Ring fencing premiership and championship

[Reiser99]

For my most thrilling TRF post yet...

Probably not - companies choose when their year end is. Most go 31st December though a lot of sports clubs choose a summer date to align with seasons. Year end also generally doesn't affect cash (you report financial position but doesn't trigger payments). I'd guess it's getting cash for payroll.

I know off-topic, but how can businesses and clubs choose when the tax year ends? I thought that all aligned so HMRC can tax properly.

 

[BrokenWing]

Eddie Hearn offers a genuinely interesting view on it on Good, Bad and the Rugby.

I just listened to this… he just claimed his dad coined the nickname Steve "interesting" Davis… Which was the punchline of a Spitting Image sketch.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

For my most thrilling TRF post yet...

Probably not - companies choose when their year end is. Most go 31st December though a lot of sports clubs choose a summer date to align with seasons. Year end also generally doesn't affect cash (you report financial position but doesn't trigger payments). I'd guess it's getting cash for payroll.

I mean the tax year does end in 31st March as it's set by the government. Companies do vary their year end but most I know do follow the uk gov one. Although the current company I'm working for has theirs ending in October for some bizarre reason. I'm guessing it depends on the sector the company operates in.

 

[g6mcg]

I know off-topic, but how can businesses and clubs choose when the tax year ends? I thought that all aligned so HMRC can tax properly.

Yeah companies choose their year end. Most go 31st December but can be anytime. Their tax bill is then due based on that date - 9 months after for most but different rules for larger companies (including all premiership rugby clubs I'd imagine).

I mean the tax year does end in 31st March as it's set by the government. Companies do vary their year end but most I know do follow the uk gov one. Although the current company I'm working for has theirs ending in October for some bizarre reason. I'm guessing it depends on the sector the company operates in.

One advantage of a non-standard year end is you'll get much better quality work from auditors and whoever is doing the tax returns. Sector is another common reason, as is just aligning to when they incorporated.

This has reminded me how much I hated a former job.

 

[Geordie]

This is a statement from the Coventry Rugby Chairman and was posted on the falcons forum as it seems to point towards a big shake up that affects Prem and Championship teams. The paragraph in the top right is the interesting part for other English teams....

Thought you might like to read it...and if you have any knowledge of the shake ups coming?

https://www.coventryrugby.co.uk/an-open-letter-from-executive-chairman-jon-sharp/

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Premiership Cup with all Prem and Championship sides involved would be mega, tbh

They should've done it when they dropped the Welsh sides from it - I wonder if they were worried about mismatches before due to a lot of sides stacking their LV= Cup teams with first choicers, but now that the A League is gone and the cap has reduced and everyone's putting their academy and fringe players out instead they're more keen

 

[Geordie]

Still lots of rumours about a 10 team prem. Guess we'll see about that one.

The french have a strong Div 1 and 2. We need that,

 

[Geordie]

Would a cup for ALL clubs in the country similar to an FA cup be worthwhile also?

Regional qualifiers etc etc. Imagine a local club like Blaydon or Tynedale (up here in Newcastle) getting drawn against Saracens etc. its a nice money spinner...the money starts spreading around the country and they can develop more..

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Nah, too dangerous - putting some 40yr old PE teacher up against Wilco Louw in the scrum would end in tears
Rugby's not like football, the inherent risks multiply exponentially the worse the mismatches are

 

[Geordie]

I get the difference...but there has to be some way of getting the money down the leagues.

This is all about development now..

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Nah, too dangerous - putting some 40yr old PE teacher up against Wilco Louw in the scrum would end in tears
Rugby's not like football, the inherent risks multiply exponentially the worse the mismatches are

Back in the day our junior club played in the John Player Cup against Gloucester who fielded their usual front row of Preedy (capped), Dunn and Pascall who both played at Saxons level.

Our guys did well, but now it would be a 200 point massacre with the local A&E on major incident footing. Olyy's right, those days are long gone, but the total divorce between the pro and amateur games is a source of regret, well at least for those of us around pre 1995.

 

[Geordie]

Back in the day our junior club played in the John Player Cup against Gloucester who fielded their usual front row of Preedy (capped), Dunn and Pascall who both played at Saxons level.

Our guys did well, but now it would be a 200 point massacre with the local A&E on major incident footing. Olyy's right, those days are long gone, but the total divorce between the pro and amateur games is a source of regret, well at least for those of us around pre 1995.

Yeah i was lucky to represent my club (at the coast area of Newcastle) in the Newcastle Falcons 7's playing against the likes of Rodber, Tony Underwood etc etc...was an unbelievable experience and we actually represented ourselves exceptionally well.

There would be a huge a gulf these days thats true...but there must be some way of bridging that gap again.

 

[Not Mike Brown's Sock]

Could market it as a hunger games esque moment.

Amateur team with the most players left alive at the end of the game gets a special trohpy.

I mean, who doesn't want to see an angry Wiese eating some poor 17 year old prop before headbutting his 65 year old father who's filled in at 10

 

[Reiser99]

Could have it as amateur teams at lower levels and then premiership teams come in for later rounds like the way with premiership teams in the 3rd round of the FA cup. Issue is if you get a big upset then it could still lead to a bad match up.

 

[Scotty]

Nah, too dangerous - putting some 40yr old PE teacher up against Wilco Louw in the scrum would end in tears
Rugby's not like football, the inherent risks multiply exponentially the worse the mismatches are

Plus with the new tackle law changes aren't pro rugby and amateur rugby going to be different sports?

 

[Which Tyler]

Premiership Cup with all Prem and Championship sides involved would be mega, tbh

If only someone had thought of that 15-20 years ago; maybe writing to the RFU's director of elite rugby at the time, to mention the idea?

 

[McTallshort]

This is a statement from the Coventry Rugby Chairman and was posted on the falcons forum as it seems to point towards a big shake up that affects Prem and Championship teams. The paragraph in the top right is the interesting part for other English teams....

Thought you might like to read it...and if you have any knowledge of the shake ups coming?

https://www.coventryrugby.co.uk/an-open-letter-from-executive-chairman-jon-sharp/

Like that. Become a bit of a regular at the Butts, will be nice to see the like of Sarries and Quin's there. Got to say the facilities from a spectator point of view are actually pretty decent

 

[saulan]

I get the difference...but there has to be some way of getting the money down the leagues.

This is all about development now..

Might be worth looking at what other countries have done on this front.

South Africa built up the "Varsity Cup" and "Varsity Shield" quite successfully over the last 15 years - which is mostly televised on a Monday night and helps identify potential talent for the unions that maybe are late bloomers and didn't stand out at Craven Week in High School. We have u19/u21 versions of the Currie Cup, but one thing that I think was really good for the smaller club rugby was the Gold Cup (which Covid seems to have killed for now). Basically the teams that won their local regional league played in a national tournament against other winners the following year. This I think works, doing the local clubs vs your franchises is going to get so many injuries... Let's be honest, it would just be scrum penalty, lineout on 5m, easy maul over vs amateurs, let alone how they'd be able to slice defense.

Link to how Gold Cup used to work if anyone is interested:

Gold Cup (rugby union) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[SG59_]

A draft system like the NHL might work. Basically, the lowest performing team gets first pick of player and it goes up the league table each pick.

 

[Reiser99]

A draft system like the NHL might work. Basically, the lowest performing team gets first pick of player and it goes up the league table each pick.

I may be wrong, but I don't see how that works. America has a huge college system that feeds into the professional level. I imagine this means teams don't have direct academies where they develop youth players. It's different here, the clubs are responsible for identifying and developing young talent. Not fair for a club to invest in a player and then another team gets an opportunity to pick them when they turn professional.