[RWC2023] England vs Samoa (07/10/2023)

[Tooting Carmen]

I mean I see that as a RWC semi final lol, something England have never lost

Jonah Lomu might have something to say about that.

 

[Zed]

You've already implied the only thing you go by is outcome of the game and are not really interested in the overall scoreline or performance so it seems to be a little pointless to discuss with you why England fans may feel 4 wins in manners less than appealing that will no where near get a win in the latter stages will not be enough and generally don't have a positive outlook on Englands chances in this comp.

Yup.
It was always looking like an easy path to the semis for England with the likelihood of topping their pool and not having to play a top 5 team in the quarters. Even with how they've been playing the last 12 months. So 5/5 and in a semi-final might sound fancy, but the reality is they are looking at copping a massive hiding in the semis. Followed by another massive hiding in the 3/4 play-off. The difference in skill level between England and the likes of Ireland, NZ, France etc seems enormous as well as the speed of their game. Its like this England team has been plucked from the 1970s... I still think there's a good XV in that squad that's capable of holding their own against the top teams, but I don't think SB is the man to get the best out of this team. This insistence on playing Ford/Farrell at 10/12 is bizarre. It doesn't work. I think he's confused as to what his starting XV should be. Against Samoa, England ended up with a flyhalf playing 12, a fullback playing wing and another flyhalf playing fullback. All over the shop.

 

[Which Tyler]

The draw meant that England being knocked out in the SF was always par

 

[BPM]

Yup.
It was always looking like an easy path to the semis for England with the likelihood of topping their pool and not having to play a top 5 team in the quarters. Even with how they've been playing the last 12 months. So 5/5 and in a semi-final might sound fancy, but the reality is they are looking at copping a massive hiding in the semis. Followed by another massive hiding in the 3/4 play-off. The difference in skill level between England and the likes of Ireland, NZ, France etc seems enormous as well as the speed of their game. Its like this England team has been plucked from the 1970s... I still think there's a good XV in that squad that's capable of holding their own against the top teams, but I don't think SB is the man to get the best out of this team. This insistence on playing Ford/Farrell at 10/12 is bizarre. It doesn't work. I think he's confused as to what his starting XV should be. Against Samoa, England ended up with a flyhalf playing 12, a fullback playing wing and another flyhalf playing fullback. All over the shop.

I think it's likely we would play Wales in a 3/4 play off. They have been better than us, but not to the point that I'd expect a 'massive hiding'. Actually, I'd say the result could go either way.

Still, I don't think the SF is a foregone conclusion. Next Sunday is more about who is worse out of England and Fiji and it could very easily be England. Portugal in that mood might well have beaten us too.

 

[dirty harry]

Aw, I really feel for you, it's very hard not seeing champagne rugby when you cruise through to theb1/4 final with a 100% record, where you will face an exhausted Fiji team.

Scotland pitys you hahaha

Argentina are no push overs, Samoa are vastly improved, and Japan are still a decent side and tou brushed 2 of them aside, with a coach in the job for less than 12 months.

Now I van agree with selection criticisms, I can agree the ending of that last game was wild, moving Steward to wing to make way for Smith lol WTAF?!

But you at the very least need to caveat all the whinging with 'but we are through, we are winning, and anything can happen in a RWC semi final'. That's the minimum amount of negativity your allowed, especially as we have already lost Scotland, Japan, and Australia who all would have seen qualification as the goal.

 

[HamJan]

I mean I see that as a RWC semi final lol, something England have never lost

Take it, enjoy it, and see where it leads

I take it that you were born after 1995

 

[Saintjay]

I think it's likely we would play Wales in a 3/4 play off. They have been better than us, but not to the point that I'd expect a 'massive hiding'. Actually, I'd say the result could go either way.

Still, I don't think the SF is a foregone conclusion. Next Sunday is more about who is worse out of England and Fiji and it could very easily be England. Portugal in that mood might well have beaten us too.

I'd say Wales would win and probably quite comfortable with it. Mainly as Wales are always up for beating England. Some England players come across as if a third place play off is beneath them. They don't seem happy and by this game they'll just be wanting to get out of the England set up and back to clubs as quickly as possible.

 

[Which Tyler]

No-one's ever happy to be in the 3rd place play-off.
From memory, I can't think of any that have actually been worth watching.

 

[whocaresaboutthetruth]

England have won the World Cup once in 36 years years so although unlikely we'll win it this year and probably unlikely we'll win it in 4 years time so I'm just going to enjoy this World Cup rather than worry what happens after it….we're in the quarter finals..Back your nation

 

[Reiser99]

England have won the World Cup once in 36 years years so although unlikely we'll win it this year and probably unlikely we'll win it in 4 years time so I'm just going to enjoy this World Cup rather than worry what happens after it….we're in the quarter finals..Back your nation

But that's the issue for me. Who currently enjoys watching England play? I'm glad they are winning and I will support them. I'm not enjoying it though.

 

[ncurd]

I take it that you were born after 1995

I get that feeling with a lot of new posters. Like possibly even recent rugby fans who have no idea what it's like to watch England when we're actually good.

 

[Saintjay]

England have won the World Cup once in 36 years years so although unlikely we'll win it this year and probably unlikely we'll win it in 4 years time so I'm just going to enjoy this World Cup rather than worry what happens after it….we're in the quarter finals..Back your nation

I'll always support England. What i can't accept is when we are not playing to the maximum potential. Maybe we are only the 6 - 8th best team in the world and we are. If things don't improve in 4 years time we might be in a group like Scotland.

 

[whocaresaboutthetruth]

But that's the issue for me. Who currently enjoys watching England play? I'm glad they are winning and I will support them. I'm not enjoying it though.

But that's the issue for me. Who currently enjoys watching England play? I'm glad they are winning and I will support them. I'm not enjoying it though.

To me the England team look fearful when they go out to play and tbh I don't blame them.It must be difficult for them and the coaching staff because at present there being crucified by the press and some supporters and that must add to the performances on the field.people can say there professionals and paid to do it but there only human.I do enjoy watching all the games whether we're good or bad obviously you enjoy some games more but I just feel as supporters we can knock some of the negativity on the head and let them know we're behind them…it may help them

 

[HamJan]

No-one's ever happy to be in the 3rd place play-off.
From memory, I can't think of any that have actually been worth watching.

I remember France beating us in 1995. It was dreadful.

 

[dirty harry]

No-one's ever happy to be in the 3rd place play-off.
From memory, I can't think of any that have actually been worth watching.

I dont car about the 3rd place play off, but before this tournament I'd have killed to get there

 

[BPM]

To me the England team look fearful when they go out to play and tbh I don't blame them.It must be difficult for them and the coaching staff because at present there being crucified by the press and some supporters and that must add to the performances on the field.people can say there professionals and paid to do it but there only human.I do enjoy watching all the games whether we're good or bad obviously you enjoy some games more but I just feel as supporters we can knock some of the negativity on the head and let them know we're behind them…it may help them

Justifiable criticism is not the same as 'negativity'.

As I've said numerous times, my support is unwavering, but that doesn't mean I'll blindly accept what we're seeing is at the standard it ought to be.

 

[dirty harry]

I take it that you were born after 1995

I always forget 95, it's like the tournament doesnt exist in my memory lol.

It cant be just that Wales didnt get out of the group, honest hahaha thinking about it the 90's in general were a bit of a teenage blur, must've been the awful rugby, and definately not anything else

 

[whocaresaboutthetruth]

Justifiable criticism is not the same as 'negativity'.

As I've said numerous times, my support is unwavering, but that doesn't mean I'll blindly accept what we're seeing is at the standard it ought to be.

I'd agree with that if we weren't deciding ourselves what is justifiable.maybe opinion based criticism is the best description

 

[BPM]

I give credit to the team for getting the job done, but that's as far as it goes.

Is it even remotely controversial to say that the criticism re. selection or performance is justifiable? I mean it's hardly just me …

 

[Tooting Carmen]

I always forget 95, it's like the tournament doesnt exist in my memory lol.

It cant be just that Wales didnt get out of the group, honest hahaha thinking about it the 90's in general were a bit of a teenage blur, must've been the awful rugby, and definately not anything else

The 90's was la decada perdida for Celtic rugby, especially Wales and Ireland.