(Very) early thoughts on the 2017 Lions

[Groundhog]

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I don't understand what Howley's about. He's been so poor he should just stick to thinking about Wales and nothing else beside. I'm ok with the rest.

Re. North, I think that whenWales are playing poorly people like to create scapegoats and hoist the blame on a smaller number of individuals - i.e focusing on how bad Cuthbert has been and not seeing that North has been AWOL too.

HOWEVER, I do believe that in a good setup with an invigorated team spirit he will come good and I agree that to date he's just about the only eligible candidate to have demonstrated world class form. I think if you're picking your best team I'd like to see him involved. It would however, feel "undemocratic" for want of a better word because there's a thick wad of english wingers who have been better than him for some time and we'll definitely be in danger of sparking up the old favouritism disputes of last tour.

The reason I would probably choose North is because despite their flashes of brilliance I categorically do not trust the following:

1) May
2) Yarde
3) Zebo
4) Earls
5) (obviously) Cuthbert

Especially Zebo who's been playing his bootake off and made an impressive number of try saving tackles this season

 

[ratsapprentice]

It's that Flash Gordon-esque "Z" try celebration thing he does with his hands.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

I don't know, but Wilkinson and Ben Ryan have been mentioned.

I think if George North was a Kiwi he'd have a better strike rate than Savea.

Big fan.

This.

North is faster than Savea.
North is bigger than Savea.
North is stronger than Savea.
North is likely better under the high ball than Savea.
North is better in defence than Savea.
North has a better step than Savea.

You give North the opportunities that Savea gets for the All Blacks and he's the best finisher in World Rugby. He just never gets any decent ball when he's outside of Biggar-Roberts-Davies or Mylar-Burrell-Pisi. And don't forget that Webb isn't the most generous of Scrum Halves. Every time North gets the ball he's in traffic and it's pretty damn impressive that sometimes he's able to get out of it. As I've said before, for the Lions, stick him at the end of Sexton-Henshaw-Joseph and he will cause mayhem.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

When is Aki eligible for Ireland?

 

[Groundhog]

Oktober 2017 Herr Tigs

It's that Flash Gordon-esque "Z" try celebration thing he does with his hands.

Aber das ist nur eine Teil seines ,X-Factors'. Heutzutage ist er ein sehr fleißiger Spieler. Seine Abwehr wird verbessert, und er hat schon die Luftüberlegenheit. Seine Positionierung war weit von optimal, aber nochmal wird verbessert. Man lernt Disziplin unter Schmidt.

 

[MikeTheNative]

This.

North is faster than Savea.
North is bigger than Savea.
North is stronger than Savea.
North is likely better under the high ball than Savea.
North is better in defence than Savea.
North has a better step than Savea.

You give North the opportunities that Savea gets for the All Blacks and he's the best finisher in World Rugby. He just never gets any decent ball when he's outside of Biggar-Roberts-Davies or Mylar-Burrell-Pisi. And don't forget that Webb isn't the most generous of Scrum Halves. Every time North gets the ball he's in traffic and it's pretty damn impressive that sometimes he's able to get out of it. As I've said before, for the Lions, stick him at the end of Sexton-Henshaw-Joseph and he will cause mayhem.

He is really down on confidence at the moment but is one of the best wingers in the world on his day. But as you said he never gets ball in hand for Wales, he most have had only a handful of runs this entire Autumn series.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Oktober 2017 Herr Tigs

Aber das ist nur eine Teil seines ,X-Factors'. Heutzutage ist er ein sehr fleißiger Spieler. Seine Abwehr wird verbessert, und er hat schon die Luftüberlegenheit. Seine Positionierung war weit von optimal, aber nochmal wird verbessert. Man lernt Disziplin unter Schmidt.

Nein... Ich habe keine kuli, und deine muter ist dick.

 

[The Jones Boy]

Zebo
Johnny May
George North
Liam Williams
There are plenty of quality players on the wings up here in the northern hemisphere.
The four blokes I named are particularly good and although George North has the least form can you imagine how good he could be if he didn't have to play with Cuthbert and having someone like Joseph inside him to ensure he was involved in the game.?
He has seemed to be a bit injury prone lately but when he's on he's a very enjoyable player to watch.

 

[BPM]

I don't understand what Howley's about. He's been so poor he should just stick to thinking about Wales and nothing else beside. I'm ok with the rest.

Re. North, I think that whenWales are playing poorly people like to create scapegoats and hoist the blame on a smaller number of individuals - i.e focusing on how bad Cuthbert has been and not seeing that North has been AWOL too.

HOWEVER, I do believe that in a good setup with an invigorated team spirit he will come good and I agree that to date he's just about the only eligible candidate to have demonstrated world class form. I think if you're picking your best team I'd like to see him involved. It would however, feel "undemocratic" for want of a better word because there's a thick wad of english wingers who have been better than him for some time and we'll definitely be in danger of sparking up the old favouritism disputes of last tour.

The reason I would probably choose North is because despite their flashes of brilliance I categorically do not trust the following:

1) May
2) Yarde
3) Zebo
4) Earls
5) (obviously) Cuthbert

With the exception of May, I'm not sure any of those you've listed are genuine contenders on recent form?

Zebo or Earls could go I guess but surely only as squad players. I can't see either starting for the Lions.

Yarde and Cuthbert shouldn't even be close.

 

[Peat]

Wee bit disheartened by the announcement of Howley. Borthwick and Farrell you can't argue with as decent choices but Howley I don't understand. Hopefully Gatland will approach this like last summer's tour of NZ rather than with his usual style.

 

[AzaMatt]

North was outstanding on the last lions tour because he actually got given a sniff of the ball and hes lethal when given the chance. problem with wales is that they do not get it out to him fast enough

 

[profitius]

North was outstanding on the last lions tour because he actually got given a sniff of the ball and hes lethal when given the chance. problem with wales is that they do not get it out to him fast enough

At least he gets some ball with Wales. In Northampton, North getting his hands on the ball is as rare as hens teeth.

 

[AzaMatt]

At least he gets some ball with Wales. In Northampton, North getting his hands on the ball is as rare as hens teeth.

ive only seen a handful of northampton games but he didnt feature much in those come to think of it. surprised that he signed an extension

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

When you've someone as potentially potent as North I just don't get why every effort isn't made to get the ball in his hands. He's one of a select band of British players over the last few years who I really wish had been English (of course he is really...). North on one wing and Watson or May on the other covers all the bases. Actually move Watson to 15 and play all 3!

 

[Saint4805]

At the risk of sounding biased I'm surprised no-one has taken note of Tommy Seymour's strengths and form. Really good under the high ball, plenty of gas, decent defensively and an outstanding finisher. Has also shown great consistency over the past 2-3 years.

 

[Groundhog]

At the risk of sounding biased I'm surprised no-one has taken note of Tommy Seymour's strengths and form. Really good under the high ball, plenty of gas, decent defensively and an outstanding finisher. Has also shown great consistency over the past 2-3 years.

Agreed. Great player, well rounded and would be receiving plaudits if he played for a better side than Scots. Not hugely flashy but I rate him very highly and he can break a game.

 

[munstermuffin]

I think the whole North debate shows real question all over. Will players be picked on form or reputation?
Dangerous gamble going to NZ

 

[BPM]

At the risk of sounding biased I'm surprised no-one has taken note of Tommy Seymour's strengths and form. Really good under the high ball, plenty of gas, decent defensively and an outstanding finisher. Has also shown great consistency over the past 2-3 years.

On recent form, Seymour would definitely make my squad.

Putting form and injuries to one side, I'd say North and Watson are probably the closest to being certainties, along with Liam Williams as a 'back three' player who's just as likely to play on the wing as he is at 15. After that, I'd say it's a scrap between May, Nowell, Earls, Zebo, Seymour and Maitland for two places.

Personally, I'd go for North, Watson, May and Seymour with Williams in the squad covering both wing and fullback. However, I do think form is a bigger factor with wingers than it is with some other positions, so there will definitely be a case for whoever is scoring the most tries and playing with the most confidence. If that's not one of the four I've selected, I'd be 100% prepared to swap them for a winger on a hot streak.

- - - Updated - - -

I think the whole North debate shows real question all over. Will players be picked on form or reputation?
Dangerous gamble going to NZ

Exactly, if North doesn't have a good 6N while someone less fancied like Nowell scores a few tries, it would really be the acid test for Gatland's selection policy.

Judging by his selection of Howley as attack coach, I'm a touch concerned that familiarity/Gatland's preferences may be a bigger factor than form.

 

[jcon]

My possible 2017 Lions Team
Team, Squad
15 Stuart Hogg, Leigh Halfpenny, Mike Brown
14 Anthony Watson, Andrew Trimble
13 Robbie Henshaw, Jonathan Joseph, Jonathan Davies
12 Owen Farrell, Manu Tuilagi, Scott Williams
11 George North, Jack Nowell,
10 George Ford, Dan Biggar, Johnny Sexton
9 Conor Murray, Rhys Webb, Ben Youngs
8 Billy Vunipola,
7 James Haskell, Sam Warburton,
6 Taulupe Faletau, CJ Stander, Justin Tipuric
5 George Kruis, Steffon Armitage, Alun Wynn Jones
4 Maro Itoje, Iain Henderson, Courtney Lawes
3 WP Nel, Dan Cole, Samson Lee
2 Dylan Hartley ©, Rory Best
1 Mako Vunipola, Jack McGrath, Cian Healy

 

[Bada-Bing!]

At the risk of sounding biased I'm surprised no-one has taken note of Tommy Seymour's strengths and form. Really good under the high ball, plenty of gas, decent defensively and an outstanding finisher. Has also shown great consistency over the past 2-3 years.

I like Seymour - especially impressed with him under the high ball and is a good finisher. However, I suspect Gatland may favour Maitland over him, having picked him on the last Lions tour, that he can cover wing and full back and also being a Kiwi knows the NZ conditions well.