2014 6 Nations: Ireland vs Italy (Round 4)

[Feicarsinn]

2 interesting stats:

Ireland conceded their most turnovers in 2years
Italy set world record for most tackles in a match wit 208

We basically lost.

Schmidt out.

 

[munstermuffin]

Seriously what match are you even watching. This is becoming a joke.

Right what would you argue with seen as I not allowed opinion.
I think my back 3 assessment is fair. Kearney missed 2 tackles made none.
I think what I'm saying is fair assessment if you don't agree fair enough

 

[munstermuffin]

We basically lost.

Schmidt out.

Never said anything like that but if ye don't want to accept it was all perfect fair enough but way some are going on you'd swear we hammered All Blacks.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

We basically lost.

Schmidt out.

He's done, get Axel in there.

 

[Feicarsinn]

He's done, get Axel in there.

Bring back the Bull and Quinny.

 

[UlsterRugby2012]

Zebo in and captain, surely that will fix our huge mountain of apparent problems..

 

[munstermuffin]

At least Bull won a Grand Slam Coached by aKidney and I suppose this is way any little criticism and people just retreat to saying bring back A B or C

 

[munstermuffin]

Zebo in and captain, surely that will fix our huge mountain of apparent problems..

Again no one ever mentioned Zebo or anything so pretty stupid comeback

 

[Feicarsinn]

Zebo in and captain, surely that will fix our huge mountain of apparent problems..

Drop all of those Pro Treaty Ladyboys, McFadden to be summarily executed.

 

[munstermuffin]

Drop all of those Pro Treaty Ladyboys, McFadden to be summarily executed.

Again pretty stupid and going off analysis. Nobody called anyone ladyboys. Guess if it not in agreement with ye it just greeted with offence

 

[Gavin]

I thought the bench had a good impact on the game. McFadden was good, as was Jackson. Would there be a case for having four backs on the bench instead of the usual three in future games? It would give the option of having an out-and-out centre and a 'utility back' as well.

 

[Feicarsinn]

I thought the bench had a good impact on the game. McFadden was good, as was Jackson. Would there be a case for having four backs on the bench instead of the usual three in future games? It would give the option of having an out-and-out centre and a 'utility back' as well.

I don't know, it would mean doubling up in the pack, most likely with one player expected to cover the entire back row and second row. Those are much more attritional positions than the back three for example.

 

[munstermuffin]

I thought the bench had a good impact on the game. McFadden was good, as was Jackson. Would there be a case for having four backs on the bench instead of the usual three in future games? It would give the option of having an out-and-out centre and a 'utility back' as well.

Would agree with Feic in that the packs are much more physical in rugby so 5 is needed. And well I don't think we could afford to have 1 bench spot covering 4-8 considering injury and age profiles of some there

 

[Groundhog]

Our backs were okay because Sexton pulled the strings brilliantly but I think Dave was poor apart from his inside pop for that try. He's competent but really doesn't make the most of the space that he's been given. If Bowe is deemed fit enough he should start. Trimble was outstanding and although his idea of agility is swerve wildly he's destructive when he cuts infield in attacks kind of diagonally. He's being consistently good for us. I think a mix of his power on one wing and the intelligence or agility of Bowe/Zebo on the other wing is a good balance.
I'm a big fan of McFadden and he's proved he has his merits in attack but bear in mind he came up against a dead tired dejected Italian team. When we come up against the French he won't have the same impact so it's worth having a game changer on the bench. It's around the 60 minute mark a guy like Zebo can break the line and score a 'wonder try'. I can't see how Jordi Murphy merits a bench spot based on performance. i don't think versatility holds up either. Nothing to do with his cameo today, but why? Ryan covers the row and 6 and is a proven international.
I've been a critic of Toner in the past, but he and Henry were men if the match for me today. He carried excellently and his line out was great as per usual. McGrath and Cronin are great subs to have, class cameos. Kilcoyne will have to up his game massively to be considered while I think Duncan Casey will be Ireland's hooker in a few year, Cronin is freakishly quick. Henderson wasn't quite as prominent as I'd hoped, but no big deal. As was said he can't do that Saracens job all the time. Moore should be starting. Heaslip was okay. He went through quiet stages and then really high workload periods.

 

[ruggabee]

I can kinda see munstermuffin's general point.. It took us a good while to finally get some kind of rhythm going against a 2nd string Italian side at home. We dominated possession but rarely took advantage of it. Against a side like France we won't be getting that many chances with that kind of possession so we will need to sharpen our attack. We got so many chances today and the Italian's looked dead on their feet in the second half making it easier for us to make inroads and eventual tries. I can't see the French giving us that much possession and they aren't going to tire like the Italians did today from endless tackling. I hope today was a sign of good things to come but taking into account the opposition it's hard to say where we're at.

 

[munstermuffin]

Like people seem to disagree but points are:
I don't think McFadden is superb impact. Yes he did have good game today and it's not that he's not international standard. But he's not a guy you'd think can change a game if it's tight and we are chasing it.
Our back 3 did some nice things but some had howlers and if the error was made for try by anyone else I'd be saying same it was cardinal and was similar to something that happened in London.
Again though I'm big fan of Plumtree and think pack is playing best they have in years. I'd agree with osulli regards Jordi Murphy. He's a good prospect but not good enough yet. Henderson I think was poor today too and I'd ask 2 questions regards this:
1. Is he being hurt by being between lock and 6?
2. Is he like a Cronin where he's good player but much much more effective off bench like Ulster use him?

 

[Peat]

I can't help but find something inconsistent with the concentration on the result after great to fair performances against NZ/England and concentration on the performance after a very good result against Italy. It does make it look like you are being hyper-critical of Schmidt, for whatever reason.

I thought Ireland played well except for their accuracy at the breakdown and in ball protection. I thought that Ireland played the sort of game that destroys the opposition's ability to resist rather than the sort of game that simply cuts them apart - less flash and impressive on the surface, but no less an achievement. That's 3 very impressive scorelines out of 4 in the Six Nations.

Will be interesting to see what happens against France.

 

[munstermuffin]

I can't help but find something inconsistent with the concentration on the result after great to fair performances against NZ/England and concentration on the performance after a very good result against Italy. It does make it look like you are being hyper-critical of Schmidt, for whatever reason.

I thought Ireland played well except for their accuracy at the breakdown and in ball protection. I thought that Ireland played the sort of game that destroys the opposition's ability to resist rather than the sort of game that simply cuts them apart - less flash and impressive on the surface, but no less an achievement. That's 3 very impressive scorelines out of 4 in the Six Nations.

Will be interesting to see what happens against France.

I'll accept but it's a result business and simply put apart from Wales game we haven't done anything (results wise) that was extremely unexpected or out of this world. And I'm not being critical of Schmidt as some errors can't be attributed to him. And look if we loose to France next week I'd accept it awful hard place to be but we have to look at it as being fair we have to beat bigger teams and pick best players and make competition. As I said I understand England and France are away and that I probably make it out as no win situation. But as I said it's just some areas must change.

 

[Peat]

Extremely unexpected, no, but a cursory look over wiki says that you posted the biggest winning margin over Scotland and second biggest over Italy in the last five years. The results are more than should have been expected.

So far Schmidt has done well. His decisions seem counter-intuitive in some ways but they seem to be working. I personally would hold back on getting judgemental until I saw how they go against France.

 

[Maverick1987]

Guys you had a great win ! Stop arguing between yourselves ! Some parts were great some parts were poor . It's rare a team comes away from a game with nothing to work on anyway . France will certainly pose a larger test but for now it's job done and eyes on next week . You're in pole position