USA news & politics

[dirty harry]

Also worth noting that University teaches far more than "facts about the course subject" - that's lower education. University teaches broadened horizons, critical thinking and evaluation skills etc etc - which is why even degrees in irrelevant to the job are preferable to no degree when it comes to employment.
People who think that Uni just teaches "facts about the course subject" mostly didn't go to university, and assume it's just a continuation of school, or failed at university - even if they ended up with a degree, even a 1st, or as valedictorium. Hell, even small colleges that only teach 1 subject matter (such as mine) you learn far more than just the subject matter.

This is exactly why both ends of the political spectrum hates universities and intellectuals - because they can see through the rabble-rousing bullshit (apart from the ones who got their degree, but failed at university learning) - and generally, can both articulate and bring the receipts.

This is a very valid point, butni think it's old way of thinking. The world has changed (no offence meant).

Degrees used to stand graduates out for just these reasons, rounded developed thought processes, organisation and professionalism skills etc...

However for a number of reasons, these aren't desirable, or taught.

The saturation of degree educated people to the market devalued the degree, and the requirements for degree educated people in general has increased across the markets (to lower standard jobs) but also decreased in value.

Not to mention the current job market, employer attitudes to certain degrees, and career salaries.

https://www.spglobal.com/market-intelligence/en/news-insights/articles/2024/12/college-degrees-losing-edge-as-graduates-find-splintered-weaker-us-job-market-86507076

In the new world, over educated under earning graduates are everywhere, the job market has been decimated by them.

I think if you were to make the argument longer term, degree educated people are more focused and have a better skillset to succeed, because stats prove that within 5 years they compete with uneducated people for low paid jobs, but even then, with the implementation of AI, and tools to skate through a degree without an original thought will devalue the degree even more.

There's a running joke that 5 years from now we will have the lowest skilled surgeons, engineers, doctors and pilots of all time, as those who study these subjects, and, as you aptly mention, fail at uni, can AI ify their way through the degree and take a spot of a determined motivated and professional person.

 

[dirty harry]

I don’t think any president has set a “don’t give a **** about anyone other than myself” standard in the way Trump has. Not even close. Whether I am ideologically opposed to some republican president I am sure they cared about America, its institutions, people and constitution. Trump doesn’t care about any of that. He’s unique in that sense.

I was talking specifically of the anti semitism on campus to be fair.

But I'd also counter that, Biden knew he wasn't fit to be president, he didn't care to step down until absolute humiliation on stage, and even now talks about being president for another term. Most Democrats and Republicans are in it for personal gain first, USA 2nd, can you name any that you would say we're country before party?

Obama accepted a peace prize while bombing Syria, and killed and deported more civilians than any other president... so far.

One could make the argument that Trump is constitutionally aligned, 1st and 2nd amendment, illegal immigration, and America first policies. Now I'd agree he's going to personally gain, although the presidency has cost him billions, his media company only just recouped that (how Truth social is spearheading that kind of success I have no idea).

Ultimately, I put Trump in the same basket as most of them, pond scum who shouldn't be trusted. And that's where I think we differ, you put Trump in there alone and trust politicians in general?

 

[Welsh Exile]

I was talking specifically of the anti semitism on campus to be fair.

But I'd also counter that, Biden knew he wasn't fit to be president, he didn't care to step down until absolute humiliation on stage, and even now talks about being president for another term. Most Democrats and Republicans are in it for personal gain first, USA 2nd, can you name any that you would say we're country before party?

Obama accepted a peace prize while bombing Syria, and killed and deported more civilians than any other president... so far.

One could make the argument that Trump is constitutionally aligned, 1st and 2nd amendment, illegal immigration, and America first policies. Now I'd agree he's going to personally gain, although the presidency has cost him billions, his media company only just recouped that (how Truth social is spearheading that kind of success I have no idea).

Ultimately, I put Trump in the same basket as most of them, pond scum who shouldn't be trusted. And that's where I think we differ, you put Trump in there alone and trust politicians in general?

I completely disagree. Biden is a good example. I'd say he cares deeply about America. He probably wanted to stay on due to the serious threat Trump poses. But yeah, you won't get any arguments from me about him not being up to the job. Having said that, and please don't think I'm joking when I say this, but I would vote for a chimpanzee with learning difficulties before I voted for Trump and you'd get better outcomes too.

I'm not saying personal gain isn't a factor, maybe even the most important for some, but call me naive, I think a lot of presidents/congressman and woman/civil servants etc get into the job because they value public service.

I don't know how Obama accepting an award is proof that he didn't care about America.

 

[dirty harry]

I completely disagree. Biden is a good example. I'd say he cares deeply about America. He probably wanted to stay on due to the serious threat Trump poses. But yeah, you won't get any arguments from me about him not being up to the job. Having said that, and please don't think I'm joking when I say this, but I would vote for a chimpanzee with learning difficulties before I voted for Trump and you'd get better outcomes too.

I'm not saying personal gain isn't a factor, maybe even the most important for some, but call me naive, I think a lot of presidents/congressman and woman/civil servants etc get into the job because they value public service.

I don't know how Obama accepting an award is proof that he didn't care about America.

I mean I can't agree Biden was USA focused more than personally (and this is what I mean, not care vs not care). He, and the Democrats blew the chance to run a primary, and get a quality candidate, who in my opinion would've beaten Trump handily. I also think Sanders beats Trump 2016 but that's another story lol.

Biden spent 50 years plus in politics, meaning he took a lifetime of money from the public, I just can't give credit to a lifetime politician, who became super rich and lived a lifetime of luxury on public money. He has transitioned on numerous policies (I won't say flip flipped because decades change attitudes and societies). But things like proudly staying he wrote the 94 crime bill 30 years later doesn't sit well with me, nor does the pardons of friends and family. That action screamed of guilt, knowing Trump would do the same things he did while in office.

I'd also point to actions such as protection of his son, that was personal over country 100%, the laptop cover up pressures, Zuckerberg apologising for complying with the government about it etc, suppression of covid speech, especially by medical professionals...

Then there were the blatant lies in campaign, student loan forgiveness, that was personal over country too.

Offering to fight civilians lol, it happened way more than you think.

Ultimately, and I don't want this to become a, if your criticising Biden your pro Trump thing, I can get on board with your assertion that politicians begin to help their constituents, but they are corrupted very early on, especially with the system in the USA, where people who earn 250k dollars per year, become billionaires inexplicably, spend 4,5,6 decades in government perennially failing at their duties, and doing things the average person would be locked up for on a regular basis.

Just look at the special counsels comments on charging Biden with crimes, he's a well meaning elderly man with a bad memory not worth pursuing. Pure corruption!

 

[ncurd]

3 pages....oh this thread is waste of time now too....

 

[McTallshort]

They could do a do your own research course with lectures from great people like Tucker Calson, Jordan Peterson and Alex Jones.

 

[Welsh Exile]

I mean I can't agree Biden was USA focused more than personally (and this is what I mean, not care vs not care). He, and the Democrats blew the chance to run a primary, and get a quality candidate, who in my opinion would've beaten Trump handily. I also think Sanders beats Trump 2016 but that's another story lol.

Biden spent 50 years plus in politics, meaning he took a lifetime of money from the public, I just can't give credit to a lifetime politician, who became super rich and lived a lifetime of luxury on public money. He has transitioned on numerous policies (I won't say flip flipped because decades change attitudes and societies). But things like proudly staying he wrote the 94 crime bill 30 years later doesn't sit well with me, nor does the pardons of friends and family. That action screamed of guilt, knowing Trump would do the same things he did while in office.

I'd also point to actions such as protection of his son, that was personal over country 100%, the laptop cover up pressures, Zuckerberg apologising for complying with the government about it etc, suppression of covid speech, especially by medical professionals...

Then there were the blatant lies in campaign, student loan forgiveness, that was personal over country too.

Offering to fight civilians lol, it happened way more than you think.

Ultimately, and I don't want this to become a, if your criticising Biden your pro Trump thing, I can get on board with your assertion that politicians begin to help their constituents, but they are corrupted very early on, especially with the system in the USA, where people who earn 250k dollars per year, become billionaires inexplicably, spend 4,5,6 decades in government perennially failing at their duties, and doing things the average person would be locked up for on a regular basis.

Just look at the special counsels comments on charging Biden with crimes, he's a well meaning elderly man with a bad memory not worth pursuing. Pure corruption!

This is my point though, people make choices, most of the time, based on what they think is best. Sometimes that works out sometimes it doesn't and sometimes, for sure, people put individual needs before their party/country.

I don't think anything you've written there suggest otherwise. I can take the pardoning hunter as a fair point but I don't think that outweighs decades of public service and coming into office at a time when America needed a calm head and someone to steer the ship after Covid and at least try to bring people together. I think Biden did well in that sense and felt an overwhelming sense of duty to America and its citizens. But I can't look into his soul of course. (Not that I believe in souls obviously)

I think it's great, necessary even, to be sceptical about politicians and their motives but you, more often than not, cross over to cynicism which I try to avoid if I can.

 

[dirty harry]

This is my point though, people make choices, most of the time, based on what they think is best. Sometimes that works out sometimes it doesn't and sometimes, for sure, people put individual needs before their party/country.

I don't think anything you've written there suggest otherwise. I can take the pardoning hunter as a fair point but I don't think that outweighs decades of public service and coming into office at a time when America needed a calm head and someone to steer the ship after Covid and at least try to bring people together. I think Biden did well in that sense and felt an overwhelming sense of duty to America and its citizens. But I can't look into his soul of course. (Not that I believe in souls obviously)

I think it's great, necessary even, to be sceptical about politicians and their motives but you, more often than not, cross over to cynicism which I try to avoid if I can.

You sound like my missus hahaha ye I do creep from pessimism to cynicism, but I think that's necessary with politicians.

I'm not claiming Biden was all bad, there were statistical positives that came out of his presidency, as all presidents have them. There will be at times when personal interests align with country interests, covid is a good example, but I'd argue Biden (and his team) were over zealous in locking down, and reopening too slowly, while suppressing opinion online etc... but most governments did similar, they all mist have been privy to data I was not (how dare they).

As you'll know with Trump mistruths, I spent time defending Biden during his presidency, mostly from stupid accusations where he would mumble and stutter and be called cognitively unable to cope, which in hindsight looks more suspicious with the info coming out now.

My big fear from the Biden presidency, aside from Afghan shambles, and the power vacuum encouraging Putin and Hamas to act, was how complicit and on side the vast majority of the media was in spinning any story on behalf of Biden. Same happened with Obama, when the government and main stream media align, that's dangerous. And it's partially why I'm less concerned with Trump, he farts and 50 media outlets call him a fascist psychopath never before seen by American politics, that's a better safeguard from authoritarianism IMO.

Interestingly, let's say a candidate stood against Trump, an actual right winger, wanted abortion to be made illegal, regressing same sex marriage, wanting to align US government with the bible, anti immigration hard lined, supported by the vast majority of Republicans, and stood on all religious right wing policies...

Would you not consider Trump then in that scenario?

 

[Saintjay]

3 pages....oh this thread is waste of time now too....

But not if you want to debate the merits of a wizarding degree from Hogwart's.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

They could do a do your own research course with lectures from great people like Tucker Calson, Jordan Peterson and Alex Jones.

The Jordan Peterson course on semantic fog. I've seen some videos of the guy and for every valid point he makes, there is a deluge of pseudo-intellectual crap where he just tries to drag the entire thing into semantics and being a massive pedant. He's also very quick to accuse others of being smartasses whilst that's pretty much his entire thing. The guy flat out refuses to ever be pinned down to anything. One exchange pretty much went like this:

Student: "So you're a Christian"
Peterson: "I never said I was a Christian!"
Student: "So you're not Christian?"
Peterson: "No I didn't say that"
Student: "So are you are Christian or not? It's a yes no question"
Peterson: "No it isn't."

 

[Welsh Exile]

The Jordan Peterson course on semantic fog. I've seen some videos of the guy and for every valid point he makes, there is a deluge of pseudo-intellectual crap where he just tries to drag the entire thing into semantics and being a massive pedant. He's also very quick to accuse others of being smartasses whilst that's pretty much his entire thing. The guy flat out refuses to ever be pinned down to anything. One exchange pretty much went like this:

Student: "So you're a Christian"
Peterson: "I never said I was a Christian!"
Student: "So you're not Christian?"
Peterson: "No I didn't say that"
Student: "So are you are Christian or not? It's a yes no question"
Peterson: "No it isn't."

And that's before you get to the metaphorical substrates.

 

[dirty harry]

I dont hate JP, the links between him and Tate are laughable, but ultimately he is unlikable.
I tried to read 12 rules for life on holiday about a decade ago, there are decent insights, but I struggled with some of the pseudo science stuff and gave up.

And that's before you get to the metaphorical substrates.

 

[dirty harry]

I dont hate JP, the links between him and Tate are laughable, but ultimately he is unlikable.
I tried to read 12 rules for life on holiday about a decade ago, there are decent insights, but I struggled with some of the pseudo science stuff and gave up.

And that's before you get to the metaphorical substrates.

 

[Welsh Exile]

I dont hate JP, the links between him and Tate are laughable, but ultimately he is unlikable.
I tried to read 12 rules for life on holiday about a decade ago, there are decent insights, but I struggled with some of the pseudo science stuff and gave up.

I think he’s worth listening to on psychology stuff as he’s clearly a knowledgeable person in that field but he doesn’t half chat a lot of **** when it comes to philosophy, politics, history, sociology or just about anything else.

 

[dirty harry]

I dont hate JP, the links between him and Tate are laughable, but ultimately he is unlikable.
I tried to read 12 rules for life on holiday about a decade ago, there are decent insights, but I struggled with some of the pseudo science stuff and gave up.

Jesus no maybe 7 years, feels like another lifetime

 

[dirty harry]

I think he’s worth listening to on psychology stuff as he’s clearly a knowledgeable person in that field but he doesn’t half chat a lot of **** when it comes to philosophy, politics, history, sociology or just about anything else.

It's the anchoring in religion I think that got me, I actually commended his stance regarding C-16 originally, but off the back of that he became obsessed with celebrity, and we'll I think it corrupted him.

I'm waiting for the day his name doesn't have a buzz for views, and we see him in a celebrity cheerleading or in a Bonnie Blue video...

 

[Welsh Exile]

It's the anchoring in religion I think that got me, I actually commended his stance regarding C-16 originally, but off the back of that he became obsessed with celebrity, and we'll I think it corrupted him.

I'm waiting for the day his name doesn't have a buzz for views, and we see him in a celebrity cheerleading or in a Bonnie Blue video...

I think his anchoring in Christianity is a grift. He’s managed to find a way to grift both atheists and theists.

 

[General Melchett]

3 pages....oh this thread is waste of time now too....

I'm just thankful that this thread was pure and virgin like for about a week. I'll cherish those first few posts.

Just imagine when AI is able to infiltrate forums with an army of contrarian bots.

 

[ncurd]

I'm just thankful that this thread was pure and virgin like for about a week. I'll cherish those first few posts.

Just imagine when AI is able to infiltrate forums with an army of contrarian bots.

Just join X/Twitter for the experience.

 

[Saintjay]

I'm just here the weird Bonnie Blue obsession and 236 mentions she gets.