Ireland v New Zealand - 8 November 2024

[Jimbo]

I agree on the yellow card, we should have seen one. I think world rugby needs to cone up with a defined system for team yellow cards. 8 pens = yellow and redzone pens count for double or something like that.

Don't think we adapted at all well though. 13 penalties is a pretty shocking return considering only one was for holding on. Not controlling the controllables.

Yeah indeed to have specific numbers to give cards would go a long way to negating the inconsistencies, there may then be a reluctance to issue pens when they stack up preventing cards who knows. I hear you but if NZ set the stall out like they did go for goal every time rather than go for the corner prevent any real momentum gain and only concede 3 when 7 could very easily happen seems like a cynical way to win a game, had the 50/22 of lowes resulted in a trie it's a few point game with not long left, if Ireland take the lead, and go on to win it, you could in the analysis say we brought far to much pressure on ourselves conceeding those pens, you'd call could also say had we not we could have conceded some tries and potentially cards which would have a real chance to slant the score board further in NZ favour. It's all very hypothetical but I think what is clear is there really is very little to pick from top 3 or 4, being slightly off the boil will more often than not result in a loss, other than a small amount of revenge for the WC exit and defending the fortress the game was pretty meaningless (as far as that goes in the sport), NZ don't hold the same challenge to Ireland as they once did it's easy to see why they wouldn't be able to get the the right place for this one compared to ones of the recent past.

 

[munstermuffin]

Crowley was shocking last night, there's no debate. Everyone in the stadium wanted Frawley on when it happened, unfortunately he was far worse though.

Any calls for Sam to start a game this autumn are mad but I'd have him on the bench for the next three behind Crowley. If the tier 2 game was against anyone but Fiji I'd start Sam but we shouldn't make the mistake of throwing a young 10 out to be Fiji's target practice like what happened to Carbery.

I don't think this is true, he'll play loads.

Baird and Prendergast onto the bench for Henderson and Frawley, switch Osborne and Ringrose and maybe get Casey in but hard to judge Murray yesterday.

I think Osborne will play 14 while Jordie is here and at full strength. You'd take him over Jimmy or Larmour imo. Selection will likely be dictated by injuries in any case.

I'd disagree. Crowley was fine. Not great not terrible.
But regards Prendergast your missing the point. There is calls from some areas of Dublin Media to start him. As you said it madness but he does need to really nail Leinster 10 jersey first in next 2 or 3 months.
Again on Ryan you're missing the point. Yes he will play as Leinster rotate well but he is not a big player anymore. Last night Beirne played 6 to try fit 3 lads on. But McCarthy and Beirne are miles ahead. Ryan doesn't offer much and it effected our lineout too. Baird at 6 and Beirne in the row would've worked better.
On Osbourne I don't like him being shuffled around. He is talented enough to nail a spot so hope he is let do that. But we'll have a specialist 10 in Prendergast at 22 maybe so Frawley days in squad will be hit as Osbourne can cover 11 to 15 much better.
It is hard judge Murray but well what is plan is it to plan for next 3 months or 3 years.

 

[Reiser99]

Starting Prendergast would be an England level mistake. One of the reasons NZ were so dominant between 2011 to 2015 was that they kept bringing younger in as part of a winning team. Putting Prendergast in as part of a lising team and asking him to fix things is just a recipe for disaster.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

I'd disagree. Crowley was fine. Not great not terrible.
But regards Prendergast your missing the point. There is calls from some areas of Dublin Media to start him. As you said it madness but he does need to really nail Leinster 10 jersey first in next 2 or 3 months.
Again on Ryan you're missing the point. Yes he will play as Leinster rotate well but he is not a big player anymore. Last night Beirne played 6 to try fit 3 lads on. But McCarthy and Beirne are miles ahead. Ryan doesn't offer much and it effected our lineout too. Baird at 6 and Beirne in the row would've worked better.
On Osbourne I don't like him being shuffled around. He is talented enough to nail a spot so hope he is let do that. But we'll have a specialist 10 in Prendergast at 22 maybe so Frawley days in squad will be hit as Osbourne can cover 11 to 15 much better.
It is hard judge Murray but well what is plan is it to plan for next 3 months or 3 years.

Will disagree on Crowley and I haven't seen any calls for Prendergast to start personally.

Disagree massively on Ryan, he's been good for Leinster and was great last season. He's exclusively a tighthead lock now, not a highlight player like he was at the start. He's no way a weakness in this squad. Beirne is better and I'd suggest that he's lost the yard of pace that allowed him to play 6 so I agree Ryan goes to the bench, it's not a weakness though.

Agreed on the rest. Osborne has been ever present for Leinster this season and seems to have overtaken Henshaw, he deserves a start v Argentina or Oz too. I think Henshaw's days at 13 are done with Ringer and Osborne available and I could see Ringrose covering 12 within 18 months as Bundee (thought he was poor yesterday too) moves on.

 

[Zapphod]

Could be a very sucessful tour this for the Kiwi's. France will be a step up, and at least whoever schedules their fixtures has a warm up against a tier 2.

To be honest I expected us to lose 3 out of the 5 games (England, Ireland and France), so I will be happy if it is just 1 out of 5.

 

[Umaga's Witness]

Bit worried about the loss of Catt, my feeling is that Goodman's attack with Leinster was quite direct which won't translate well to international level.

Obviously it took Catt a good while to properly imbed his system so one game is way too early for proper fears but something I'm concerned about.

why did they get rid of Catt anyway?

 

[big ginger 8]

why did they get rid of Catt anyway?

Not sure we did. Press release at the time said he'd decided to move his family back to England.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Not sure we did. Press release at the time said he'd decided to move his family back to England.

Then moved to Aus
Apparently Leicester offered him a coaching role but he didn't want the grind of the season

 

[Umaga's Witness]

I was going to say the typical All Blacks fan is going to see this as proof Ireland were always **** and only beat us because we had Foster. Clean sweep to SH over the weekend just proof that Foster was the only thing that changed. And then atypical All Blacks fan went and proved me right in the other thread. It amazes me how bad rugby fans are at actually watching rugby to tell how good teams are rather than just comparing records to historical context as if that is relevant.

 

[IT157]

 

[miccloarch]

Totally with Squidge on this one.

Ireland's defence was actually pretty good most of the game but their ball handling was shocking, especially in the last 20 minutes.

Even their scrum was okay. Was under constant pressure from us but they only conceded one scrum penalty and even shoved us slightly backwards once (legally). Their lineout was shoddy though.

Ireland had an off day but we forced them into a lot of errors too.