[2014 EOYT] England v Samoa

[McTallshort]

so the coaches son gets in the team again? if he has a crap game at centre are they going to try him at prop against Australia?

 

[Yoshimitsu]

Today's the day I officially lost faith in Lancaster. As well as further ruining the back line by putting an out of form injured player in a pivotal position he's probably also compromised Ford's chance of looking good. Farrell is a wholehearted but limited 10. He'll be worse wholehearted and limited 12. Ford should be playing with a recognised 12 and Farrell should be recuperating with his club. We may beat Samoa, but so what? A chance to try something yet again passes us by as Lancaster's loyalty or stubborness wins the day.

Tell me one thing that Farrell does better than Billy 36 at 12?

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Tell me one thing that Farrell does better than Billy 36 at 12?

This.

 

[McTallshort]

Today's the day I officially lost faith in Lancaster. As well as further ruining the back line by putting an out of form injured player in a pivotal position he's probably also compromised Ford's chance of looking good. Farrell is a wholehearted but limited 10. He'll be worse wholehearted and limited 12. Ford should be playing with a recognised 12 and Farrell should be recuperating with his club. We may beat Samoa, but so what? A chance to try something yet again passes us by as Lancaster's loyalty or stubborness wins the day.

Tell me one thing that Farrell does better than Billy 36 at 12?

Or 1 thing he does more than Eastmond or Barrett or even a decent club standard player like Allen? Hes is in there because hes dads one of the coaches like the useless ginger kid who played fly half in my under 12s team when I was a kid or the teachers son who always got picked to play striker in the football team.

We need to ditch one of the Farrells because one is crap at selection and the other is just crap.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

The most shocking thing in the announcement for me is that the RFU image has Mullan in the 16 shirt.
I know it makes sense for the prop replacements to go 16. LH, 17. Hooker, 18. TH but that's not the way it's done, dammit!

On the actual side: I'm not happy, but c'est la vie. Hopefully Haskell has a big game, and hopefully Leuia/Leota ruin Farrell's day.

We need to ditch one of the Farrells because one is crap at selection and the other is just crap.

Think that's a bit OTT on Farrell. He's a good 10, he's just injured and out of form.

 

[TheSaffycen]

We don't need to ditch one of the Farrell's, Andy is a great defence coach (which is what he should be used as) and the other is a promising fly half. Owen Farrell is 23. People forget he is only a kid and to think the potential he has is brilliant, he defends brilliantly, kicks well and on his day is very good. He is out of form at the moment but you don't just discard the kid because he has had a couple of poor games coming back from injury. He was really good in the 6 nations and was instrumental in our wins against Wales and Ireland. He needs to improve his attacking play but it has come on leaps and bounds since his debut, you can blame Lancaster for selecting him but you can't blame Farrell for wanting to play.

 

[McTallshort]

The most shocking thing in the announcement for me is that the RFU image has Mullan in the 16 shirt.
I know it makes sense for the prop replacements to go 16. LH, 17. Hooker, 18. TH but that's not the way it's done, dammit!

On the actual side: I'm not happy, but c'est la vie. Hopefully Haskell has a big game, and hopefully Leuia/Leota ruin Farrell's day.


Think that's a bit OTT on Farrell. He's a good 10, he's just injured and out of form.

If hes injured and out of form he should not be getting selected at fly half or centre

 

[TRF_Olyy]

If hes injured and out of form he should not be getting selected at fly half or centre

No arguments from me.
My main issue is with the coaches who keep selecting him, not with him himself. He should be getting game time with Sarries, getting over his injury/form issues, not starting for England.

 

[goodNumber10]

If hes injured and out of form he should not be getting selected at fly half or centre

Don't think anyone disagrees with that.

We don't need to ditch one of the Farrell's, Andy is a great defence coach (which is what he should be used as) and the other is a promising fly half. Owen Farrell is 23. People forget he is only a kid and to think the potential he has is brilliant, he defends brilliantly, kicks well and on his day is very good. He is out of form at the moment but you don't just discard the kid because he has had a couple of poor games coming back from injury. He was really good in the 6 nations and was instrumental in our wins against Wales and Ireland. He needs to improve his attacking play but it has come on leaps and bounds since his debut, you can blame Lancaster for selecting him but you can't blame Farrell for wanting to play.

careful mate, not allowed to be reasoned on OF around these parts, you're either with them or against them.

 

[Maverick1987]

You got through eventually GN10

 

[Toby Sweeney]

The Farrell hate always amazes me he reminds me a bit of Nadal on MTF, he's a good player didn't play well against South Africa but he's just come off an injury. I seem to remember a certain recently injured Kiwi who didn't play well either, every player can have an off game.

 

[j'nuh]

The Farrell hate always amazes me he reminds me a bit of Nadal on MTF, he's a good player didn't play well against South Africa but he's just come off an injury. I seem to remember a certain recently injured Kiwi who didn't play well either, every player can have an off game.

I don't think people direct their hate towards Farrell; I certainly don't. I would never begrudge a player for accepting an international call-up. Even if they called up an amateur player and they were predictably ****, I wouldn't hold it against the amateur player for accepting that opportunity. I think it's mainly the objectivity of the England management that people question.

 

[Peat]

We don't need to ditch one of the Farrell's, Andy is a great defence coach (which is what he should be used as) and the other is a promising fly half. Owen Farrell is 23. People forget he is only a kid and to think the potential he has is brilliant, he defends brilliantly, kicks well and on his day is very good. He is out of form at the moment but you don't just discard the kid because he has had a couple of poor games coming back from injury. He was really good in the 6 nations and was instrumental in our wins against Wales and Ireland. He needs to improve his attacking play but it has come on leaps and bounds since his debut, you can blame Lancaster for selecting him but you can't blame Farrell for wanting to play.

Andy Farrell may be great, but I do not think he is so outstanding that the England set-up should value him above the inevitable and rising din of people questioning their objectivity. Nor do I think his position can be solely judged by defence when his mandate is so clearly bigger. He should be man overboard.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Andy Farrell may be great, but I do not think he is so outstanding that the England set-up should value him above the inevitable and rising din of people questioning their objectivity. Nor do I think his position can be solely judged by defence when his mandate is so clearly bigger. He should be man overboard.

I wouldn't advocate ditching him, just limit his role to defence and get someone better in for attack. As a system England's defence isn't all that bad but our attack is woeful more often than not.

 

[goodNumber10]

http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,3551_9570643,00.html

"If there's a perception that I've never dropped Owen Farrell, then that's wrong," said Lancaster.

"He was dropped in South Africa when we were on tour and he didn't play in any of the autumn internationals in 2012 in the lead up to that New Zealand game."

Lancaster also described claims that there was any influence from Owen's father Andy Farrell over selection as nonsense.

"Can I put that one to bed, please?

"I can categorically say that there is no influence of Andy in the selection of Owen whatsoever. I make the decision. I consult (attacking skills coach) Mike Catt more than Andy when it comes to Owen.

"Mike has his view but I make the decision on it. Andy has a view, but to suggest that he in anyway would influence selection is completely wrong.

"In terms of questioning the integrity of them as a father and son unit in their family, I think that would be completely wrong.

"If you ask the players, they will say it is a completely coach-player relationship. I've seen Mike Ford and George Ford operate in the same relationship.

"I've got a son who's 13, I coach him and if you ask anyone you are probably harder on your own children."

Forgetting OF's form for a moment, do people really believe that a guy like Stewie L is letting Andy Farrell select his son out of fatherly pride?

I get that people think there is a conflict of interests there, but Lancaster has been in rugby for something like 20 years, worked at all levels of the game, worked in the RFU set up a number of years and he's going to get swayed by AF?

I also think it's a bit disengenious to allude to that a guy like AF, who's shown nothing but the utmost professionalism in both codes, would butcher his own career, and chances of coaching his own country some day because of Nepotism.

i'd be very surprised if he was pushing OF purely for selfish reasons - he ahd no problems dropping him at Sarries if i recall right.

 

[The Jones Boy]

England walk over.
40+ points
Regarding Owen Farrell- there is a conundrum here for Lancaster.
He is giving the kid all the game time he can swallow and thats ok as long as the results are coming in but there are two BIG problems here.
What if Owen gets injured?
Why are the likes of Cipriano and Ford getting so little game time?
If Owen the golden boy who gets picked constantly regardless of form, gets an injury, England will have an underdone 10 to put into the white hot fire of an RWC.
Secondly, as results have been poor the pressure mounts on the Nepotism count.
Lancaster should be trying other 10's as cover for Farrell if he cops an injury.

 

[goodNumber10]

Its almost like you read the other thread and put together the perfect troll.....

 

[Patchey]

I've started dreaming about Owen Farrell. This forum has a lot to answer for...

 

[goodNumber10]

Tim Horan on the England midfield

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/30124669

One of the greatest players in rugby union history has backed Owen Farrell's move from fly-half to inside centre.
Former Australia centre Tim Horan, who won two World Cups, believes Farrell can thrive in the England number 12 shirt against Samoa on Saturday.
"He's a wonderful player [and] I think it's a good move," Horan told BBC Radio 5 live.
"Owen has a very good kicking game, a good rugby brain, and I think he will adapt really well," he added.

"George Ford will take the pressure off Owen Farrell and it will allow Owen to run the ball a bit more, and view the game without trying to dictate," Horan added.
"I think Owen will show that with less responsibilities - playing at number 12 - he will be able to show the real form everyone is waiting to see,. It would be harder moving from 12 to 13 than from 10 to 12."
"The great thing about England now is that if George Ford wants to run himself, he knows that if he gets caught in the breakdown, he has someone else to step in to first receiver."

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,3551_9570643,00.html




Forgetting OF's form for a moment, do people really believe that a guy like Stewie L is letting Andy Farrell select his son out of fatherly pride?

I get that people think there is a conflict of interests there, but Lancaster has been in rugby for something like 20 years, worked at all levels of the game, worked in the RFU set up a number of years and he's going to get swayed by AF?

I also think it's a bit disengenious to allude to that a guy like AF, who's shown nothing but the utmost professionalism in both codes, would butcher his own career, and chances of coaching his own country some day because of Nepotism.

i'd be very surprised if he was pushing OF purely for selfish reasons - he ahd no problems dropping him at Sarries if i recall right.

I think people are annoyed the Lancaster picks his favourites rather than the form players.

So Farrell as a favourite should never have stated against New Zealand or South Africa.

The same favouritism that has Callum Clarke in how many england squads?

I find it bizarre after 3 years in charge Lancaster now plays a

12 at 13
And a 10 at 12

But is yet to try the I form combo of eastmond and JJ who play together week In week out.

Clearly favouritism as there is nothing barritt and Farrell can do that eastmond and JJ can't do better.

Bizarre