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Third Test: Australia v British and Irish Lions (06/07/13)

Yeah, I'm still trying to work that out too.
To j'nuh above - how many times?! It wasn't even a second string. A 2nds would have included Lee Byrne, James Hook, Ryan Jones, Lloyd Williams, Scott Williams, etc...
It was a development tour that took players I had never heard of and admitted struggled to make the step up to the physical demands of international rugby.
I say second string because there were a few second stringers in there... Liam Williams, Dan Biggar (first choice?), Lloyd Williams was on tour, King will be involved soon enough, Bevington, Brad Davies etc. My point stands that some positions need just a little more depth in.
 
re: Wales' weaknesses, I think depth is a pretty big problem in some areas. A second string England wouldn't have lost to Japan. But I think Wales need some more development in second string props, a lock to back up Evans/AWJ, more depth in the half-backs and they need Dirksen to qualify asap or for Eli Wales to make some movements into the squad. (Or others.)


Do you think a guy as humble as BO'D wanted special treatment? His reputation is in part based on how much of a class act the guy is. I know he won't have been happy to have been dropped, but I don't think it's in his nature to want a song and dance about him in reaction. In fact, I bet anything that he's embarrassed by the events of the last week.
I agreed with it as I said its just my view like in the way Davies was retained but BOD dropped but as I said they got it bang on today but just my view as I said I know alot will differ and I understand 100%
 
Most importantly Wales need a better 10 imo than Biggar currently is. I think the skills of the southern hemipshere 'ball-playing' 10's is an important part of what has for so long set them up as a class above - and in that sense, Sexton is the exception that proves the rule in terms of the northern hemipshere.

Out of interest, who would be considered Wales' best prospect at 10? Steffan Jones looks exciting?

Not sure where you've seen this. Steffan Jones certainly does NOT look exciting. He will struggle to keep Burton and Tovey out the Drags side never mind be a prospect for Wales. There's nothing wrong with Biggar, no he's not the best but he doesn't mess up like "ball playing 10's" like Hook. And playing a kicking 10 didn't seem to hurt England when they were on top, nor did it South Africa when they were on top with Steyn.

Priestland is surely ahead of Biggar and plenty of years in him

No. No. No. Just no. Not good enough, unless we want more close losses to Australia with idiots who kick the ball to them with 30 seconds left.

The point about 9 is spot on imo. We've had a few prospects that haven't developed as hoped, namely Lloyd Williams and Tavis Knoyle. I'm going to put my money on Rhodri Williams, very exciting player, but Aled Davies and Tom Habberfield are also exciting prospects. Hopefully one of them, along with Lloyd, Tavis and even Webb (if he stopped being a complete f*ckwit), will really push on because I feel Phillips is holding back this Welsh team to some extent.

Lloyd Williams was pants in Japan, Tavis isn't international class, Webb isn't even regional class. And to be honest, they have all had chances (Webb shouldn't have had a chance in the first place) and not good enough, time to move on to the next generation Aled Davies, Jonathan Evans, Rhodri Williams and Habberfield.

As for 10, I think Biggar is a fine player, and can add the controlling influence required at test level. Sexton didn't do anything this Lions tour that Biggar isn't capable of doing (not to say Sexton doesn't have more in his locker in terms of attacking threat). Patchell is the player that I see developing into the role of an attacking 10. Sam Davies is an almost carbon copy of Biggar tbh. Matthew Morgan, what I'd give to see him develop and fulfil his huge potential, but in his case I really do think size is too big a hurdle. I'm beginning to think he and the O's should consider switching him to the wing, where his size isn't as exposed, in the same way Shane switched from 9 to the wing, especially now Sam Davies is hot on his heels.

Hook......... I honestly don't know. He appears to be completely out of the picture. He's not been great in his international cameo's over the past couple of years either.

Since when did Biggar get run over by little 5ft 9in wingers? http://youtu.be/k992rhbVDRg?t=8m2s

I wish people would just give the spot to Biggar now and let him establish himself, he's perfectly good enough. Not every player is going to be a World XV player, all the great teams have just solid players too. Hook and Priestland are both prone to ****ups, Biggar is by far the best mentally.

re: Wales' weaknesses, I think depth is a pretty big problem in some areas. A second string England wouldn't have lost to Japan. But I think Wales need some more development in second string props, a lock to back up Evans/AWJ, more depth in the half-backs and they need Dirksen to qualify asap or for Eli Wales to make some movements into the squad. (Or others.)

Back up lock is Charteris, there is also Bradley Davies. Should be enough wingers with Eli Walker and Harry Robinson, and Dirksen could qualify earlier than expected as he has married a Welsh woman. Paul James is a good reserve prop. Tighthead and scrum half are the worst positions. Phillips is approaching the end as a good quality 9, but he could get to 100 caps based on the lack of alternatives stepping up.

Yeah, I'm still trying to work that out too.
To j'nuh above - how many times?! It wasn't even a second string. A 2nds would have included Lee Byrne, James Hook, Ryan Jones, Lloyd Williams, Scott Williams, etc...
It was a development tour that took players I had never heard of and admitted struggled to make the step up to the physical demands of international rugby.

Lloyd Williams did play and was awful. Byrne, Hook and Scott Williams wouldn't have made a difference to the result. Ryan Jones being left behind was an arrogant and stupid thing to do by the coaches, fuelled by the stupidity of those ignorant enough to think they could take Pontypool 2nds and turn up in a foreign country for an easy 20-30 point canter.
 
God, this has changed into a welsh thread................come on guys, this was about the Lions which included some (alright a lot of) welsh guys.....can you move the debate on the future of welsh rugby to another thread?

Just asking!!
 
Agreed with what your saying Duck just meant he's ahead of Biggar. But when I make this comment its not a dig at any Welsh region but if ye ever want a top 10 the way the game is going ye need a region to consistently playing HEC QF, SF or final year in year out with Welsh 10. I mean you look at Munster did it with ROG, Leinster with Sexton, Ulster before with DH now PJ I presume, Leicester with Flood Sarries with Farrell eventually when Hodgson phases out. Like been honest Biggar not good enough for Ospreys, Priestland isn't consistent with Scarlets and Cardiff and Dragons don't have quality
 
God, this has changed into a welsh thread................come on guys, this was about the Lions which included some (alright a lot of) welsh guys.....can you move the debate on the future of welsh rugby to another thread?

Just asking!!

Yeah, that was probably my fault for bringing up the comment about it maybe helping Wales in the future against Austrailia, and possibly SA and NZ. Sorry.
 
Agreed with what your saying Duck just meant he's ahead of Biggar. But when I make this comment its not a dig at any Welsh region but if ye ever want a top 10 the way the game is going ye need a region to consistently playing HEC QF, SF or final year in year out with Welsh 10. I mean you look at Munster did it with ROG, Leinster with Sexton, Ulster before with DH now PJ I presume, Leicester with Flood Sarries with Farrell eventually when Hodgson phases out. Like been honest Biggar not good enough for Ospreys, Priestland isn't consistent with Scarlets and Cardiff and Dragons don't have quality

But he's not ahead of Biggar though, he was abysmal in November and by all accounts lost it in the head. He might not even be the Turks #1 if their other 10 hadn't jumped ship.

Fat chance you will see a Welsh in the H Cup knockout rounds unless they are in a French team or Nigel Owens. Ulster (other than that fluke win in 1999), were not year in year out in the H Cup knockout rounds with Humph btw. Irish are in an envious position in that they are getting sides achieving so regularly in Europe, mpt realistic to emulate at this stage fir Welsh, recovery needed.

Not sure what you're on about Biggar not being good enough for the Ospreys, he's one of the most important players left now, done really well with Fotuali'i. Fast becoming ine of the the most underrated and under appreciated fly halves I've seen. He could create 2 tries, 2 drop goals and dominate territory brilliantly and people would still not be bothered. I bet if he started kicking goals all the time from Adam's hard work like 1/2p does and improve point stats he would magically start getting a lot more credit.
 
Fantastic result for the lions!!

Thank god we finally saw 0.5p play some attacking rugby from full back! I though Phillips was shocking once again, running down blind allays every time. Murray really made a difference when he came on. Also though Sexton behaved poorly when he went off, shacking his head after being subbed. In the last 2 games the lions have tried to lose the game, partly due to his poor game management. Don't think Lydiate has done anything to suggest he was the best 6 on tour. O'Brien was brilliant!! Should have been playing since minute 1 of the tests.

The forwards were brilliant today, except Hibbard in the lineout....

:)
 
Have to say I love the way the Welsh were all like 'it's the best of the NH, no bias we win and lose as one', now they're like 'So now Wales have beaten Australia who will be able to beat us ever again??' LOL!

Looking forward to Wales losing by the odd point to all the SH opposition this autumn. It's a fact that Wales always choke...
 
The forwards were brilliant today, except Hibbard in the lineout....

Thought the lineout went ok today. Not perfect, but it makes a world of difference to get some tail ball to attack off. The last throw just before he went off was his worst of the game.
 
But he's not ahead of Biggar though, he was abysmal in November and by all accounts lost it in the head. He might not even be the Turks #1 if their other 10 hadn't jumped ship.

Fat chance you will see a Welsh in the H Cup knockout rounds unless they are in a French team or Nigel Owens. Ulster (other than that fluke win in 1999), were not year in year out in the H Cup knockout rounds with Humph btw. Irish are in an envious position in that they are getting sides achieving so regularly in Europe, mpt realistic to emulate at this stage fir Welsh, recovery needed.

Not sure what you're on about Biggar not being good enough for the Ospreys, he's one of the most important players left now, done really well with Fotuali'i. Fast becoming ine of the the most underrated and under appreciated fly halves I've seen. He could create 2 tries, 2 drop goals and dominate territory brilliantly and people would still not be bothered. I bet if he started kicking goals all the time from Adam's hard work like 1/2p does and improve point stats he would magically start getting a lot more credit.
I mean yes Biggar is important to O's but not at a top level. I don't follow Scarlets as close and so RP is rated in my eyes on time he was in form. B
 
Did anyone else notice Roberts and JD2(I think) 'sorting out' Beale after he tried to shoulder charge Sexton after his try?
You can see if from the side shot, was quit amusing.

When I say 'sorting out', it wasn't nasty, just made him look like a bit of an idiot ;)
 
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Yeah, that was probably my fault for bringing up the comment about it maybe helping Wales in the future against Austrailia, and possibly SA and NZ. Sorry.

You were having a laugh with that comment too. Beating the worst Aus team of the last 10-20 years is not going to help Wales against the ABs or SA. For one you won't be getting a penalty at every scrum against either of those sides. When Tomane and Leli'ifano are starting then you know it's a **** team, let alone O'Conner at 10 and their ridiculous props. Genia is the only player who would make SA or the ABs.
 
Have to say I love the way the Welsh were all like 'it's the best of the NH, no bias we win and lose as one', now they're like 'So now Wales have beaten Australia who will be able to beat us ever again??' LOL!

Looking forward to Wales losing by the odd point to all the SH opposition this autumn. It's a fact that Wales always choke...

I didn't see any Welsh, Irish, English or Scots. I just saw Lions.
 
j'nuh - I can see what you mean, I hope the media dont spin too much, as this should never be seen as a 'Welsh' victory - this is a LIONS victory and that's that. That's what got me riled up, I can understand criticising selections, but kicking off to that extent and saying you're not supporting the team just because there's too many players from one country is just ridiculous.
And anyway, Corbs SOB and Parling were huge today, outstanding, hard working game from all three - I especially thought Lydiate and SOB linked well at the breakdown. Sexton was magnificent as always and Bowe had a very good afternoon too, and was instrumental in a couple of the tries. Murray was a big improvement on Phillips (who was disappointing) and and Youngs was excellent off the bench for that last 30 mins.

You're kidding right? The guys I was watching it with couldn't believe how bad he was, they were convinced a club rugby 10 could have had the exact same game. All he did was send up bombs, and only about 2 of them were any good.
 
You were having a laugh with that comment too. Beating the worst Aus team of the last 10-20 years is not going to help Wales against the ABs or SA. For one you won't be getting a penalty at every scrum against either of those sides. When Tomane and Leli'ifano are starting then you know it's a **** team, let alone O'Conner at 10 and their ridiculous props. Genia is the only player who would make SA or the ABs.

I was talking in terms of mental solidity. Our recent games against both Aus and SA have been very close encounters, and we've fallen just short. Most have put this down to some sort of mental block. This Lions tour could possibly help the players involved get over that mental block, and enable Wales to convert some of the games that over the past few years they have lost.
 
For me there wasn't much difference between 2 teams. Lions were better in the scrum but the other aspects the game was even.

Result liar to me, could have won either.

Regards
 
Thought the lineout went ok today. Not perfect, but it makes a world of difference to get some tail ball to attack off. The last throw just before he went off was his worst of the game.

Hibbard was fine. If 1 lineout makes him bad at the lineout then goodness knows how he would describe some of Best's form this year where he has lost 5 or 6.

I mean yes Biggar is important to O's but not at a top level. I don't follow Scarlets as close and so RP is rated in my eyes on time he was in form. B

Priestland is a member of the last minute brainfart vs Australia club alongside Gareth Cooper and Hibbard for tossing away a match with stupid thoughtless play. He was pretty crap in the other parts of the match as well, and for nearly all 2012 (he was dire even in the Grand Slam behind a dominant pack in the England, Italy and France matches).

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You were having a laugh with that comment too. Beating the worst Aus team of the last 10-20 years is not going to help Wales against the ABs or SA. For one you won't be getting a penalty at every scrum against either of those sides. When Tomane and Leli'ifano are starting then you know it's a **** team, let alone O'Conner at 10 and their ridiculous props. Genia is the only player who would make SA or the ABs.

Debatable. Especially the Boks. But you make a fair point otherwise. Is Deans' side the worst Aus side in pro era?
 
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Have to say I love the way the Welsh were all like 'it's the best of the NH, no bias we win and lose as one', now they're like 'So now Wales have beaten Australia who will be able to beat us ever again??' LOL!

Looking forward to Wales losing by the odd point to all the SH opposition this autumn. It's a fact that Wales always choke...

http://youtu.be/hAT9nkGZa08
 
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