Wales big back line but what about back up

[Robert Prosser]

Ok we all know it they are massive only little Leigh Halfpenny is the sall guy at 5ft 10in and 13 st after that its Alex Cuthbert 6ft 6ins and 16st 5lbs, fellow winger Geroge North 6ft 4ins and 17st 6lbs, Jamie Roberts 6ft 4ins and 17st 5lbs, centre partner Jonathan Davies 6ft 1in and 16st 2lbs, outside-half Rhys Priestland 6ft and 15st 1lbs and scrum-half Mike Phillips 6ft 3in and 15st 12lbs.

Lets discuss it what are peoples thoughts about this huge back line, also what about the players in back up, I feel we are weakened on the wing Tom James is a good player but no chance of him getting capped again under Gatland I think.

We got Scott Williams 6ft 15st 4lbs very impressive during games he has played and Lloyd Williams 6ft 13st 9lbs who is in my eyes sure favourite to replace Phillips at some point, we got Liam Williams 6ft 2in 13st 5lbs, who I heard from a few Scarlets supporters is not good enough for Wales yet (I cant really say) so please what do others think?

 

[Feicarsinn]

Let's establish one thing; Wales' back line isn't good just because they have lots of big, strong guys out there. They're also fantastic rugby players. Their centres are both extremely smart players with good hands while their outside backs have pace to burn. There are lots of big backs who are bloody useless ala Hape. If I were Gatland I wouldn't be all that concerned about size when looking at my back ups. Having had Leigh Halfpenny in the team and before him in Shane Williams, he'll know that size isn't everything.

 

[Robert Prosser]

Let's establish one thing; Wales' back line isn't good just because they have lots of big, strong guys out there. They're also fantastic rugby players. Their centres are both extremely smart players with good hands while their outside backs have pace to burn. There are lots of big backs who are bloody useless ala Hape. If I were Gatland I wouldn't be all that concerned about size when looking at my back ups. Having had Leigh Halfpenny in the team and before him in Shane Williams, he'll know that size isn't everything.

Dont get me wrong the big back line was just a ***le for the thread to be honest, if the guys we got had not ball skills they would be pants we are very lucky right now but my concern is mainly on the wing at centre we dont seem to bad for cover but look at our 6 nations squad both wingers named as the back up have never been capped, so I have a feeling we are maybe a little short in that department.

 

[leeroycal]

Agree with Feicarsinn that their size is simply a bonus to their overall quality, perhaps with the exception of Cuthbert, who has more onus placed on his size than the others.

To answer the question about cover. IF they lose a centre and a fullback then Hook and Byrne come in. If they lose a centre and a wing then Hook and Byrne come in with H'penny moving the wing. If they lose both centres then Hook and Henson come in. While all those options are not as good as the first team, they are not exactly awful are they?

 

[dullonien]

We've got tons of cover at centre. Beck was arguably the best centre in Wales leading up to the 6 nations. He aint a small chap at 6'3" and 15st 8lb (wouldn't be surprised if those stats aren't a little old, and he's closer to 16st now). I still hope he'll be given a shot again Italy, because he's earn't it. Scott Williams has proven he's got what it takes, although possibly suffering a little from second season syndrome. Gavin Henson always appears to have the class to slot back in if he can remain injury free.

We've got two good options at fullback in Halfpenny and Byrne. Liam Williams may get a chance at some stage, but I'm not sure it'll come this 6 nations. Looks a great prospect though. There's always the option of Stoddart when he returns, who at one stage was looking odds on to be the starting fullback at the WC. Martyn Thomas is destined to be involved aswell, fingers crossed he can keep himself fit for more than a few months. The ease at which Thomas has managed to return to form so soon after two serious injuries hints to me that he'll have what it takes, he's a natural imo.

We do seem to be lacking a little on the wings in terms of backup. Unfortunately, Brew has never been able to make the step-up, such a pitty because he's such an influential player for the Dragons. See how he fares in France, maybe give him another shot if he show he can step-up there. Having Halfpenny who's just as comfortouble on the wing helps. Again Stoddart will be a good option when he returns. We shouldn't forget about Will Harries either, although he's taking a little time to return to form. Harry Robinson should be starting week in week out for the Blues in front of Czekaj, James and Mustoe (although I have a soft spot for Mustoe).

Hook is an interesting topic in itself. For so long he was needed in the centres, but now we've got an abundance of talent available there. However, we're lacking a quality backup at 10, so Hook has come full circle and is being viewed as that cover (along with covering 12, 13 and 15). Biggar hasn't lived up to expectations, and I feel he should be thrown on the scrap-heap. Tovey has alot to prove next season at the Blues, this move could make or break his international hopes (I feel it will be the former). Then there's the mercurial Matthew Morgan, I really am praying that he'll prove many wrong (and loads right) and make it professionally and internationally, because he's one of the most exciting players I've ever seen (including Shane).

At 9, we've got a few young players in the wings. I've been talking Lloyd Williams up for a long time. The first time I saw him play, I thought he'd be the future Welsh and Lions scrum-half. His speed and quality of service is one of the best I've seen. His kicking needs a little work, along with his decision making at times, but there's so much to like about him. Webb, Knoyle and the two Scarlets youngsters, Gareth Davies and Rhodri Williams, all have potential, but all have rough edges or consistency problems. Still fairly healthy for the future.

The academies are churning out quality players by the bucket load at the moment, hopefully with much more to come. Exciting times.

 

[Draggs]

There is no doubt in my mind that if our players weren't the best available, they would de dropped for someone else, regardless of size. Simply put, our large players are our best in their positions.
They also aren't simply lumbering idiots. Anyone remember France's backline in November 2010? Traille at 10, Huget on the wing, Rougerie at 13. Now that was a backline selected by size.
If Robinson, Harries, some other player between 5' and 7' was the best option over Cuthbert, they'd have the shirt. Now if Wales were focused on size, we'd have Byrne or Czekaj at 15.

We have some good little players developing as well, Luke Morgan (watch this lad), Jordan Williams, Matthew Morgan, Aled Davies. I think that there is a very good chance each of them will be capped.

 

[bushytop]

Yeah I really have no problem what so ever with depth of talent at the moment... in fact don't think its ever been this strong. The fact that the Welsh regions are struggling financially and French Top 14 clubs are poaching our 'superstars' only bodes well for the international side in future. The regions have to concentrate even more on developing young talent and they'll get games at a competitive level (Pro 12) due to the exodus of home grown stars and MUCH fewer overseas signings.

The depth is good now but I'm confident it will just improve.

 

[HowieLO6]

Halfpenny is 13st? You have got to be kidding me. Can only assume roughly half of that weight is tucked away in his guns. Tends to make one feel particularly inadequate!

And this is the rugby equivalent of #firstworldproblems. A fine mix of youth and experience, guile and brute force. Weight and height has little to do with it, simply a case of a gifted generation of backs, and one that i'm extremely envious of.

 

[DuncTheDoodle]

The idea of back-up has given me a terrific idea that'll keep me not-bored for at least 5 minutes. These are Wales' first 3-choice backlines, without using the same player multiple times-

First-Choice

Phillips, Priestland, Cuthbert, Roberts, Davies, North, Halfpenny

Second-Choice

Lloyd Williams, Hook, Stoddart, Beck, Scott Williams, Liam Williams, Byrne

Third-Choice

Webb, Stephen Jones, Brew, Henson, Bishop, Robinson/Tom James, Martyn Thomas

From that, Martyn Thomas is the only player without squad experience in the past year, showing just how effective we've been in bringing youngsters through in the past few years. Even then, someone who likes him could put Czekaj in his place, who played at 15 in 2010's autumn internationals. They're also not particularly small, either.

 

[Robert Prosser]

Nice to see some good discussion about the back up Wales have got and I agree we are well covered in all positions but the one which would be the wing, the fact they are big means nothing it was just used has my ***le the thread is more for discussion about what we have in reserve, I struggle to see who is a good option on the wings.

Some great responses though really enjoying this forum so far