England vs South Africa 20 / 11 / 2021

[Ragey Erasmus]

So majestic

 

[TRF_Olyy]

 

[thejackal]

What's the general consensus on how this South African team will look like when the World Cup comes around? It looks like an ageing team, a great team they are but do they have another few years in them ?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I don't think there's anyone in the (realistic) first choice 23 that'll be too old by the RWC, but there'll definitely be some in the wrap-them-in-bubble-wrap-just-in-case age range
They've definitely got the players in reserve, but they're not being rotated in ATM so would be pretty green (internationally) if called upon

I remember the All Blacks were always known for bringing guys through well - they'd get them consistent time off the bench, the odd start, etc. so that when a big name did retire they had a guy with 20, 30 + caps ready to take his place

I don't get bringing Frans Steyn back in tbh - sure he's still got a boot but he's slow and looks out of shape, would've been better to get a new guy game time off the bench in his place (same with Kriel on the wing and WLR starting at 15, tbh)

 

[Eleutherarch]

I got corralled into going bowling (yes, really . . .) with the family - missed the match and avoided the score. Just finished watching the game now.

Wow - BIG congratulations to England. You made our defence look totally inept at times (some work to be done there for sure). The players you were blooding looked assured, not at all skittish. Encounters with England are always the ones that make me the most nervous. I was bricking it the entire time at the bowling alley (evidenced by me bowling a muscular 83). Turns out I was right to be nervous.

As for us, the usual story. I don't take the Bomb Squad for granted but at this point, the outcome is pretty predictable and it tends to draw away attention from that fact that we are having massive difficulties with finishing. Time after time, commanding positions are simply squandered. The couple of pick up and goes prior to Kwagga being held up (good work by Malins) was totally bloody uninspiring. Our game looked to be a little more expansive this week but rusty, and that will never change if it's an approach pursued once in a blue moon. Is Nienaber seriously this repressive when it comes to working on attacking play?

Herschel Jantjies has not demonstrated an ability to perform adequately on multiple occasions. Pollard is becoming a liability and slotting a few easy-to-moderate kicks does not absolve a run of mediocre displays. De Allende and Eben crushed it yet again.

 

[Umaga's Witness]

Kwagga ****** that up on the line.

Good match for a neutral even if a bit messy at times.

Reinach was poor.

 

[Jer1cho]

Fair play to England. Better team on the day. We were close though. It's been a long season and I think it was just one game too far for us. Etzebeth is still better than Itoje though. Lol. Also, Marx is too good to wait 40 minutes to bring on.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

South Africa won't win the next RWC. It's won't have been 12 years.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

SA need to build some more depth in the backs and IMO they should be fine.

 

[Jimbo]

SA need to build some more depth in the backs and IMO they should be fine.

I'd agree, IMO Whilst some the decisions leading to England conceding pens were just plain wrong, there was still more than enough dominance throughout to have won it, of all the nations they probably
have the least work ons, everyone knows exactly what's coming but stopping it is something quite different, based on stats and general second half dominance SA probably win yesterdays game 8/10 time. Not to diminish what was a pretty find England performance under the circumstances but you certainly wouldn't want too many contests like that.

 

[MikeTheNative]

It will be interesting to see where SA go from here now. A loss to England away is far from the end of the world but I think they might need to shake things up a bit to stay on top so to speak. When they do try play a bit they do look dangerous with the ball, it's just their first thought is to kick.

 

[Eleutherarch]

It will be interesting to see where SA go from here now. A loss to England away is far from the end of the world but I think they might need to shake things up a bit to stay on top so to speak. When they do try play a bit they do look dangerous with the ball, it's just their first thought is to kick.

If we are getting slow ball out of the ruck outside of the 22, then I'm fine with kicking it. However, the kicks yesterday were about as contestable as an advocate for democracy in a court in Hong Kong. That **** ain't happenin'.

You want to talk about watching some oaks being kak under the high ball . . . Psst Pollard.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

Missed the game LOL. Went to a party assuming it would at least be on somewhere. Its true what they say about assumptions..

Can't say I am surprised but I really did wish we could end on a high. Truth be told as is it feels like a bit of a 50/50 year but maybe that's a fair reflection and a win here would've just been paper over the crack particularly in light of NZ's poor tour (meaning we shouldn't be too chuffed over our one game win over them and a series win over a very stagnant Lions side).

Probably more important is the fact that Aus turned us over twice, Wales and Scotland made a game of it and England now looked like they did an Aussie on us if I read between the lines.

I'm not overly concerned going forward and here again I am going to make some big assumptions.. I am not overly concerned going into 2023 as I assume the staff saw 2021 as a 'getting back on the horse' and we will see these next two years going into 2023 as us gearing ourselves for France 2023. Hopefully back will be three of our most significant players in Faf de Klerk, PSdT and Kolbe. Even apart from Faf and Kolbe we were without Hendrickse and Nkosi for 9 and 14 as well. Not that I think the staff see Hendrickse as Faf's understudy just yet but this year would've been an ideal intro but for his leg being murdered. He did look good the little chance he had though. So did Dweba. We also blooded NJvR, Wiese and Fassi with mixed success. My biggest wish is Gelant and Fassi to permanently replace Le Roux. Or even Green as a back up OB.
My biggest concern is at 10 though there is still time for form to return? or youngsters (Wolhuter?) to step up? Though TBH I'd be surprised if we see rookies for SA at a RWC- we tend to be overly conservative.

Will have to watch the game before I can comment but man, how competitive is 2023 going to be?!

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

SA rely very heavily on their set piece. When they are in a game where they have a chance to use it, it's virtually impossible to stop. In games where there are few set piece moves or sides are somehow able to nullify it, SA's only real attacking tactic seems to be to kick and then challenge the catcher. England had no problems with the SA kick games but the constant penalties meant SA got a LOT of set pieces to use. I think that skewed things quite heavily in SA's favour. Without the 3-1 penalty count going SA's way, they would have really been struggling to keep up.

I was pleasantly surprised to see England actually scything through the SA defence on quite a few occassions rather than trying to bludgeon our way through. SA got into the game in the 2nd half when we started tons of aimless kicking. We got back on top when we stopped that, in the same way we were on top when we weren't doing that at the start. Jones take note, the endless kicking game DOES NOT WORK.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Don't Worry SA fans Tigers will get Pollard back to his best

 

[unrated]

Don't Worry SA fans Tigers will get Pollard back to his best

I hope you guys have a dedicated kicking coach as there is none at the Springboks, players are expected to train kicking on their own as Nienaber has given time caps to his coaches on how long they may work with players and what info they give as to avoid information overload. They probably don't want a Goal kicking coach to take up the very limited hours they have to work with the squad.
So hopefully Tigers can invest there if they get Pollard.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

I hope you guys have a dedicated kicking coach as there is none at the Springboks, players are expected to train kicking on their own as Nienaber has given time caps to his coaches on how long they may work with players and what info they give as to avoid information overload. They probably don't want a Goal kicking coach to take up the very limited hours they have to work with the squad.
So hopefully Tigers can invest there if they get Pollard.

I think Dave Alred works with all our kickers atm, most teams have a similar setup as Nienaber tbh it's just not worth the money to hire a kicking coach for the time they would spend.
Also tbh don't know if Pollard will come money on Japan, but Aled Walters would prob be good for him from a conditioning POV

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

countries from the Prem are the only unbeaten ones this AI's

 

[Scotty]

I did it! Managed to go all yesterday and watch the game this afternoon without anyone spoiling for me!

So just watched it and am very happy with Blamire and Rodd, expecting them to get demolished but they held their own. And this experience will be very valuable to them.

Gutted Manu went off as i really wanted Smith Manu Slade to get a shot, but Malins is a pretty class act.

Steward will get 100 caps. He pops up in the right places, runs the right line and is solid in the air.

We played a territory game today, i want England to open play up more and we looked dangerous when we did but this wasnt the game for running it from everywhere.

So glad Smith stayed cool and slotted his kicks.

God it was a good physical tense game!

Steyn drop goal attempt straight from goal line drop out was great....Smiths DG attempt was terrible but not the worst option just before half time

 

[Wasps92]

Can't stop watching Raffi's try. His pass to Slade from the line out was simply sublime.