[RWC2019][Pool A] Round 2 - Japan vs. Ireland (28/09/2019)

[Leonormous Boozer]

Still, I think Japan were good value for their win and it's not the end of the world for Ireland. There's some real venom being thrown at our Irish here (usually reserved for other "hated" sides) and it's disappointing. Celebrate the win whilst respecting the losing side and fans. Best game of the tournament in entertainment value, well done all. Onwards.

You'd be surprised at the amount of hate we attract if it caught your eye on a normal game day. I think it's because we openly enjoy the good times more than anyone, I think we take a loss fairly well for the most part though but people forget that quicker.

A few losers in here enjoying the Irish loss more than the fantastic hosts winning with a great performance says more about the individual than anyone else though.

I must admit, I do enjoy that the old Kiwi tune of "You've never beaten us" has changed to "You've only beaten us twice" and they still think it carries weight!

 

[Leinster Fan]

Oops, triple post sinner. I'll fix that now.

No conclusions just good inside info. Perk of job

Massive loss, bigger blow to our tournament than this game really.

Probably better to reflect on this after Ireland have played Russia and Samoa.

Huh?

 

[Leinster Fan]

I'm not sure how your tears can be salty and sweet at the same time... but there you go.

Because maybe I have multiple opinions that don't fit into your nice boxes?

It doesn't have to be OH MY GOD THE REF ROBBED US BLIND LETS START A PETITION TO REPLAY THE GAME or 'Angus Gardner is the best ref of all time, flawless performance from him.' There's a middle ground. I can be simultaneously annoyed at the ref while also thinking it isn't the main reason we lost, don't see what there is for you not to understand about that.

 

[Paulo]

The SA NZ thread has developed nicely. Once tempers calmed down there was a bit more balance there and it seemed to get to a more sensible place.

I guess the frustrating thing is it took 30 some odd pages and was largely discussing one or two incidents that most agreed didn't have a bearing on the result, and largely driven by people without any skin the game. Who then turned a comparatively blind eye to their own teams indiscretions and non-cards when they beat a tier 2 island nation earlier.

im normally in favour of reasoned debate and normally approach something respectfully to begin with, but after 1 week of this I lost a lot of patience for this constant ref-whinging post every loss.

 

[corny]

And might I suggest as above watching the whole game. People often only see when their team has been "cheated" but don't see the decisions they benefited from. It's why I say watch the game back so get the full context of the infringements from both sides

The penalty counts speaks for itself. The evidence (as presented) speaks for itself. But i'm ******* in the wind of course. Instead of tackling the subject you'd rather tell me i'm compromised. And feel justified doing it too!

 

[Rich Taff]

The way to beat Japan is quite simple.
Don't wear green.

 

[Leinster Fan]

im normally in favour of reasoned debate and normally approach something respectfully to begin with, but after 1 week of this I lost a lot of patience for this constant ref-whinging post every loss.

The refs have been poor by and large, it's a hugely significant area of the game and people should he allowed to discuss it.

 

[Paulo]

Because maybe I have multiple opinions that don't fit into your nice boxes?

It doesn't have to be OH MY GOD THE REF ROBBED US BLIND LETS START A PETITION TO REPLAY THE GAME or 'Angus Gardner is the best ref of all time, flawless performance from him.' There's a middle ground. I can be simultaneously annoyed at the ref while also thinking it isn't the main reason we lost, don't see what there is for you not to understand about that.

So, did you lose because of the ref or not? "Angus f...ked' us" kinda suggests you think it's his fault. But you also say Japan were better. It was only a 7 point win, so how much do put down to the ref and how much to Japan? Just curious how you reconcile this two points.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Just curious how you reconcile this two points.

Gardner was bad, he definitely restricted our attack in the second half but our attack was bad, no guarantee that we'd have scored 19 points or more with a more level ref at all and Japan were value for their 19.

Does that work?

 

[Paulo]

The refs have been poor by and large, it's a hugely significant area of the game and people should he allowed to discuss it.

Never said don't discuss it. Quite a difference in tone in the last few pages, some have pointed out the inconsistencies or the general lack of calls that impact both teams in a game. And some claim only their team was impacted and it's all unfair and the ref 'f...ked' them. There is a difference, one leads to fair a reasoned debate, the other makes you look like a sore loser.

 

[Leinster Fan]

So, did you lose because of the ref or not? "Angus f...ked' us" kinda suggests you think it's his fault. But you also say Japan were better. It was only a 7 point win, so how much do put down to the ref and how much to Japan? Just curious how you reconcile this two points.

I really don't think it's complicated. As I've said multiple times, I don't think it's his fault, I also think he didn't do his job very well. I think we'd have lost anyway in a perfectly reffed game, but at the same time I think Gardner made multiple poor decisions that negatively affected us and deserves to be called out on it.

 

[Paulo]

Gardner was bad, he definitely restricted our attack in the second half but our attack was bad, no guarantee that we'd have scored 19 points or more with a more level ref at all and Japan were value for their 19.

Does that work?

Absolutely. It didn't seem like you had a lot on attack, I thought you kicked a lot of ball away and Japan found a lot of space out wide. All good things to work on. And you have a Kiwi coach, so you know he has a plan to fix it already

 

[Paulo]

I really don't think it's complicated. As I've said multiple times, I don't think it's his fault, I also think he didn't do his job very well. I think we'd have lost anyway in a perfectly reffed game, but at the same time I think Gardner made multiple poor decisions that negatively affected us and deserves to be called out on it.

Fair enough, I just dont think it went only one way.

 

[OwenPB]

So, did you lose because of the ref or not? "Angus f...ked' us" kinda suggests you think it's his fault. But you also say Japan were better. It was only a 7 point win, so how much do put down to the ref and how much to Japan? Just curious how you reconcile this two points.

When you dont get obvious offside decisions when you're camped on their 5m line only for them to get one immediately, that tends to lend itself to a belief that, had Ireland been given a penalty there, they could have scored and changed the complexion of the game.

Sometimes one decision is enough. Add to that a general feeling that the rucks were not correctly policed and other obvious fouls, admittedly on both sides of the ball, and you have a different result.

Granted, on today's display, it was more likely a bigger margin for Japan that Ireland winning, but you still have to ref the rules, not make things up as you go along.

 

[Leinster Fan]

Fair enough, I just dont think it went only one way.

I think that overall the ref did far more damage to us than he did to Japan, but at the same time I didn't see anything to suggest we'd have scored enough points to win anyway, or that Japan wouldn't have scored when they did.

 

[munstermuffin]

Gardner was bad, he definitely restricted our attack in the second half but our attack was bad, no guarantee that we'd have scored 19 points or more with a more level ref at all and Japan were value for their 19.

Does that work?

Schmidt and Gardner are on record as disliking eachother too. Schmidt said as much after. But was equally full of credit for Japan who lets not discredit. They were awesome and deserved it. We were lucky to get LBP

 

[Bada-Bing!]

No doubt the refereeing decisions page will be full of pics of how the offside at rucks/tackles were not policed for Japan, but was for Ireland.

 

[BobbyM]

The penalty counts speaks for itself. The evidence (as presented) speaks for itself. But i'm ******* in the wind of course. Instead of tackling the subject you'd rather tell me i'm compromised. And feel justified doing it too!

I agree with the Kearney in the air being a bad call btw.

When watching games we all to different extents see and highlight those decisions that negatively impact our own team but not those that positively impact our team. The idea of systematic bias by refs in the professional game on rugby's biggest stage isn't something I buy in to.

Although in saying that Celtic have just gone 1-0 down so no doubt I'll be complaining about anti-Celtic bias in a matter of minutes!

 

[munstermuffin]

No doubt the refereeing decisions page will be full of pics of how the offside at rucks/tackles were not policed for Japan, but was for Ireland.

The most blatant was the Murray incident where the cane around and never touched the ball but still blatantly slowed it.

But again Japan played the ref and every team is told do that. They were superb

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Me Right now with this thread.

some good tea.
I'm proud the RWC really does bring out the best shitstirring.