EOYT: England v New Zealand, 01/12/2012

[big ginger 8]

I predict England's first choice front row will be the Lions first choice front row.

Just thought I would share that!

No offense.

 

[TRF_Cymro]

I predict England's first choice front row will be the Lions first choice front row.

Just thought I would share that!

Cool but there are a few players who would like to disagree with that.

 

[Wilko's left boot]

Only just had the chance to watch the game. Err, don't know what to say really.

The whole team were just bloody brilliant really. On the other hand, I would say the only ABs that turned up were Savea (to some extent) and Jane (despite his dodgy start).

 

[Shaggy]

Congrats England ... deserved winners on the day, by all accounts, and TRF shield holders to boot!

... A red card to the cable network for not showing the All Blacks game for the second week running, but from the highlights I've seen, it looked like a pretty good game

 

[UilamOsa]

England deserved it. Whereas Australia deserved the draw (imo), England clearly deserved this - the AB's were outplayed in almost every area. I thought Smith struggled the most and Dagg had his most disappointing game of the season. So much indecision from the Backline, it seemed that the test match experience was swapped.

It was a solid game, disappointed in the loss, but hey - everyone has to have one and it'll make the 6nations much more interesting. Especially if England can play like that again.

 

[SomeOke]

A lot of talk about the All Black back-line malfunctioning and I'm not sure it's as simple as that.
This game was won upfront, pure and simple, with good steals, contesting the ruck and slowing down the ball the English had control of the breakdown. The All Blacks can't function if they don't have fast ball, can't string their phases together due to steals and having their half-backs under pressure through a dominated break-down point.

Smith looked bad today, but I feel most half-backs would have fared the same. Launchbary, Youngs, Robshaw and the rest won this game, not Tuilagi performing, or the NZ back-line under performing (although Carter and Smith uncharacteristically missing a few tackles did not help.)

 

[Joseph14]

No offense.

Your chap coming on with half hour to go. Not a bad option.

I know that opinion may be frowned upon but is it that outlandish?

 

[austingtir]

A lot of talk about the All Black back-line malfunctioning and I'm not sure it's as simple as that.
This game was won upfront, pure and simple, with good steals, contesting the ruck and slowing down the ball the English had control of the breakdown. The All Blacks can't function if they don't have fast ball, can't string their phases together due to steals and having their half-backs under pressure through a dominated break-down point.

Smith looked bad today, but I feel most half-backs would have fared the same. Launchbary, Youngs, Robshaw and the rest won this game, not Tuilagi performing, or the NZ back-line under performing (although Carter and Smith uncharacteristically missing a few tackles did not help.)

I agree they got some good steals but i think the game was actually won in the backs. The NZ forwards as bad as they were did enough to keep us in the game iv seen plenty of AB games where the forwards were a bit under the gun, but our D in the backs and general decision making was as bad as it could be. The only player i thought was under real pressure (all manufactured by himself imo) was A smith and it might of crept through the team at stages.

I mean really England didnt do much in the first half other than collect points just that second half after we scored they were on fire got a try off a bad decision by read but their other two trys were well taken.

Hindsight is always good but i bet Hansen really regrets not subbing Carter and A Smith. A Smith is always going to struggle to cover a guy like Tuilagi after he's busted Carter. I would prefer we went back to a bigger flyhalf like another Cowan or marshall (even with the slow passing) as i think although they've changed this 5 second rule a player like A Smith is going to be struggling to stop these big players if teams can run them at him and England managed that in this game.

I actually think that is the key to beating this AB side not enough teams have run someone like tuilagi hard at our ten channel since Kaino left. England did a good job of it in this game.

 

[187]

Easy guys. The All Blacks have lost one game in the last 21 matches. There's no need to panic. It was the end of a long year and this England team were on fire, they were brilliant, out-fricken-standing. But I'd much rather still be an All Blacks supported than any other team (although England is my 2nd fave team). We're allowed to have off-weeks and our tactics just need tweaking not overhauling like Australia's or any one else's we've beaten this year.

We're still the number one ranked team by a mile and we have better depth than any other team. Like I said, England were just massive today. But these loses are quickly forgotten after we chalk up a few wins. Get over it and have faith in the coaches and players that they'll be better for it.


Wellington Lions | Wellington Hurricanes | All Blacks | 'Ikale Tahi & now England!

 

[SelimNiai]

I agree they got some good steals but i think the game was actually won in the backs. The NZ forwards as bad as they were did enough to keep us in the game iv seen plenty of AB games where the forwards were a bit under the gun, but our D in the backs and general decision making was as bad as it could be. The only player i thought was under real pressure (all manufactured by himself imo) was A smith and it might of crept through the team at stages.

I mean really England didnt do much in the first half other than collect points just that second half after we scored they were on fire got a try off a bad decision by read but their other two trys were well taken.

Score Points? In Rugby? What a crazy notion

 

[TRF_Cymro]

I mean really England didnt do much in the first half other than collect points just that second half after we scored they were on fire got a try off a bad decision by read but their other two trys were well taken.

Heaven forbid a side collect points to build up a lead. Score points? In rugby? ... Pure madness.

As Bruce Forsyth would say ... 'Points mean prizes!' (prize being victory)

 

[UlsterRugby2012]

Well not the whole front row, I think it will be Healy Heartley Cole tbh.

 

[j'nuh]

Well not the whole front row, I think it will be Healy Heartley Cole tbh.

How is Healy doing in the scrum these days?

 

[austingtir]

Heaven forbid a side collect points to build up a lead. Score points? In rugby? ... Pure madness.

As Bruce Forsyth would say ... 'Points mean prizes!' (prize being victory)

what a couple of boffins you two are all i meant by it was they didnt have to do much to actually get those points i mean a few blows of refs whistle and they were up by 12 points. Good on them to they deserved the lead doesnt matter if it was penaltys or trys just so happens its was penaltys.

As a Kiwi i always prefer try's and if theyd won the game by 38-39 points just through penaltys id be spewing but as it is they scored arguably the best trys of the match.

 

[UlsterRugby2012]

Sarcasm?

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

I mean really England didnt do much in the first half other than collect points just that second half after we scored they were on fire got a try off a bad decision by read but their other two trys were well taken.

England could potentially have beaten Aus if they had kept the score board ticking over rather than trying something fancy. The stats are overwhelmingly in favour of taking 3 points rather than trying to get tries unless there are exceptional circumstances (really dominant forwards for example so you can just scrum/maul across the line). Not taking the points cost us the Aus game and it did a lot to win this one.

 

[William18]

I think his terribly made point was that England weren't that dominant in the first half. If Carter kicked his two penalties then we could have gone into halftime down by 12-6. Not the end of the world and the game would still be on. It was the second half where England really galloped away when our defence fell apart.

 

[TRF Mr Fish]

Yes but remember, we scored a couple of tries anyway, so the points difference at half time wasn't major - regardless of how we had done in the first half, points wise, if we miss the number of tackles in the second half in the same positions as we did today, a six point difference isn't going to win us a game.

 

[Peat]

A lot of talk about the All Black back-line malfunctioning and I'm not sure it's as simple as that.
This game was won upfront, pure and simple, with good steals, contesting the ruck and slowing down the ball the English had control of the breakdown. The All Blacks can't function if they don't have fast ball, can't string their phases together due to steals and having their half-backs under pressure through a dominated break-down point.

Smith looked bad today, but I feel most half-backs would have fared the same. Launchbary, Youngs, Robshaw and the rest won this game, not Tuilagi performing, or the NZ back-line under performing (although Carter and Smith uncharacteristically missing a few tackles did not help.)

I'm with this oke. England seem to have developed a pack that can mix it with anyone in the loose, physical and streetwise beyond what their size and experience would dictate. To me they were the key element.

 

[big ginger 8]

Your chap coming on with half hour to go. Not a bad option.

I know that opinion may be frowned upon but is it that outlandish?

From the English frontrow yesterday I think Cole's the only one who you could say deserves a start even then Gatland would probably pick Jones over him. I'd be doubtful Youngs will even tour.