

[TRF_heineken]

Venue: Emirates Airlines Park
Time: 19:15 CAT (SA, GMT+2)​

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

The Lions will feel the pressure of a loss going into a bye coupled with an improving Sharks (I said they should ditch Pietersen for April who got the backline going well in the preseason from the get go) breathing down their necks on the log although TBF the Lions have a game in hand over the Sharks.

Maybe a tad off topic but I think the Bulls and Stormers will be keeping an eye out for the Sharks as well. Both teams coming into the week off a loss and the Stormers also off a bye. We need to step up or one of the teams in Africa 1 could lose their play off spot to the Sharks.

 

[Regan]

I'd pick the Lions here. Blues were pretty average against what imo is one of, if not the worst team of the comp (Kings). Dismiss what the Canes did to the Lions and they're a pretty good side. Blues to crumble.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

Yeah, I think the Hurricanes vs Lions match was somewhat of an odd one where everything just went right for the one team and wrong for the other and the 'Canes' rush defense and tactic of almost not playing but rather reacting just worked and the Lions simply couldn't adapt. Same thing happened with the Stormers beating the Brumbies with an inflated scoreline. Not really a true measure of any of those teams and rather one-off results in games where one outfit simply outwitted the other; IE the Brumbies and Lions aren't poor teams for those heavy losses while the Stormers and Hurricanes aren't as dominant as those results read.

 

[The Jones Boy]

I cannot see the Blues getting passed the Lions in a second tour game.
The Blues have a new coach, a new coaching regime and a history of 6 seasons of abject failure.
Correspondingly I'm really happy with where this young and inexperienced team are right now considering previous years results. There is fight in the side and Tana is having a positive impact but it takes time to develop a team and implement a style and young players will make mistakes under pressure.
The Lions could give my beloved Blues a bath this weekend.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

In the wet nogal. I hope other SA teams are takings notes. And Mapoe is a shoe-in for Bok #13 no matter his age or maybe even because of it since we have soooo many young guys in the backline and Mapoe can bring that maturity and is playing the rugby of his life.

 

[austingtir]

Blues got totally wasted... Everyone knows they are crap but that was kind of unexpected. Looked like total one way traffic and lucky to even score a try in the highlights I saw.

 

[Durbanite]

I gotta say, this match surprised me. Lions were really firing this match, and that start really made it a tough ask for the Blues. Jantjies was impressive at 10, and everyone else turned up as usual. I sure hope Kriel ends up in a bok jersey this year, and Mapoe's running lines are great. I love how this team is coming along in terms of their ability to score tries from all over the park. As for the Blues, really tough loss, but I was bitterly dissapointed with their lack of fight. I had expected a much closer game to be honest.

 

[back2back]

Lions are the only team who has progressed in South Africa, all the other teams have stagnated or regressed, Spring Bok rugby heading in the same direction unless they're willing to adopt their style

 

[unrated]

Lions are the only team who has progressed in South Africa, all the other teams have stagnated or regressed, Spring Bok rugby heading in the same direction unless they're willing to adopt their style

I don't get the criticism. We are actually willing to adapt. All the SA franchises has made a effort to play a more attacking style. Lions has just been doing it for longer and you can see the results but we wont go all out to change the style as that would risk us losing a number of games that we should win. Some SA teams are much better than last year. I love how the Jags play but i have to say that they are an example that you still need balance. Kicking is very important to win matches.

 

[back2back]

I don't get the criticism. We are actually willing to adapt. All the SA franchises has made a effort to play a more attacking style. Lions has just been doing it for longer and you can see the results but we wont go all out to change the style as that would risk us losing a number of games that we should win. Some SA teams are much better than last year. I love how the Jags play but i have to say that they are an example that you still need balance. Kicking is very important to win matches.

You don't get the criticism after the Stormers embarrassing effort this weekend? The Sharks have some what come out off their shell a little, but they're still pretty awful offensively and have been lucky to get some results go their way past few weeks. The Bulls got thumped by the 2 competitive sides in Australia, the Cheetahs can only manage a result against the worst teams in the competition and as for the Kings... well what can I say, how the hell did they get into this competition.. and literally 50 people go to their games, it's just an embarrassment and a farce that you get gifted 2 top play-off spots.

Surely now you get can "get" the criticism? The SA teams have been shocking part from the Lions.

 

[saulan]

You don't get the criticism after the Stormers embarrassing effort this weekend? The Sharks have some what come out off their shell a little, but they're still pretty awful offensively and have been lucky to get some results go their way past few weeks. The Bulls got thumped by the 2 competitive sides in Australia, the Cheetahs can only manage a result against the worst teams in the competition and as for the Kings... well what can I say, how the hell did they get into this competition.. and literally 50 people go to their games, it's just an embarrassment and a farce that you get gifted 2 top play-off spots.

Surely now you get can "get" the criticism? The SA teams have been shocking part from the Lions.

I think at this stage you are being a bit too harsh on our teams. The Bulls and the Stormers have just hit a slump in their form. They both player poorly in their last two games, but weren't doing too badly before that. At the very least the Stormers showed some character for coming back from no mans land this weekend to scrape a draw. Am I happy with their offense over the last two matches, absolutely not, our backs have been pathetic and our forwards are the only ones pitching up, but I'm not going to ignore their earlier good performances against the Sunwolves, Bulls and Brumbies. To say that the sharks have been shocking this season isn't fair. They did decently on a tough New Zealand tour and have won two matches out of three over the last three weeks, playing on three different continents (Austalasia then South Africa then South America). I really don't think you could ask anything more from them over the last few weeks.

 

[back2back]

I think at this stage you are being a bit too harsh on our teams. The Bulls and the Stormers have just hit a slump in their form. They both player poorly in their last two games, but weren't doing too badly before that. At the very least the Stormers showed some character for coming back from no mans land this weekend to scrape a draw. Am I happy with their offense over the last two matches, absolutely not, our backs have been pathetic and our forwards are the only ones pitching up, but I'm not going to ignore their earlier good performances against the Sunwolves, Bulls and Brumbies. To say that the sharks have been shocking this season isn't fair. They did decently on a tough New Zealand tour and have won two matches out of three over the last three weeks, playing on three different continents (Austalasia then South Africa then South America). I really don't think you could ask anything more from them over the last few weeks.

I think you're being far too generous. The Stormers haven't been asked any questions thanks to their incredibly easy draw and are still some how making a meal of it. The Sharks looked better on tour admittedly, but were very lucky the Highlanders had a man sent off in that fixture, I'm sure with the extra man the Landers would have been able to breach the stubborn defense. But I think the comments about South African teams stagnating and regressing is a fair and fine assessment of where you're at. Look at it in comparison to a few seasons ago and if you go back a bit further, The Sharks, Bulls and Stormers were extremely strong. Right now the only thing keeping them on top of their conferences is the fact the other teams in their conferences are pathetic.

 

[saulan]

I think you're being far too generous. The Stormers haven't been asked any questions thanks to their incredibly easy draw and are still some how making a meal of it. The Sharks looked better on tour admittedly, but were very lucky the Highlanders had a man sent off in that fixture, I'm sure with the extra man the Landers would have been able to breach the stubborn defense. But I think the comments about South African teams stagnating and regressing is a fair and fine assessment of where you're at. Look at it in comparison to a few seasons ago and if you go back a bit further, The Sharks, Bulls and Stormers were extremely strong. Right now the only thing keeping them on top of their conferences is the fact the other teams in their conferences are pathetic.

South African derbies are never easy. All players kick it up a gear when we play each other. They were expected to be well beaten by the Brumbies side, but instead beat the Brumbies by a large margin. To say that the Stormers haven't been asked any questions is an exaggeration. I'm not denying they have haven't had the easiest draw, but they have definitely been asked questions. Also, in the past we generally have only really had one or two teams in the top positions, the last time we had more than that was 2012/2013 and before that it was also very shaky. We have never been performing well in all teams at once. Also I think the common denominator isn't that the SA teams have been so poor but that the New Zealand teams have been so good. If you compare SA teams to Australian teams we have three teams with more points than the top Ozzie team and one just behind them. The only ones really doing amazingly well is New Zealand. Why aren't we criticising the Ozzie teams as much as the SA teams? We have three teams in the top 8 on merit. The Ozzies only have one.

 

[back2back]

South African derbies are never easy. All players kick it up a gear when we play each other. They were expected to be well beaten by the Brumbies side, but instead beat the Brumbies by a large margin. To say that the Stormers haven't been asked any questions is an exaggeration. I'm not denying they have haven't had the easiest draw, but they have definitely been asked questions. Also, in the past we generally have only really had one or two teams in the top positions, the last time we had more than that was 2012/2013 and before that it was also very shaky. We have never been performing well in all teams at once. Also I think the common denominator isn't that the SA teams have been so poor but that the New Zealand teams have been so good. If you compare SA teams to Australian teams we have three teams with more points than the top Ozzie team and one just behind them. The only ones really doing amazingly well is New Zealand. Why aren't we criticising the Ozzie teams as much as the SA teams? We have three teams in the top 8 on merit. The Ozzies only have one.

The Brumbies turned out to be a false prophet and have been thoroughly thumped by the better teams in the competition. Turning to the result still doesn't bring much credibility to your defense of the Stormers, they are simply not that good of a team and are fairly dull and one dimensional. Agreed about the Aussies they have been equally poor, but aren't gifted two play-off spots like SA.

 

[saulan]

The Brumbies turned out to be a false prophet and have been thoroughly thumped by the better teams in the competition. Turning to the result still doesn't bring much credibility to your defense of the Stormers, they are simply not that good of a team and are fairly dull and one dimensional. Agreed about the Aussies they have been equally poor, but aren't gifted two play-off spots like SA.

I don't think they have been good over the past two weeks, I definitely wouldn't rate them above the top 4 New Zealand teams. But overall they have been okay. Not great. I don't expect them to win this season and I expect them to lose their playoff matches if they even make it to the play-offs. If we stay like this for the rest of the season then yes we are one dimensional. Right now we have a good forward pack and terrible backline. I hope we turn it around, but we won't be challenging for the ***le. I think we agree on that.

But we have earned our playoff spots. All our teams in play-off positions are there on merit. Do we deserve home play-offs at this point in time? No.

 

[back2back]

I don't think they have been good over the past two weeks, I definitely wouldn't rate them above the top 4 New Zealand teams. But overall they have been okay. Not great. I don't expect them to win this season and I expect them to lose their playoff matches if they even make it to the play-offs. If we stay like this for the rest of the season then yes we are one dimensional. Right now we have a good forward pack and terrible backline. I hope we turn it around, but we won't be challenging for the ***le. I think we agree on that.

But we have earned our playoff spots. All our teams in play-off positions are there on merit. Do we deserve home play-offs at this point in time? No.

How can you not admit that that is regression or stagnation then? How can you claim that you have progressed this season? Or any other team aside from the Lions has?

 

[saulan]

How can you not admit that that is regression or stagnation then? How can you claim that you have progressed this season? Or any other team aside from the Lions has?

You don't remember last season do you? Last season only one SA team made it into the play-offs (the Stormers) and they didn't deserve to be there, it was forced (Crusaders had more points). If we only had 6 playoff spots like last year, two SA teams would be there on merit. How is that not an improvement. We were rubbish last year. Now at least we are better than the Ozzies. Sharks came 11th last year so they are a huge improvement. Lions were 8th so they are better and the Stormers were third (but really 7th). How is this not an improvement?

 

[back2back]

You don't remember last season do you? Last season only one SA team made it into the play-offs (the Stormers) and they didn't deserve to be there, it was forced (Crusaders had more points). If we only had 6 playoff spots like last year, two SA teams would be there on merit. How is that not an improvement. We were rubbish last year. Now at least we are better than the Ozzies. Sharks came 11th last year so they are a huge improvement. Lions were 8th so they are better and the Stormers were third (but really 7th). How is this not an improvement?

But that's a lie isn't it? Because some of your teams aren't playing NZ sides.

- - - Updated - - -

How can you even begin to kid yourself you're there on "merit" when you get to play teams like the Kings and Sunwolves twice and Cheetahs and don't even face the Kiwi teams? That's delusional.

 

[saulan]

But that's a lie isn't it? Because some of your teams aren't playing NZ sides.

- - - Updated - - -

How can you even begin to kid yourself you're there on "merit" when you get to play teams like the Kings and Sunwolves twice and Cheetahs and don't even face the Kiwi teams? That's delusional.

How is it a lie that the Sharks and Lions are a huge improvement? They are there on merit based on the structure of this tournament. Don't twist this into something else because you aren't happy with it. I would be more happy if all SA teams played all NZ teams, most Saffers do. Why do you just want to bash the South African teams? This is honestly not our worst ever performance in Super Rugby. I don't think it's our best season, but to not see this as an improvement from last season for South Africa is absolutely delusional.