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EOYT: Wales v Samoa, 16/11/2012

These names are being banded about because there aren't any other options. Kirby Myhill has been called up to the Welsh squad, so if Rees and Hibbard aren't available against NZ and Austrailia, Myhill will be on the bench, and that is looking quite likely atm. Is that really any more ridiculous than Baldwin and Parry?

In regards to fly half, again who else is there for the Aus game in particular? At the moment, only Priestland will be available, so someone has to come into the squad to cover 10 from the bench. Hook, Henson, Stephen Jones, Nicky Robinson and Steven Shingler are all unavailable because the fixture falls outside the international window, so that leaves someone at the regions. The options are: Aled Thomas at the Scarlets, Matthew Morgan or Sam Davies at the Ospreys, Sweeney, Patchell or Tovey at the Blues, and finally Robling and Steffan Jones at the Dragons. One of them has to come in, so mentioning them isn't laughable at all. Tovey would be my choice, but he desperately needs a run of games for the Blues. Sweeney adds nothing. We're in a mess!

Nothing fickle about it either. We're not calling for change for the sake of it, we're looking ahead to who will be unavailable/injured for the NZ and in particular the Australian game.

There's no denying that Aaron Jarvis struggled massively yesterday. He did well against Argentina, but was absolutely blown away in almost every aspect of the game against Samoa. Having a weak scrummaging hooker next to him in Ken Owens probably didn't hep in the scrums, but there's no excuses for missing tackles. Samoa do have some monster scrummaging props though, so we'll see how he goes against NZ, he's still probably our first choice for the moment.

Sorry Dull but let's be straight here.

Myhill has yet to be called up, he maybe due but as of yet he's not officially called up, same went for Lloyd Peers, who trained for most of last week with Wales. Baldwin and Parry are not good enough, if you would like to disagree with me then fine but they are not good enough.

In regards to the fly halves yes the options you have mentioned are laughable ... what have the likes or Robling, Ceri Sweeney, Matthew Morgan (not ready), Sam Davies and Aled Thomas done to deserve a call up let alone a mention. Sorry but this is plain ridiculous. I thought last night was bad but to see these names mentioned has topped it off.

The term 'fickle' applies to what has gone previous. People called for the changes and those didn't work and the people who were harping on about the changes are either keeping quiet / slagging the ones off / not saying anything about the changes they want. I am not naming names but they are there to see. People quickly forget.
 
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Sorry Dull but let's be straight here.

Myhill has yet to be called up, he maybe due but as of yet he's not officially called up, same went for Lloyd Peers, who trained for most of last week with Wales. Baldwin and Parry are not good enough, if you would like to disagree with me then fine but they are not good enough.

In regards to the fly halves yes the options you have mentioned are laughable ... what have the likes or Robling, Ceri Sweeney, Matthew Morgan (not ready), Sam Davies and Aled Thomas done to deserve a call up let alone a mention. Sorry but this is plain ridiculous. I thought last night was bad but to see these names mentioned has topped it off.

The term 'fickle' applies to what has gone previous. People called for the changes and those didn't work and the people who were harping on about the changes are either keeping quiet / slagging the ones off / not saying anything about the changes they want. I am not naming names but they are there to see. People quickly forget.

Riiight, you say all of that without offering any sort of alternatives.

It is looking likely that Hibbard and Biggar will miss the next two games, and we know which French and English based players won't be available for the Australia game (that's all of them bar Charteris and from what I gather Gethin Jenkins). So whilst the options being discussed are laughable from an 'omg we might actually have to consider this', they are the ONLY options we have. I have basically named every possible options, and not many stand-out, because as you've said none of them have done anything to deserve to be called up, but that's the choices available! Or have I missed someone?

I thought the commentators for the Samoa game on S4C said that Myhill had been called up. I may have been mistaken and that he was just training with the squad, but him and Parry are obviously the ones in line if Rees is also out, otherwise they wouldn't have had anything to do with the squad.

We called for the changes, and they were still poor. I see no reason why they can't be criticised for that. Very, very few players from both games have performed. I don't think it's just the players faults, because I think Howley and the regions need to shoulder some of the blame as well, but doesn't take away from the fact that almost to a man the players haven't stood up to be counted.
 
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Riiight, you say all of that without offering any sort of alternatives.

It is looking likely that Hibbard and Biggar will miss the next two games, and we know which French and English based players won't be available for the Australia game (that's all of them bar Charteris and from what I gather Gethin Jenkins). So whilst the options being discussed are laughable from an 'omg we might actually have to consider this', they are the ONLY options we have. I have basically named every possible options, and not many stand-out, because as you've said none of them have done anything to deserve to be called up, but that's the choices available! Or have I missed someone?

I thought the commentators for the Samoa game on S4C said that Myhill had been called up. I may have been mistaken and that he was just training with the squad, but him and Parry are obviously the ones in line if Rees is also out, otherwise they wouldn't have had anything to do with the squad.

We called for the changes, and they were still poor. I see no reason why they can't be criticised for that. Very, very few players from both games have performed. I don't think it's just the players faults, because I think Howley and the regions need to shoulder some of the blame as well, but doesn't take away from the fact that almost to a man the players haven't stood up to be counted.

Offer alternatives ...

Hooker (s) - Emyr Phillips / Kirby Myhill and Rhys Thomas.

For me Scott Baldwin is not a man that I have much faith in, people say Ken doesn't scrummage, neither does Baldwin. His throwing is at times suspect and my gut feeling tells me he is not the man for Wales.

Emyr is a player who is not playing regional rugby week in week out but he is a player when he does that gives his all and is not a terrible player. He offers himself round the park and his throwing is good. What might go against him is his bulk. Little small.

If for a short term for the NZ game, then I would be tempted to bring back Rhys Thomas. He has international experience, over 20 caps. If we are scared about giving a youngster a shot on the bench for the All Blacks game, then I would be tempted to bring him back. He's not been playing bad for Wasps but neither has he excelled. A stop gap fix if Rees / Hibbard are back in time for the Australia game.

Kirby Myhill has a lot going for him. He is no doubt a future Welsh international hooker. A mobile hooker, my only concern is that he has not played enough regional rugby this season like Emyr Phillips. I would however seriously consider Myhill getting selected.

Fly Half (s) - Jason Tovey / Rhys Patchell and Steffan Jones.

Tovey has been involved in the Wales setup and I think he could earn a recall if they were looking to get another fly half in. However what's holding Tovey back is his fitness and the fact he has slightly struggled for form in a dire Blues side. However he can't be much worse than Preistland so might as well give him a call.

Rhys Patchell is another guy I really like, an attacking fly half who will take ball up to the gain line and get the team over it. He has been a bright spark for the Blues this season but lack of game time recently might well hamper a call. He does sometimes make errors but that will hopefully change over time. The lad can play but is it to soon?

If Wales wanted to go down the youth route, then another would be Steffan Jones. Similar to Patchell really. Another player than will eventually get a call for Wales.

Sort your question out Dull?

On the point of laughable ... Aled Thomas, Sam Davies and Robling are not good enough.
 
I think you probably miss-understood why the likes of Baldwin, Aled Thomas, Sam Davies and Robling were being mentioned, I, and others were basically giving every possible option, regardless of quality. I stated that my picks would have also been Tovey at outside half and I'd be happy with Myhill at hooker (I'm expecting big things from him in the future). I also like Emyr Phillips very much, very under-rated player, but I believe he only returned today from injury, so might be a little short of match fitness. If we only need cover for NZ, then Rhys Tomas could be an option, but I would personally prefer one of the younger options like Myhill.

Tovey's issue is that he hasn't had a run of games for almost a year now. He wasn't used much by the Dragons in the final 6 months there while they blooded Steffan Jones and Robling, and he's been unlucky with injury at the Blues. I think it is much too soon for Patchell, even though I really like the look of him. Matthew Morgan has more experience, but hasn't shown anything to suggest that he wouldn't get trampled at international level! I'm not a fan of Steffan Jones tbh. I've not seen that much to suggest he'll be anything more than an ok regional player, but he comes into the reckoning such is our desperation for the Aus game. Honestly, they are all rather lousy options at the moment, and this probably shows that the WRU need to stop organising these extra games outside of the test window.

As for the final three. Aled Thomas has been ok for the Scarlets (better than Priestland anyway), but I agree he's not what is required. I'm also not a fan of Robling (much to the disappointment of my sister, as he went to the primary school where she works), too flaky. Not sure what to say about Sam Davies, I can't decide if he's got potential or if he's got to where he is because of who his father is, time will tell.

Edit. So ultimately it looks like we mostly agree on who should be called up if required ;)

p.s. sorry for the constant editing of my posts. I'm quickly typing whilst preparing for an exam on tuesday and constantly realising that I've missed a couple of points out.
 
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Could do with a fly-half that knows what he's doing and can control a game (and his own body) though...

Aye, true. I'd be gutted to see Wellies back for us, no disrespect to the man, but it would show what a shocking state we are really in.
I don't think it matters, what is the difference between a 70 or 80 point loss? (Being conservative).
Besides, Wellies can't play against Aus, so we are still left with one.
 
Great win for Samoa!!!! Wales need to FIO and very quickly, that game was not good for them at all.
 
I have just joined this forum.
I was wondering if any others were feeling the same as me about the last 2 Wales games, and sure enough i am glad to see you all do.
I dont have to ring the samaritans now.
 
I have just joined this forum.
I was wondering if any others were feeling the same as me about the last 2 Wales games, and sure enough i am glad to see you all do.
I dont have to ring the samaritans now.

Welcome to the forum. Pity its not under better circumstances.
 
Welcome to the forum ! Don't worry, we all feel the same...

Am I the only one who just cant think of any way we can turn this around? I'm expecting between 40 - 60 points against us in the next two games.
 
I have just joined this forum.
I was wondering if any others were feeling the same as me about the last 2 Wales games, and sure enough i am glad to see you all do.
I dont have to ring the samaritans now.

I am not the person you want ot be around during a loss.

Draggs' sporting year:
-RWC debacle
-Sharks lose CC final
-Shane retiring
-Cross Keys lose B/I Cup final
-Whitewash in Aus
-Awful HC/Amlin performances
-Rangers close
-Sharks lose S15 final
-Sharks lose CC final
-Awful HC/Amlin performances
-This

Fark me, can I support Leinster? I love BoD, he is my hero, and the greatest thing ever. Johnny10, Johnny10, Johnny10. Eh... O'Gara sucks?

For highlights: Beating WP-Stormers was pretty nice while it lasted. Grand Slam of course. Ospreys Pro12 wasn't bad. The Keys beating Ponty in the final was great.
 
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"Am I the only one who just cant think of any way we can turn this around?"


chuck on a team of players who WANT TO PLAY FOR THEIR COUNTRY. The passion is missing.
Too many nervous and lacklustre performances
 
Why not choose Ulster we haven't lost in yonks!

Sharks A, OK.
I can feel better as well, because you haven't won an HC lately, so I am not truly glory-hunting yet.

Rumours that Biggar and Hibbard could make it for this weekend.
 
Credit to our coaches for getting all the boys on the same page, especially with so many players coming in late. They kept the gameplan simple and made sure we played in the right areas of the park.

To be honest, I'm not surprised by the result. Before the game, I thought maybe Wales only had an edge in the scrum department, but besides the small doubt in our scrum, I thought we had the clearly better halves and we matched up pretty well in the other positions.

Our scrum has improved in the last few years, but I don't think anyone would've predicted us to be as dominant as we were in the 2nd half. We're finally creating some depth in the frontrow, and it's nice to think J.Johnston and Mulipola are still young and still have potential to fulfill. J.Johnston also had his best game to date for Samoa, as he had been largely underwhelming in previous games. I've watched him for Harlequins for the last two seasons, and I couldn't quite make out why he wasn't performing for us, because he's dominated some big names in Europe. Hopefully this game gave him confidence and he continues to bring his club form when he plays for Samoa.

Avei was pretty hopeless up until now for us, particularly with his line-out throwing, but in these last two games, he's been good and has yet to throw a crooked one. I would still start Ti'i Paulo, but if Avei starts again, it wouldn't bother me.

How many MOTM awards does Kahn Fotuali'i want? He's won so many while playing for us - he's so good, he's even won them when we've lost. I think we'll start to see more kids in Samoa with the name Kahn now.
 
Sharks A, OK.
I can feel better as well, because you haven't won an HC lately, so I am not truly glory-hunting yet.

Rumours that Biggar and Hibbard could make it for this weekend.
just you wait it can't be long!
 
Rumours that Biggar and Hibbard could make it for this weekend.

That would be a surprise! I thought both would be out for a fair few weeks, especially Biggar. I was surprised to see him in the stands during the second half, I honestly thought he would have fractured his jaw or his skull.

It'd be a big boost to have them back. Any news on Ian Evans? Charteris must start against NZ anyway, but having second row cover on the bench that isn't Lloyd Peers would be nice.
 
just you wait it can't be long!

zbuwb.jpg


Nothing on Ian Evans. Shingler/Tipuric on the bench, Jones to second row if needed?
 
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