[RWC2019][Pool B] Round 1 - New Zealand vs. South Africa (21/09/2019)

[big ginger 8]

Can I just say how utterly shite World Rugby's highlights are. Less than 3 minutes. Seriously WR? Sort it out.

Was just thinking that earlier. Every NFL game gets a good 10 minute video which gives you a real sense of the game. It really shouldn't be that hard to do.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

Not sure I buy this whole easier path to the final. NZ now odds on to top the pool and will play runners up of pool A: likely Scotland or Japan unless Ireland mess it up tomorrow and Scotland cause a shock. SA likely to face Ireland in a QF and that would be a ***anic battle.

Ok Scotland/Japan look easy on paper, but there's always the danger of looking past the opposition and to a semi. Still It would be the shock of the tournament for them to lose to either.

Semis? ABs v winner of pool C v runners up in pool D ie. If England can top pool C v Wales or Australia. Fiji outside chance, but as we saw today stick the ball in the corner and score tries off of driving mauls and you'll beat them and Wales would have seen that today. So if is England/Wales/Australia in the semi I don't see NZ fearing any of them. England have yet to beat NZ in the RWC, Wales since 1953 and NZ know how to beat the Wallabies. ABs would start as heavy favourites against any of those 3.

SA: if they were to get past a big match v Ireland would face winner of pool D v runners up pool C. Wales/Australia or France or dare I say it England if they don't live up to expectations. Argentina not out of it yet.

NZ arguably have the better side of the draw if it all pans out. If they spank Scotland/Japan they will less battered than the winner of Ireland v SA.

 

[Scotty]

FOH about Mapimpi

Are you forgetting that Mapimpi ran down Mo'unga to save a certain try or that he scored
3 tries in the game beforehand vs Japan

Willie LR would get dropped for next game w/ Kolbe to #15 & Nkosi to #14

How about golden boy Pollard who was total Kak today
Missing a penalty so close to the post he could throw the ball over it
Poor kicks in open play when Boks stopped kicking from #9

Elton Jantjes would have made a big difference IMO
Frans Steyn did not even get off the Bench
What does that tell us about his value in the squad #WaterBoy

Does Kolbe play 15? Hes would be a weapon there and get his hands on the ball more. Small but good under high balls and not shown up in defence. Worth a try vs tier 2 teams

 

[Rinkadink]

So if is England/Wales/Australia in the semi I don't see NZ fearing any of them. England have yet to beat NZ in the RWC, Wales since 1953 and NZ know how to beat the Wallabies. ABs would start as heavy favourites against any of those 3.

Does NZ fear anyone? Do NZ not start as heavy favourites against anyone, especially after cruising past SA today?

 

[Bada-Bing!]

Does NZ fear anyone? Do NZ not start as heavy favourites against anyone, especially after cruising past SA today?

Doubt they do, which is why their side of the draw now is probably the better of the two. They wouldn't fear Ireland, but Ireland do have 2 wins against them in the last 3 years, so a NZ v Ireland would be harder than NZ v Scotland/Japan.

But there's also the physical/emotional toll of big quarter final match would have and the knock on effects for the winner in the semi and final.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Your man is obviously rating England very highly and Ireland and Wales not so high to come to his conclusion. I think England and SA are entering/entered this tournament a bit overvalued while NZ, Wales and Ireland (less so once you're not on the Ireland will struggle to qualify from their group train) are a bit undervalued. It's mainly recency bias and I'm not saying that the first two can't win the thing moreso that I think NZ at anything evens or better is good odds for the tournament while the rest are all 8/1 bets for me.

I think New Zealand are beatable but now that they likely won't meet a team with the ability to beat them until the semi final, and that team likely being England off the back of three consecutive tier 1 tests, shifts the odds massively in their favour.

South Africa will now likely have to win two matches against teams who can beat them even if they play well themselves to reach the final, I honestly don't fancy them much to do so.

I'll wait a bit longer to make a full final prediction but it's NZ v Someone.

 

[ncurd]

England's only hope in the semi-final (if they get there and win the group) is they'll be battle hardened veterans peaking at the intensity of tournament and the ABs having a comparative milk run for the next 4 weeks will be rusty as hell.

It's a small hope they will likely come up against a knackered England side by then and steam roller us.

 

[NickBD]

Can I just say how utterly shite World Rugby's highlights are. Less than 3 minutes. Seriously WR? Sort it out.

They managed to post the Haka in full though.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

They managed to post the Haka in full though.

Lol, you're right the highlights of the match are only 36 secs longer than the Haka.

 

[Zapphod]

Lol, you're right the highlights of the match are only 36 secs longer than the Haka.

Just imagine how much better the ABs could be if we didn't have to devote training time to dance lessons.

 

[JohnKA]

Just imagine how much better the ABs could be if we didn't have to devote training time to dance lessons.

XD do you know when they learn it ? or is it something all New Zealanders get taught from a young age ? Wait !! can you do the haka !? XD

 

[Zapphod]

XD do you know when they learn it ? or is it something all New Zealanders get taught from a young age ? Wait !! can you do the haka !? XD

Not a clue I lost interest in it years ago when when it became apparent that even the NZ scrabble team was going to start doing one, which was probably about the time they started calling themselves the "Black Words" because as a sign of our individuality and ability to be unique every team has to have "All" or "Black" in its name.

I know High School teams do them regularly and I have no doubt there are preschools slapping their knees and poking their tongues out all over the country.

I assume the All Blacks will have been exposed to doing a Haka throughout their careers (although it isn't common at club or provincial level and I don't recall seeing a super rugby team doing one) but they would still have to be trained in the choreography of the current ABs one.

 

[profitius]

Reading through here it amazes me how different people can watch the same game and get totally different take-aways from it. I watched a totally different game. Let me just leave it at that.

What I will say though and please quote me.. SA v England final..

Fair play. Your glass is 1/4 full.

 

[Larksea]

interesting game. Brutal and fairly even encounter fit for a bok v AB game.
Both sides will be a bit frustrated by the ref, the Boks will complain about the penalty count but the Ref also let them get away with a lot there was the first AB penalty which was clearly a cynical professional foul hard on defense after a breakout. That's a yellow card every day, deliberate foul and prevented a try on desperate defense right under the sticks. The other or me was in the 46th minute just before the only Bok try the AB's recovered from that amazing bok breakout and Richie tackle, ALB took the ball well up past the bok defense then after that ruck 3-4 Bok were way offside in the AB back-line and PSDT effected the turnover from a clear offside position. And it was a Ruck, #5 made the tackle assisted by #1 who remained on his feet over the ball was then cleaned out by AB#8 & #12 making it clearly a ruck. PSDT wasn't just flat he came from behind the AB line, given that the AB's had a HUGE overlap (4-5 on 2) that was a professional foul as well. Also one thing the bok were doing was getting up from a tackle and running again without releasing and regathering the ball. When a player is tackled the tackler has to release the carrier and the carrier has to release the ball. He can get to his feet and pick it up again but he still has to release it.

Anyway... The game kinda went how I expected, I thought the AB's would get more tries though, they did leave a few out there. The box kicking from both sides was a bit frustrating it seems that may be a theme of this world cup with most of the top teams employing flat rushing defenses.

For the AB's
Front row
Laulala was excellent. Moody was great around the park but the scrum wasn't as solid on his side. Ofa was huge on defense late making some big tackles but the scrum did suffer late. It was overall good enough but for sure needs some work. Coles was fairly quiet I thought his main job would be to use his speed to get in the face of the bok 9-10, looked like he tried too but not with much impact. Taylor was really good, lineout was better when he was on as well.
locks
typical whitelock game, very good into everything for 80min. Scott had a huge game, on defense, taking the ball up, scored a try played lock and 6 maybe our best forward along with Savea. Tuipulotu had a huge game, driving players back in tackles, that can't be underestimated. The boks were forced to box kick flat footed because of the defense from players like Paddy.
back row
Cane was great before he went off. Seemed like a mistake from the officials prevented him getting back on after the HIA at half time. He was involved a lot, seemed a plan for him to work the left with Bridge and Savea worked the right with Reece. They were all great, Savea was huge again.
at 9 Smith was very good again his passing was very good I just wish again he would speed the clearance up. I cant help but feel like despite his passe, kicks, defense and decisions being good the critical seconds he is wasting at rucks is preventing the attack from unlocking defenses. Things improved when Perenara got a roll on. I also thought TJ's box kicking was far more effective, mostly in combination with Bridge.
Barrett and Richie were class, it seems like the the two of them moving between 10-15 is starting to work more smoothly. Both making critical plays on attack and defense.
in the midfield ALB was outstanding. So far this year if we have a nominee for IRB player of the year its ALB, before this game he had made 54 tackled and missed just 1 in tests, Again brilliant on defense, on the spot when ever something needs to be done and a handful on attack brilliantly putting Scott Barrett in for a try.
Crotty was solid without having a big impact before subbed. SBW was very good, there was a small passage when he had a kick charged but it was under an advantage, could have been nasty otherwise. But he carried well got over the advantage line and secured the ball. very good busy defense and one great pass which should have resulted in more if not for a poor transfer later in the movement.
Reece and Bridge were great again in another big test. I think this effort confirms them for the playoffs. Bridge in particular has been amazing the way these guys performed under the high ball really set the tone for the result in many ways. Kolbe aside The boks didn't really offer much on attack with their box kicks nullified. Would have liked to have seen the ball in Sevu's hands more later in the game.
One thing that interested me was how effective Ben Smith was when he came on. He attacked down the short side and created space with short passes and his trademark running style. It was unlucky not to result in more points. Towards the end when the AB's seemed to regain the momentum again I think it was in part due to Benders impact.

 

[BIB]

interesting game. Brutal and fairly even encounter fit for a bok v AB game.
Both sides will be a bit frustrated by the ref, the Boks will complain about the penalty count but the Ref also let them get away with a lot there was the first AB penalty which was clearly a cynical professional foul hard on defense after a breakout. That's a yellow card every day, deliberate foul and prevented a try on desperate defense right under the sticks. The other or me was in the 46th minute just before the only Bok try the AB's recovered from that amazing bok breakout and Richie tackle, ALB took the ball well up past the bok defense then after that ruck 3-4 Bok were way offside in the AB back-line and PSDT effected the turnover from a clear offside position. And it was a Ruck, #5 made the tackle assisted by #1 who remained on his feet over the ball was then cleaned out by AB#8 & #12 making it clearly a ruck. PSDT wasn't just flat he came from behind the AB line, given that the AB's had a HUGE overlap (4-5 on 2) that was a professional foul as well. Also one thing the bok were doing was getting up from a tackle and running again without releasing and regathering the ball. When a player is tackled the tackler has to release the carrier and the carrier has to release the ball. He can get to his feet and pick it up again but he still has to release it.

Anyway... The game kinda went how I expected, I thought the AB's would get more tries though, they did leave a few out there. The box kicking from both sides was a bit frustrating it seems that may be a theme of this world cup with most of the top teams employing flat rushing defenses.

For the AB's
Front row
Laulala was excellent. Moody was great around the park but the scrum wasn't as solid on his side. Ofa was huge on defense late making some big tackles but the scrum did suffer late. It was overall good enough but for sure needs some work. Coles was fairly quiet I thought his main job would be to use his speed to get in the face of the bok 9-10, looked like he tried too but not with much impact. Taylor was really good, lineout was better when he was on as well.
locks
typical whitelock game, very good into everything for 80min. Scott had a huge game, on defense, taking the ball up, scored a try played lock and 6 maybe our best forward along with Savea. Tuipulotu had a huge game, driving players back in tackles, that can't be underestimated. The boks were forced to box kick flat footed because of the defense from players like Paddy.
back row
Cane was great before he went off. Seemed like a mistake from the officials prevented him getting back on after the HIA at half time. He was involved a lot, seemed a plan for him to work the left with Bridge and Savea worked the right with Reece. They were all great, Savea was huge again.
at 9 Smith was very good again his passing was very good I just wish again he would speed the clearance up. I cant help but feel like despite his passe, kicks, defense and decisions being good the critical seconds he is wasting at rucks is preventing the attack from unlocking defenses. Things improved when Perenara got a roll on. I also thought TJ's box kicking was far more effective, mostly in combination with Bridge.
Barrett and Richie were class, it seems like the the two of them moving between 10-15 is starting to work more smoothly. Both making critical plays on attack and defense.
in the midfield ALB was outstanding. So far this year if we have a nominee for IRB player of the year its ALB, before this game he had made 54 tackled and missed just 1 in tests, Again brilliant on defense, on the spot when ever something needs to be done and a handful on attack brilliantly putting Scott Barrett in for a try.
Crotty was solid without having a big impact before subbed. SBW was very good, there was a small passage when he had a kick charged but it was under an advantage, could have been nasty otherwise. But he carried well got over the advantage line and secured the ball. very good busy defense and one great pass which should have resulted in more if not for a poor transfer later in the movement.
Reecce and Bridge were great again in another big test. I think this effort confirms them for the playoffs. Bridge in particular has been amazing the way these guys performed under the high ball really set the tone for the result in many ways. Kolbe aside The boks didn't really offer much on attack with their box kicks nullified. Would have liked to have seen the ball in Sevu's hands more later in the game.
One thing that interested me was how effective Ben Smith was when he came on. He attacked down the short side and created space with short passes and his trademark running style. It was unlucky not to result in more points. Towards the end when the AB's seemed to regain the momentum again I think it was in part due to Benders impact.

Great summary...thanks

 

[BIB]

In a way it could be argued that by losing South Africa have managed to find an easier route to the final!

You will probably play Ireland in the quarters. We will probably play Scotland or Japan. I know which one is easier.

 

[Icemn]

Whatsup with the safas disrespecting the haka everytime, chanting Ole why?

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Whatsup with the safas disrespecting the haka everytime, chanting Ole why?

I have a feeling that was Irish who are in Yokohama for both matches. Ole is an Irish thing, they were just drunk and having the craic.

 

[donmcdazzle]

Whatsup with the safas disrespecting the haka everytime, chanting Ole why?

Who cares honestly - I think the fans have the right to do whatever they like when the Haka is being done. It's not disrespect it's responding, people can respond in whatever fashion they see fit I reckon.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I have a feeling that was Irish who are in Yokohama for both matches. Ole is an Irish thing, they were just drunk and having the craic.

Ban the Irish