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SA Rugby to host national coaches’ indaba

There has been a lot of talk that this indaba wont bear much fruit. And the real problems lies with the admins. But i see a few possible benefits. If these criteria are met then i will consider it a success.

I will be happy if the indaba delivers the following results
- We agree on a national game plan. One where all the franchises play the same. Hopefully its more lions/Cheetahs style than Alistair Coetzee style rugby.
- Decisions should be made regarding the Bok coaching panels and what assistance needs to be brought in
- No short term results can be expected of this but if our flaws are identified now and how we will address those flaws then in 4 years time our machine will be well oiled again.

Worst case scenario.
-They identify the admins as the main problem. The Admins will most definitely not stand down as our ministers will not be happy.
- just a blaming contest between multiple parties where they will just agree to disagree
- They find a sollution on how to go forward but it gets shot down because it does not fall within governments transformation vision.
 
There has been a lot of talk that this indaba wont bear much fruit. And the real problems lies with the admins. But i see a few possible benefits. If these criteria are met then i will consider it a success.

I will be happy if the indaba delivers the following results
- We agree on a national game plan. One where all the franchises play the same. Hopefully its more lions/Cheetahs style than Alistair Coetzee style rugby.
- Decisions should be made regarding the Bok coaching panels and what assistance needs to be brought in
- No short term results can be expected of this but if our flaws are identified now and how we will address those flaws then in 4 years time our machine will be well oiled again.

Worst case scenario.
-They identify the admins as the main problem. The Admins will most definitely not stand down as our ministers will not be happy.
- just a blaming contest between multiple parties where they will just agree to disagree
- They find a sollution on how to go forward but it gets shot down because it does not fall within governments transformation vision.

Sadly your worst case scenario feels like the more 'South African' way to go. I mean, common sense, in this country? #sciencemustfall
 
So the media has been asked to leave now after Mark Alexander and Allistair Coetzee gave a short briefing on the reason for this indaba.

It's clear that this indaba is solely going to focus on the Coaching and playing style for the Boks, Super Rugby Teams and Currie Cup. They talked about the NZ model and that we are behind the Aussies and All Blacks in winning trophies.
 
Carel du Plessis, Ian McIntosh, Rudolph Straueli, Gary Teichmann, John Smit are in attendance.
 
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Coaches understand structures better than players, so i'm not sure why there are so many players in attendance and so little ex-coaches.
 
Coaches understand structures better than players, so i'm not sure why there are so many players in attendance and so little ex-coaches.

Well, Terblanche, Matfield and Du Randt have all been part of a coaching setup after they finished playing.

I think they are an integral part of this process as they will see it from both player and coach perspective.
 
Can someone please tell me the rugby credentials of Mark Alexander ? The new to be appointed SA Rugby President.
 
Have we learnt anything from Day 1 ?

I can't imagine that we would be informed of anything concrete, although there might be an agreed statement at the end of the indaba. I doubt there will be anything beyond the various unions committing vaguely to some sort of playing and training blueprint.

Rugby in SA needs a wealthy benefactor who can intervene and subsidise the salaries of quality players (identified by SARU) under the age of say 30, in order to keep them in SA!! I realise that this isn't all that practical, or likely, but I think we need to find some way of keeping talent in SA, in order to boost the integrity and quality of the Currie Cup and the Super 18
 
Try not to double post please.

Can someone please tell me the rugby credentials of Mark Alexander ? The new to be appointed SA Rugby President.

Well we don't know a lot about him apart from that he has been an administrator since 1995. He is a member of SASCOC and the deputy president of SARU. Apart from that he's a director of 2 companies. And that's about it.

Have we learnt anything from Day 1 ?

There will be a media briefing today at the end of the indaba, then we'll know what exactly was said behind closed doors... Well, at least the gist of it.
 

That's a bit of a biased article. No offence, I like the articles on the Daily Maverick's site, but why write this article when the Indaba didn't even start?? To use PDivvy's quote from Die Son's article also doesn't bring a lot of respectability to the piece.

This article was based on the media briefing given before the start of the indaba. Why be so doom and gloom about a function that is the first of its kind for SA Rugby? Even if we don't do anything productive after this indaba, it at least brings the SA coaches together to talk about the state of SA Rugby.

I for one know that positives more than negatives will come from this.
 
Here's the Supersport article.

http://sh.st/33bte

Nothing new really.



Just reading some of the comments. I am so tired of people saying.... pick people on merit, regardless of colour. That goes without saying. How about real solutions ? Solutions to better structures etc.

I'm for a proposal that Super Rugby needs to be scrapped. The Currie Cup needs to be priority again, with the Springboks needing to play in the Currie Cup.
 
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That's a bit of a biased article. No offence, I like the articles on the Daily Maverick's site, but why write this article when the Indaba didn't even start?? To use PDivvy's quote from Die Son's article also doesn't bring a lot of respectability to the piece.

This article was based on the media briefing given before the start of the indaba. Why be so doom and gloom about a function that is the first of its kind for SA Rugby? Even if we don't do anything productive after this indaba, it at least brings the SA coaches together to talk about the state of SA Rugby.

I for one know that positives more than negatives will come from this.

Yep, I agree with you that it was quite doom and gloom and a bit biased. But I don't think including Divvies comments is a negative if it speaks about how the indaba was organised. Personally I am quite pessimistic about this thing. I think the timing is off (do it at the end of the season so there is time to devise ways of implementing changes instead of just before AI where the focus will soon shift from this and be lost a bit). the structure of it seems odd (if it really is set up as discussed, I have been to indabas in mining, and if it is just for people to present views and not debate, this doesn't sound very productive) and I wonder how much resistance is going to come from unions on suggestions to change game plans or centralise.

I would be more than happy to be proven wrong.
 
Yep, I agree with you that it was quite doom and gloom and a bit biased. But I don't think including Divvies comments is a negative if it speaks about how the indaba was organised. Personally I am quite pessimistic about this thing. I think the timing is off (do it at the end of the season so there is time to devise ways of implementing changes instead of just before AI where the focus will soon shift from this and be lost a bit). the structure of it seems odd (if it really is set up as discussed, I have been to indabas in mining, and if it is just for people to present views and not debate, this doesn't sound very productive) and I wonder how much resistance is going to come from unions on suggestions to change game plans or centralise.

I would be more than happy to be proven wrong.

Perhaps, but why wait when there is a crisis?? We can always have a follow up at the end of the season. To me this is perfect timing. All the local teams are done for the year after this weekend's final, so then all of them will be starting their preparations for 2017. It is just the Springboks that still plays this year, and the key aspect of this indaba is to assist the Springboks, as the Bok Coach is the guy who has the least time with his team.

PDivvy is the last guy I'll use as a credible source. I wouldn't have invited him to this indaba... It was him that started this whole mess (Under his tenure).

I don't think there will be much resistance from the unions, as all of them have shown that they can adapt and use a new playing style.
 
Perhaps, but why wait when there is a crisis?? We can always have a follow up at the end of the season. To me this is perfect timing. All the local teams are done for the year after this weekend's final, so then all of them will be starting their preparations for 2017. It is just the Springboks that still plays this year, and the key aspect of this indaba is to assist the Springboks, as the Bok Coach is the guy who has the least time with his team.

PDivvy is the last guy I'll use as a credible source. I wouldn't have invited him to this indaba... It was him that started this whole mess (Under his tenure).

I don't think there will be much resistance from the unions, as all of them have shown that they can adapt and use a new playing style.

I don't disagree that there is a crisis. My concern is that, hey maybe they do come up with a plan, but then focus shifts to the AIs and there is a big delay in anything getting done and when there is time to act on the plan minds have drifted off from it. A follow up would work, but I don't know if they will do that though. Two of the unions are currently not finished though, so can't have the best participation (unless I am mistaken and this is only happening next week?).

He may have been an average, but he didn't have a habit of lying. Making ridiculous statements of opinion, absolutely yes.

Maybe with the playing style, but what about the idea of centralisation?
 
When is the press conference ?


http://sh.st/33v98

Stick keeps his job. LOL. Franco Smith (backline) and JP Ferreira (defense) comes in.

According to an SA Rugby statement, Smith will be involved I the coaching of backline play and skills. Current backline coach Mzwandile Stick arrived in the position lacking top level coaching experience

That's South Africa for you :D
 
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The outcome of this indaba vindicates Meyer and Mallets no-show. Yes you can draw positives from the indaba, much like Coetzee drew positives from the loss to Argentina, but real change will only come about without political interference - and the fact that Roux has been booted, but Stick is still there speaks volumes.

The acid test is going to be our game against Italy, because I don't see us beating the Barbarians, Wales and England - and I can't wait to see what justification SARU / ANC will have for standing by Coetzee, other than the obvious.

Mallet is a political animal, and he knew this indaba would be a farce - and this way, he's credibility (by not associating with it) remains intact and he remains free to criticize and challenge..
 
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http://sh.st/330mA

The indaba of coaches that was held in Cape Town over the past few days has successfully mapped out a new direction for rugby to take in this country, but it was just the start of the process, with the next step being disseminating the ideas and decisions to the various provincial presidents and unions.According to acting SA Rugby president Mark Alexander, recommendations were made that would involve structural change to the way the game is run in South Africa, but as this will be discussed at the General Council meeting on 27 November, he did not want to pre-empt anything before the provincial presidents and other administrators were informed.
The provincial officials will be informed of the key principles and recommendations decided on at the indaba by a six-page document that a six-man sub-committee will thrash out within the next 10 days.
With the conditioning coaches now set to meet in December, the indaba was what Springbok coach Allister Coetzee referred to as the beginning of a process, one he felt was a massive step forward in terms of facilitating conversation and making a breakthrough by getting the various parties that make up the South African whole to start collaborating for a common cause.
"For me personally it was ground-breaking. Everyone in South African rugby has been living in their own little kingdoms for many years, and from the point of view of building relations between coaches and CEOs, and agreeing on what needs to be done, a lot of progress was made in these two days," said Coetzee.
"With the intellectual capital we had in the room over the two days, how can we not succeed? For me it was fantastic, particularly seeing so many of the franchise coaches being so open about the game and where it needs to be improved and what problem areas need to be addressed. What we got from the room was that instead of just trying to follow and emulate other countries, we need to build something that embraces something new while also maintaining our strengths."
Coetzee used defence as an example of an area that in the quest for a more dynamic attacking game had started to become neglected, and it has cost the Boks dearly this year. At the same time, there was recognition that South Africa has fallen way behind when it comes to development of core skills that will equip players to make more and better decisions.
Both of those have been recognised as facets that require short-term intervention for the Boks if they are to do well on their forthcoming November tour of the UK and Italy, which is why Cheetahs coach Franco Smith and Lions defence coach JP Ferreira have been seconded to the management.
So is kicking and aerial skills, with the former being looked after on the tour by the return to the squad of Heyneke Meyer's kicking coach Louis Koen, who has been seconded from the national body's rugby department.
"I will have my third defence coach on this tour but it was identified as a need," said Coetzee.
"Defence has been a problem for the whole year, even in the Ireland series. Jacques Nienaber was only doing the job until he left to go overseas, and Chean Roux, who worked with John McFarland in dealing with the referees and law issues as part of the previous Bok management, did it as a stop-gap measure only during the Rugby Championship.
"We need a specialist defence coach and I will decide after the tour whether we carry on with the one that will join us for this tour or go elsewhere. Having Franco is going to be massive as he is very good at coaching skills after working in Italy."

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Alexander described the two-day indaba as the best conference he had been involved in during his years as a rugby administrator.
"They were the best two days in my career as a rugby administrator as rugby was the only subject and I thought the coaches got through a lot of ground in establishing a methodology. The tactics of the methodology will always be there, but the building blocks have been put in place," said Alexander.
He added that recommendations were made that would impact on structures, and issues such as the selection of overseas players as well as ways to attract better sponsorship and investment in the game would be tabled for debate at the Council meeting next month.
Sport psychologist Pieter Kruger, who helped facilitate the meeting with Brendan Venter, said he was pleased with the level of openness from the various coaches in the room, something he had felt might have been a problem beforehand.
"The main objective was to get thoughts on the table and to get something down on paper, and that was brilliant. There was a great willingness on the part of all people present to participate and to discuss technical things," said Kruger.
"At end of the day it was about formulating an action plan that is applicable and that will start the process. We will send a short summary of what was discussed, recommended and decided in the next 10 days to each participant.
"I think Brendan should take a lot of credit for the openness and willingness to participate that made this conference such a success. In a very polite but clever way he drew people out and started the debate. I was worried there would be reticence, but once we got the first couple of coaches to start talking it going from there."
Alexander added that the indaba had been solution driven and the proof of the pudding would be seeing the solutions adopted and executed.
"There are some short-term solutions that were arrived at, and the announcement of the changes in the Springbok management team were part of that, but much of it is long-term and it is the start of a process that will take a while to start bearing fruit. We looked at all aspects of the game, and it is important to stress that it isn't just a Springbok issue, but something that permeates all levels."
 

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