England World Cup Squad

[IT157]

2003 England weren't boring or ugly though, what they were was dominant. It was "boring" in that they nearly always won the forwards battle but we had our backs getting involved all the time. The rugby we are playing now lacks control, vision, dominance and creativity. 2003 England had all of those. You don't get to play **** rugby and then try to somehow claim it's the same as the 2003 lot.

Some examples of one of the more forgotten names. How is any of this boring?

In all fairness those missed tackles are less likely to happen today in international rugby against tier 1 opposition. Commentator even goes on about the weak Welsh tackling. Do that today and it would have been stopped at the gain line with very little traction for England, and Johnny Wilkinson would have had to kick to the corner.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

The Times reporting Farrell to 10, Smith to full back.

 

[Noonz]

Currently for a 6N squad I'd want something like:

LP: Genge, Rodd, Obano - Obano just about edges out VRR for me by being younger. He'll be 32 come 2027 while VRR will be 34. Not impossible that he'll still be performing well at that age but he would certainly be on the older end of the spectrum. Too early to consider Baxter as a legitimate option.

HK: George, Dan, and literally whoever performs best in the next few months out of Langdon, Dolly, Frost, Walker, Blamire. That 3rd position is very much up for grabs, and Dan hasn't exactly nailed down the 2nd slot either. Special mention to Sam Riley who has looked seriously impressive in his limited chances at Quins. Him and Baxter are going to form some front row for them in the coming years.

TP: Sinckler, Stuart, Heyes - picks itself really on account of there not really being anyone else. I still have hope for Heyes; he is still a baby in terms of tightheads.

LK: Itoje, Martin, Chessum, Isiekwe - again I think it more or less picks itself. Far too early for Chessum Jr to be coming in and as Olyy said neither of Coles or Clarke really scream international quality. Jonny Hill could fight his way back in with a good start to the season. Will be 33 in 2027 so not a write off.

FL: Curry, Ludlam, Earl, Pearson - I could be forgetting someone but again, this pretty much picks itself.

N8: Mercer, Willis - I wouldn't be bringing in CCS yet. He's talented and has a lot of potential but he's young and raw. Didn't perform as well in the U20s as expected. Maybe if we bring back the whole apprentice thing but not otherwise.

SH: Mitchell, JvP, Warr - personally I'm really hoping to see Quirke get back to the form he was showing pre-injury. If he does then he's the pick of the bunch IMO, but on current form you can't pick him over Warr.

FH: Ford, M. Smith, F. Smith - Atkinson has a chance to force his way in here but personally I'd give the edge to Fin. In the long run it'll work against Atkinson that he's 2nd choice at Tigers while Fin is very much steering the ship at Saints.

IC: Kelly, Ojomoh - Atkinson could force his way in here but I think it's a little early for him.

OC: Lawrence, Dingwall - Both EJ and Borthwick seem to be very keen on Joseph Jr but personally I haven't really seen it yet. Would be happy to be proven wrong though. Will also say that in the long run I do see Lawrence as a 12 internationally; think his pace has been exposed a bit defensively in the 13 channel recently.

WG: Arundell, Murley, Freeman, Roebuck - Radwan probably the slightly controversial omission here but there are still some very noticeable holes in his game. I know there are holes in Arundell's too but Radwan is 5 years his senior.

FB: Steward, Malins - personally I don't like Malins being on the wing at all. He just doesn't have the athleticism for it. But at Bristol I expect he'll be playing pretty exclusively at 15 which I see as his best position.

That's 34 players. How do the apprentices work; are they technically part of the 36 or additional? If part of the 36 then bring in Baxter and CCS as apprentices. If not then bring in 2 of the nearly-theres I mentioned.

What about Thacker? I thought he did well at Bristol but I don't know much about him

 

[AngloScotsHybrid]

2003 England weren't boring or ugly though, what they were was dominant. It was "boring" in that they nearly always won the forwards battle but we had our backs getting involved all the time. The rugby we are playing now lacks control, vision, dominance and creativity. 2003 England had all of those. You don't get to play **** rugby and then try to somehow claim it's the same as the 2003 lot.

Some examples of one of the more forgotten names. How is any of this boring?

Probably not the best example as England lost that game but yes I agree with the point.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

In all fairness those missed tackles are less likely to happen today in international rugby against tier 1 opposition. Commentator even goes on about the weak Welsh tackling. Do that today and it would have been stopped at the gain line with very little traction for England, and Johnny Wilkinson would have had to kick to the corner.

Nobody is claiming the 2003 team would win today, just that they weren't boring or in any way comparable to how the current crop play.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

What about Thacker? I thought he did well at Bristol but I don't know much about him

Makes Dan look like George at the lineout

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Makes Dan look like George at the lineout

Makes Dan look like George on the scales too

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Good god.

The more cynical amongst us may say that's our first choice 12 at 10, a 13 at 12, a 15 at 11, a 10 at 15, a 14 at 13 and a 15 at 14. At least the 9 will know where to put his zimmer frame.

Actually I quite like that centre combo.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Nobody is claiming the 2003 team would win today, just that they weren't boring or in any way comparable to how the current crop play.

That's fair, although most are in their 50s.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Makes Dan look like George at the lineout

Interesting article about Dan's very strong Romanian heritage in today's paper. He's fluent in the language and both parents are Romanian, only moving here a couple of years before he was born. Grandfather was a THP in the first division over there.

 

[IT157]

Nobody is claiming the 2003 team would win today, just that they weren't boring or in any way comparable to how the current crop play.

That says more about the changes that have happened in rugby in the last 20+ years

 

[Bada-Bing!]

Probable England XV to face Chile M Smith; M Malins, E Daly, O Lawrence, H Arundell; O Farrell, D Care; B Rodd, T Dan, K Sinckler, D Ribbans, G Martin, L Ludlam, J Willis, B Vunipola.

 

[BrokenWing]

That's fair, although most are in their 50s.

Are we talking about winning the World Cup? Or against present day England?

 

[BrokenWing]

Haskell talks for five minutes about how too many changes to a team upsets the balance and affects performance, and then proceeds to name a completely different fifteen that he'd play against Chile.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Haskell talks for five minutes about how too many changes to a team upsets the balance and affects performance, and then proceeds to name a completely different fifteen that he'd play against Chile.

Are you suggesting that Haskell doesn't put much thought into his rugby analysis?

 

[BrokenWing]

Are you suggesting that Haskell doesn't put much thought into his rugby analysis?

No. I'm suggesting he doesn't put ANY though into it.

To be fair to them, they'd talked a lot of rugby for that podcast.

 

[Lé Ddanno]

Haskell talks for five minutes about how too many changes to a team upsets the balance and affects performance, and then proceeds to name a completely different fifteen that he'd play against Chile.

I don't know how you manage to listen to him.

 

[Becca]

I don't know how you manage to listen to him.

I second that.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

I don't know how you manage to listen to him.

Agreed. Although I admittedly have been really enjoying the Aus version. 2 very intelligent ex-players who only left the game a short time ago and so have plenty of relevant insight. Plus Drew Mitchell. And they don't smack you over the head with banter every 2 seconds either.

 

[BrokenWing]

Well, it is said, Percy, that civilised man seeks out good and intelligent company, so that through learned discourse he may rise above the savage and closer to God…..

Personally, however, I like to start the day with a total ******** to remind me I'm best.