Heineken Cup Final 2022/23: Leinster Rugby v Stade Rochelais

[pagliaccio_euforico]

One thing I saw after watching highlights. For byrne's decision to kick to the corner, Kelleher was in the bin and sheehan didn't have a chance to come back on. Meant vdf had to take the throw. They got away with it it being straight but man I can't believe they forced a back row to take a throw instead of taking a kick. There was plenty of time on the clock to get the ball back even if they missed.

 

[Groundhog]

One thing I saw after watching highlights. For byrne's decision to kick to the corner, Kelleher was in the bin and sheehan didn't have a chance to come back on. Meant vdf had to take the throw. They got away with it it being straight but man I can't believe they forced a back row to take a throw instead of taking a kick. There was plenty of time on the clock to get the ball back even if they missed.

Van der Flier had to throw for Ireland most of the game against Scotland this year!

 

[big ginger 8]

The kick was absolutely out of Byrne's range, it was the right decision not to go for it. He's shown plenty of bottle before with taking kicks. The DG should have been gone for imo and was saying it at the time but its also in Leinster's DNA that they always go for the try in that situation. Didn't work out obviously but I'm not sure about it being an argument of not backing yourself.

He should have nailed at least one of the conversions that hit the post though. Those were well within his capabilities.

 

[munstermuffin]

The kick was absolutely out of Byrne's range, it was the right decision not to go for it. He's shown plenty of bottle before with taking kicks. The DG should have been gone for imo and was saying it at the time but its also in Leinster's DNA that they always go for the try in that situation. Didn't work out obviously but I'm not sure about it being an argument of not backing yourself.

He should have nailed at least one of the conversions that hit the post though. Those were well within his capabilities.

The difference was Leinster were down to 14 so should have taken DG. Yes I know La Rochelle were down a man too but less numbers allows for more errors. Like even the kick to the corner was awful kick. Should of at least been hitting the 5m or in around he just got in 22.

And this isn't just RB but the whole part of game just was where Leinster lacked someone to man up and take control. I would argue the DG was a case of not backing himself. Fair enough on kick but Leinster didn't have anyone that took control and bossed the whole bit. Like your 9 and 10 should be controlling it and managing the game

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

One thing I saw after watching highlights. For byrne's decision to kick to the corner, Kelleher was in the bin and sheehan didn't have a chance to come back on. Meant vdf had to take the throw. They got away with it it being straight but man I can't believe they forced a back row to take a throw instead of taking a kick. There was plenty of time on the clock to get the ball back even if they missed.

I don't think he had the range, was a good bit further out than v Aus and he had 77 mins on the legs, but it was just total panic second half. And we were 6 up also and could have put the ball in the corner early in the second half. A try there kills the game for me and we had similar opportunities throughout last year's final doing the same thing.

But that is it and challenge of being continuous. ROG can't keep.using underdog narratives but for now it worked like if this game wasntin Dublin it would have actually benefitted Leinster more as the Fublin final helped build all grudges for La Rochelle. That was the stem of all chips.

That's exactly my point though, it can only go so far and it wouldn't work for Ireland, which is of interest to ROG, and Leinster, which isn't.

As for having a go at opposition fans. I just saw he said he was getting abuse all the time once he was there and some by coaches box or en route were over the top and personal. Can't comment on it but if it were true then I suppose perspective is needed but as Groundhog said maybe he should have been bigger person. Like I do kno a neutral or 2 last week asked was Leinster the new Glasgow with booing and it is an unfortunate thing that has vrept in there over excessively the last few weeks but this is a risk when the non natural fans dilute in and I've seen it here in Limerick before and elsewhere so it not a Leinster solely thing but like us before I hope Leinster do go above and beyond to stamp it out.

I can guarantee that LaR fans boo more and are more abusive than we were. If anything last year's match led into it this year. I liked how hostile we were as a crowd, we didn't support the team well enough in Marseille but did on Saturday, probably the only positive out of it is it might have woken the Leinster crowd up a bit.

Regards leadership is that a top job issue too like Leo even when you try jate him you struggle as I've met him a few times and he is a total gent. Someone described him as the Roy Hodgson of rugby before and I agree as in he is a great person and not obnoxious or above it. Has time for everyone. Like do you need a ROG though who personality wise is a prick like but what you need in war. Sexton the same.

I don't think that needs to come from the top, it did with us for Cheika but not Schmidt. To be honest, whilst we remain a favourite a siege mentality won't work. You can't send a Leinster team out against Toulouse telling them they're massive underdogs and need to fight when they haven't been able to lay a finger on us.

It can be dealt with through assistant coaches, see Edwards in France, and more leaders on the pitch. Nienabar should help in this regard but the fact that Luke McGrath is a highly regarded squad leader but not trusted to replace JGP having one of his worst games in years says all you need to know about the Cullen / Lancaster era. Cullen is lucky that Lancaster is leaving in a way and he needs to use the opportunity become a bit more ruthless.

On bust up at h/t rumours are spinning and hard to know if SOB was statuoned or what as how would he know ROG would go there and why was Sexton there and why is it Sexton was the one most in trouble it seems for going after Peyper. Hard to say

I think Sexton's role has more or less been confirmed to be waving two fingers at Peyper on the pitch after the game (as in he made two bad calls, not flipping the bird) and backing up SOB in the tunnel. His name just grabs the headlines.

 

[munstermuffin]

@Le Frére Alpha the issue with Leinster is they will never be able to use underdog tag as Irish media alone blows the hype train up too much.
Like it same for players just out of academy that need time to develop at senior level but they automatically put as a next Lion. Harry Byrne being the biggest example

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

@Le Frére Alpha the issue with Leinster is they will never be able to use underdog tag as Irish media alone blows the hype train up too much.
Like it same for players just out of academy that need time to develop at senior level but they automatically put as a next Lion. Harry Byrne being the biggest example

We should never really be underdogs, not any time soon, there's realistically been one team in Europe capable of beating us each season over the last 5 years, we've just happened to run into them each year and had a couple off days against them too. La Rochelle will be favourites against us when we get to them next year but no one will discount Leinster ever.

Prendergast, Crowley, Healey, HB, Carbery, Hanrahan, Jackson, Madigan, Keatley, Sexton, hell even Iain Humphreys. Any young 10 showing the slightest promise gets hyped, the media are obsessed with 10s, not Leinster.

 

[munstermuffin]

We should never really be underdogs, not any time soon, there's realistically been one team in Europe capable of beating us each season over the last 5 years, we've just happened to run into them each year and had a couple off days against them too. La Rochelle will be favourites against us when we get to them next year but no one will discount Leinster ever.

Prendergast, Crowley, Healey, HB, Carbery, Hanrahan, Jackson, Madigan, Keatley, Sexton, hell even Iain Humphreys. Any young 10 showing the slightest promise gets hyped, the media are obsessed with 10s, not Leinster.

Sorry should say not just Leinster here but more so now and that is for obvious reasons. And not just 10s just Irish media here do go out of their way to over hype guys. But some more than others like Hanrahan was over hyped alot of other non Leinster were not. Masigan I wouldn't say was. He was hyped for few good games for Leinster I'm on about lads hyped before they play 1 senior game

 

[Reiser99]

No denying that but I did say right after the semis that we shouldn't be big favourites. It's the ridiculous narratives going about that started this talk, I think ROG has been classless and delusional too in adding to it. "LaR a Small club", "disrespect from Leinster", even had a go at the fans and that's forgetting that the half time incident was almost certainly his doing given his previous. All so totally needless. I'd have said at the start of the week that I'd take him as a Leinster coach in a heartbeat, he can stay in France, don't want him near the Ireland squad either unless he's successful without the small man, chip on shoulder shtick. It just doesn't last in pro sport, case in point - Munster rugby.

They don't go the galactico route which is why they're very successful but they're winning races for signatures left and right. Hastoy being a prime example, he was wanted by 9 French clubs, they've massive, massive spending power and pick and choose the best players from smaller clubs with a few star signings to build a great side. The idea they're a Small club is insane.

Leinster are the ones financially doping apparently. The overall spend is big because the structure is to keep a massive squad for development, it's backed by a union based on the earnings of the international team and who Leinster develop the majority of players for. I think the average player salary is very unlikely to crack the top half of the top 14. It's also IRFU policy to really restrict Leinster's imports. The central contracted guys are on big money in the 350k - 700k (Sexton and Furlong) region but that's 8 players.

But when it comes down to it, if you want your club to get better, copy Leinster because it's possible and affordable to tap into local knowledge at club and school level and educate from there, we copied most of it from the Crusaders. Copying LaR is only possible for a handful of French clubs.

I don't think I have disparaged LaR, it certainly wasn't my intention to, they're a great team, fantastically coached and deserve their success. The bullshit thrown at Leinster has been inaccurate and classless though and is being lapped up by media everywhere as fantastic. We shouldn't be favourites against them any time soon though, and we really need to figure out how to beat them, we owe them big time, the base is there for us, the direction needs some tuning.

Genuine question. Has this success come at the expense of the rest of the Irish provinces? I mean Munster scrapped through to the final by upsetting Leinster's second team and it's been pointed out that during the rest of the season Leinster would have won.

 

[pagliaccio_euforico]

@Le Frére Alpha
Leinster was down one when it happened. The YC happened when LR scored.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Genuine question. Has this success come at the expense of the rest of the Irish provinces? I mean Munster scrapped through to the final by upsetting Leinster's second team and it's been pointed out that during the rest of the season Leinster would have won.

It just goes to who is producing the players, we have advantages there yeah but if Munster produced 5-6 starters in the next few years which is very possible the gap will be bridged somewhat. The IRFU do try to artificially balance it out by not allowing Leinster a marquee signing or two like Munster and Ulster have.

@Le Frére Alpha
Leinster was down one when it happened. The YC happened when LR scored.

Sorry I meant the last penalty we kicked, thought it was bad call to take the points there.

 

[munstermuffin]

Genuine question. Has this success come at the expense of the rest of the Irish provinces? I mean Munster scrapped through to the final by upsetting Leinster's second team and it's been pointed out that during the rest of the season Leinster would have won.

I'd argue we still had chance regardless of who Leinster sent out as our mentality was spot on. Add in we were missing a good few too. Bot saying we definitely would have won but not a definite we would loose.

And no it isn't to detriment of Irish rugby. The bar gets set and it drives standards

 

[pagliaccio_euforico]

I kind of have doubts about ROG at the international level. He's assembled a crew of broken toys with a couple of out and out stars. He's reformed them and made them play at the highest level. Idk if his vibes train will work with players who have no reason to believe they aren't the best in the world.

 

[Stade Rochelais]

Am I the only one to think that the loss of Scott Fardy penalized Leinster.

 

[Stade Rochelais]

"Les Irlandais ? Ils sont assez spéciaux" Grégory Alldritt critique certaines attitudes du Leinster

Grégory Alldritt est à nouveau revenu sur les coulisses de la finale remportée par La Rochelle face au Leinster. Le numéro 8 maritime a notamment souligné des manquements dans l'organisation dublinoise à l'encontre...

www.rugbyrama.fr

Champions Cup - "The Irish? They are quite special" Grégory Alldritt criticizes certain attitudes of Leinster
By Clement Labonne
On 05/22/2023 at 7:54 p.m.
Grégory Alldritt once again returned behind the scenes of the final won by La Rochelle against Leinster. The maritime number 8 in particular highlighted shortcomings in the Dublin organization against families from La Rochelle.

Grégory Alldritt still had enough voice to debrief the La Rochelle victory against Leinster in the Champions Cup final (27-26). Guest of the Super Moscato Show, on RMC this Monday, the number 8 from La Rochelle once again returned behind the scenes of the meeting. Asked about the organization of the final, Grégory Alldritt did not put his tongue in his pocket.


"It is often said that it is the French who are arrogant, not fair play and that the British are great. At the organizational level, the La Rochelle club has tried to do everything possible so that families can access at the stadium and they had a lot of barriers. It's really a rather special atmosphere. When I read in the press that they put someone in front of the referees' locker room so that Ronan O'Gara can go and talk to them... are details, but they are quite special, but we don't stop there."

No hard feelings against James Ryan
Before the altercation which took place at half-time of the meeting, involving in particular the La Rochelle coach and Jonathan Sexton, Grégory Alldritt had explained that James Ryan "did not look him in the eye" at the time of the toss. A lack of respect for the third center line of the Maritimes, but the main interested party has, it seems, already erased this history.



"No, I didn't meet him after the match. And then, there is a form of humility. Me, I know that when I lose, I don't really like everyone coming to shake my hand. with a big smile. Afterwards, I have nothing against him at all. I'll meet him again, there's no problem about that.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Aldritt comes across pretty badly in all of this tbf,
The not looking him in the eye thing has already been proven to be a lie seeing as all of these interactions are on film

I get that they probably spent weeks riling themselves up for the occasion but as soon as the game was done they should've chilled out a bit

 

[pagliaccio_euforico]

Michael Jordan use to gaslight himself, the media, and the public that other players disrespected himself in order to motivate himself. He was incredibly successful but also a huge asshole.

 

[Smurfy]

I, and most Irish rugby fans that I know, have been huge admirers of Aldrit for a few years, but he's coming across as a whingeing fanny in this, and it makes me question the veracity of their other complaints. The match was played in Dublin but Leinster were not the "home" team, and as has been explained ad nauseum Leinster and the IRFU were not involved in the accommodation issue. That was completely down to the EPCR, and any complaints should be directed at them. Tbh the story of Ryan "not looking him in the eye"/staring at him" has changed a few times, depending on who Aldrit or ROG are talking to at any given time, and it's beginning to look like a complete fairy tale.

 

[big ginger 8]

The guy who got concussed didn't meet him after the game?

Seems like the perfect captain for ROG.

I do appreciate some good old pettiness in fairness.

 

[Jimbo]

Feel for Leinster and their fans they are consistantly excellent and entertaining to watch (if it's not your team getting pumped), it has to be difficult to keep a level head when you are dominating teams often barely getting out of 3rd (including the Irish side which the spine consists of Leinster) the end product is probably thinking on some subconscious level we turn up we win, it's generally what happens, however there will often be a team that your style just doesn't do so well against almost rock paper scissors scenario, the real shame of it all is the shroud it's now is with all the Ill feeling and accusations of who's done what and said what, This is where rugby and it's values are supposed to be a point of difference.