[2016 RBS Six Nations] Round 1: Ireland vs. Wales (07/02/2016)

[Leonormous Boozer]

You both lost today.
If ain't winning you're losing.

Beating Scotland is pretty much losing and France didn't deserve to win, Parisse was a winner as always. Italy for the slam.

 

[corny]

Good game I thought. Both sides struggled against unbelievably committed and disciplined defending. Thought Garces, apart from his decisions at scrum, had agood game.

For us, we were just missing players who make the difference for us. Fair result though.

 

[ncurd]

Yup good result for us English after all we'll inevitably lose to one side but the other will likely lose to the French we'll end up on top.

At least it's very unlikely we'll come second on points difference....again!

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Why isn't Jonny Wilkinson a coach?

He is
Toulon and England!


Part time/casually, anyway.
Get the feeling he doesn't want to be involved so fully so soon after retiring - I think he wants some time to distance himself from the playing side. After reading his autobiography I think he'd be beating himself up too much for things that went wrong on the pitch even when they're out of his control.

 

[McTallshort]

He is
Toulon and England!


Part time/casually, anyway.
Get the feeling he doesn't want to be involved so fully so soon after retiring - I think he wants some time to distance himself from the playing side. After reading his autobiography I think he'd be beating himself up too much for things that went wrong on the pitch even when they're out of his control.

Yeah I read it too blokes a bit unhinged

 

[munstermuffin]

On Irish side

McGrath was excellent
Best was good
White really felt it in scrum. Maybe Furlong will be better choice.
2 Locks were good. Ryan also played his part.
Our backrow. TOD delivered a big game. Heaslip gets hammered and well I think today is why. He put in superb display and its people know what he can do and want it more. Stander was just simply CJ. People forget he wasn't in his normal slot and he was amazing. Ruddock did his role too and they, as a unit, really won that battle.
Murray was back to top form today. Very effective.
Sexton. I don't know how healthy that head is but he was back to his world class best.
Earls proved why I think he's Schmidts #1 winger now. Defensively he put in huge game.
Henshaw and Payne I thought played very good and I'm beginning to think they may be that unit.
Trimble was solid and again showed his class defensively.
Zebo was amazing and poor. He made errors but at same time did some things that were very good.

Also Schmidt as I liked the style. He can get expansive game going but his work as defensive coach was special

 

[Tony Manx]

On Irish side

McGrath was excellent
Best was good
White really felt it in scrum. Maybe Furlong will be better choice.
2 Locks were good. Ryan also played his part.
Our backrow. TOD delivered a big game. Heaslip gets hammered and well I think today is why. He put in superb display and its people know what he can do and want it more. Stander was just simply CJ. People forget he wasn't in his normal slot and he was amazing. Ruddock did his role too and they, as a unit, really won that battle.
Murray was back to top form today. Very effective.
Sexton. I don't know how healthy that head is but he was back to his world class best.
Earls proved why I think he's Schmidts #1 winger now. Defensively he put in huge game.
Henshaw and Payne I thought played very good and I'm beginning to think they may be that unit.
Trimble was solid and again showed his class defensively.
Zebo was amazing and poor. He made errors but at same time did some things that were very good

Hard to see why you did not win by a landslide then!!!

As an example of maybe a slight over the top comment, I would say that I noticed Earls only for two tip tackles and some loose passing! I doubt, on that performance he would get into any of the other 6N teams - even Scotland!!

 

[munstermuffin]

Hard to see why you did not win by a landslide then!!!

As an example of maybe a slight over the top comment, I would say that I noticed Earls only for two tip tackles and some loose passing! I doubt, on that performance he would get into any of the other 6N teams - even Scotland!!

Guess you missed so as he made 2 try saving tackles and RTE full of praise of him saying he was 1 of our better defenders. And guess we will disagree on tip tackle views.

And didn't win as Wales were equally as good. I just commented on Irish side. We were poor up front at scrum and lineout shaky.

 

[Amiga500]

On Irish side

McGrath was excellent
Best was good
White really felt it in scrum. Maybe Furlong will be better choice.
2 Locks were good. Ryan also played his part.
Our backrow. TOD delivered a big game. Heaslip gets hammered and well I think today is why. He put in superb display and its people know what he can do and want it more. Stander was just simply CJ. People forget he wasn't in his normal slot and he was amazing. Ruddock did his role too and they, as a unit, really won that battle.
Murray was back to top form today. Very effective.
Sexton. I don't know how healthy that head is but he was back to his world class best.
Earls proved why I think he's Schmidts #1 winger now. Defensively he put in huge game.
Henshaw and Payne I thought played very good and I'm beginning to think they may be that unit.
Trimble was solid and again showed his class defensively.
Zebo was amazing and poor. He made errors but at same time did some things that were very good.

Also Schmidt as I liked the style. He can get expansive game going but his work as defensive coach was special

This press release was brought to you by the IRFU....(!)

 

[munstermuffin]

This press release was brought to you by the IRFU....(!)

Just a fair assessment

 

[Amiga500]

From Irish POV.

+ives:
- Lineout worked reasonably well in absence of POC.
- Defence looked sound, rarely too stretched.

-ives:
- Scrum iffy. Very iffy at times and somewhat fortunate to escape more penalties or even cards.
- Frequently overcommitting to attacking rucks.
- Very poor attacking structure for much of the game.
- Poor kicking game, very few contestable garryowens, and most of those very few were lost.


-------------------------------------------------

Zebo did what you'd expect from him, some good running lines but mixed with very poor kicking, poor passing, poor positioning and adding very little to the attacking shape. If Payne had been at 15, he'd have zero'd in on Roberts frequently shooting the line and made him pay, big time. Zebo either didn't spot it, or know how to take advantage of it.

- - - Updated - - -

Just a fair assessment

Then how did we not win by a landslide? :mellow:

Everyone can't play great and we still grind out a draw!

 

[Groundhog]

Hard to see why you did not win by a landslide then!!!

As an example of maybe a slight over the top comment, I would say that I noticed Earls only for two tip tackles and some loose passing! I doubt, on that performance he would get into any of the other 6N teams - even Scotland!!

Speaking of over the top comments.....

 

[munstermuffin]

From Irish POV.

+ives:
- Lineout worked reasonably well in absence of POC.
- Defence looked sound, rarely too stretched.

-ives:
- Scrum iffy. Very iffy at times and somewhat fortunate to escape more penalties or even cards.
- Frequently overcommitting to attacking rucks.
- Very poor attacking structure for much of the game.
- Poor kicking game, very few contestable garryowens, and most of those very few were lost.


-------------------------------------------------

Zebo did what you'd expect from him, some good running lines but mixed with very poor kicking, poor passing, poor positioning and adding very little to the attacking shape. If Payne had been at 15, he'd have zero'd in on Roberts frequently shooting the line and made him pay, big time. Zebo either didn't spot it, or know how to take advantage of it.

- - - Updated - - -



Then how did we not win by a landslide? :mellow:

Everyone can't play great and we still grind out a draw!

Well can I ask who you thought played poor. I can't say White was poor despite scrum or McGrath.
Or Best or Locks for few sketchy lineouts.
I thought we attacked better than we have in past and tried to expand. A newish team who were widely expected to loose.
I admit Zebo had poor kicks but a lot here will just try slam him any opportunity. We didn't win by a landslide because Wales were equally as good. Surprised a lot just use it as cheap way to slam guys. The wind also was obvious so was never expected to be many bang on garryowens as both teams kicked a few unforced errors.

And lastly on my original assessment which would you disagree with?

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

It was an intense game but it was far from high quality. Teams going 20+ phases isn't a sign of class in my opinion, it's a lack of penetration. Both sides today did it a few times. As long as we delude ourselves that it's good enough, we'll always be light years behind the top teams.

Being one eyed, I paid zero attention to how Wales played.

For Ireland, CJ Stander was a huge positive. Scrum was an issue. If Nathan White can't get parity in the scrum, might as well invest time in Tadhg Furlong who's a decade younger. Mike McCartht belied his years. He's having an excellent season. Behind the scrum, the halfbacks looked good. The rest didn't gel in attack. Midfield defense (and Jared Payne in particular) was very strong. Simon Zebo attacked well but defended poorly, looking all at see under a high ball. Is it just me or did Andrew Trimble look slow?

 

[munstermuffin]

It was an intense game but it was far from high quality. Teams going 20+ phases isn't a sign of class in my opinion, it's a lack of penetration. Both sides today did it a few times. As long as we delude ourselves that it's good enough, we'll always be light years behind the top teams.

Being one eyed, I paid zero attention to how Wales played.

For Ireland, CJ Stander was a huge positive. Scrum was an issue. If Nathan White can't get parity in the scrum, might as well invest time in Tadhg Furlong who's a decade younger. Mike McCartht belied his years. He's having an excellent season. Behind the scrum, the halfbacks looked good. The rest didn't gel in attack. Midfield defense (and Jared Payne in particular) was very strong. Simon Zebo attacked well but defended poorly, looking all at see under a high ball. Is it just me or did Andrew Trimble look slow?

Snoop on that. I thought our attack was good we tried to expand but forced at times. On White that's fair comment. On Zebo I wouldn't paint it attack good defense bad but certainly mixed good and bad

 

[Yoshimitsu]

Not neutral I guess I'm English

What I saw I kind of liked. For a start there was total and utter commitment to the point of insanity. Biggar clearly broke himself but fancied carrying on and Sexton was properly broken when he came off. Roberts wanted to kill Henshaw. Henshaw wanted to **** Roberts up. Honours even. All in all two closely matched teams beating the living daylights out of each other. Good to watch.

That said Zebo looks fully 7's. He's no idea what a structure looks like and how to play it. Watching him work out how to **** stuff up is painful. Wales got away with a lot at the breakdown. It's a Garces failing. He doesn't buy the argument that "accidentally" lying in the way (or beyond the ball) and stopping ball for 0.5 seconds matters. It does, massively.

Jamie Roberts as a doctor must know that doing what he's doing is kind of bad for him, but **** it he's a smashy animal and I like to watch it. Good stuff. Ireland played Tipuric very well. Second defender always hit that shoulder when ruck formed.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I think the main thing with Zebo is he doesn't look like a fullback.
The things he did well were the winger-type roles, the things not so well were the FB roles.

When Kearney is back I'd flip a coin for him or Earls to start and have the other on the bench.

 

[Amiga500]

Well can I ask who you thought played poor.

The two props were part of a creaky scum, which is the prime component of their job. So, they can't be rated good.

None of our tight forwards turned over ball at a ruck today IIRC. Also, as I said before, we frequently overcommitted to attacking rucks too.

Backrow did OK, but not great. We didn't tie in enough Welsh defenders on a frequent basis and left ourselves very light on runners facing against a full defensive line.

Murray and Sexton didn't exactly push the game into the Welsh 22 too often - it was kicks from the centres or outside backs that did that. Both, while not having bad games, didn't impose themselves either - although both threatened to at times, and Murray was producing some good stuff for about 10 mins around his try. Although he did revert back to his bad habit of playing the direction he is facing a bit too often, and not recognising our options were better if he'd turned.

Centres didn't manage to isolate the shooter all day. Not aided by a fullback who couldn't recognise it. Wingers didn't see much ball in decent space.


All in all, a competent, average to good performance. But the team ratings should average out at no more than about a 6 to 6.5. Above that and your not setting your standards high enough.


McGrath - 6
Best - 6
White - 5
McCarthy - 6
Toner - 6
Stander - 7
O'Donnell - 7
Heaslip - 7
Murray - 6
Sexton - 5
Earls - 6
Henshaw - 6
Payne - 6
Trimble - 5
Zebo - 4

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

Snoop on that. I thought our attack was good we tried to expand but forced at times. On White that's fair comment. On Zebo I wouldn't paint it attack good defense bad but certainly mixed good and bad

I thought Ireland's attack showed signs that it can be good but they looked rusty. Neither Robbie Henshaw nor Jared Payne have a lot of game time recently. With a couple of games under their belt they'll get better.

Zebo dropped and misjudged high balls. kicked directly to touch and didn't seem to cover as well as Rob Kearney. What he did do was offer a counter attacking threat which Kearney doesn't. He's a frustrating player but hugely talented.

- - - Updated - - -

Ratings from the42.ie here:
http://www.the42.ie/ireland-player-ratings-wales-six-nations-2589692-Feb2016/

You'd swear Ireland were awesome. 7s, 8s and 9s out of 10 almost across the board!

 

[Amiga500]

Ratings from the42.ie here:
http://www.the42.ie/ireland-player-ratings-wales-six-nations-2589692-Feb2016/

You'd swear Ireland were awesome. 7s, 8s and 9s out of 10 almost across the board!

I know. That's the kinda of numptys in the meeja here.

Begorra, top of the morning, everyone likes us and aren't we f__king brilliant too? Self-praising ****heads only too quick to talk everything in the country up then wonder why it all falls apart when cold hard reality bites back.