England V Wales - 29th May

[MojoPin]

totally agree, i cannot see the point of having both considering priestland is unlikely to be selected as a 'wild card' next year. im hoping that this time anscombe does come on in place of biggar for at least the last 30. priestland can cover full back. although it would have made more sense to have a winger on the bench, if liam williams gets injured, Amos can move to full back then put the winger in his place. only then need anscombe/priestland to cover 10. as anscombe has been getting a good run of games at 10 for the blues this should be an indication he will start to cover 10 for wales but as youve said it hasnt so far!

Yeah, definitely one of the stranger choices in the Wales squad. Especially considering Gats was the one to tempt him over from NZ, has been touted as a potential Wales 10 from day one. He's been playing very well for the Blues lately too - very good at getting the backs into the right spaces and has greater passing ability than I've seen from Biggar (though Biggar is excellent in other areas of course).

Glad to see Moriarty,Turnbull and Scott Williams in the lineup though, looking forward to seeing how they get on.

 

[AzaMatt]

Yeah, definitely one of the stranger choices in the Wales squad. Especially considering Gats was the one to tempt him over from NZ, has been touted as a potential Wales 10 from day one. He's been playing very well for the Blues lately too - very good at getting the backs into the right spaces and has greater passing ability than I've seen from Biggar (though Biggar is excellent in other areas of course).

Glad to see Moriarty,Turnbull and Scott Williams in the lineup though, looking forward to seeing how they get on.

i agree, his range of passing and decision making seem to be better than biggar and he also isnt afraid to go for the gaps himself. i can probably count on one hand the amount of times biggar has done this in the past several years. Anscombe certainly deserves a shot at 10 and this is the perfect game to try him out for at least 30 mins. the only problem is gatland is unlikely to want to take biggar off as he will be main goal kicker (not that anscombe is bad in this department) with halfpenny out its unlikely that biggar will get taken off in close games.

cant see many turnovers from that back row but good luck to the opposition 7's trying to steal ball from us. we should be securing ball quite well with them three at the breakdown.

 

[Peat]

Clifford has mostly played 7 at quins I believe, Harrison played a lot of 8 (though is a 7 more than that), and Hask has played across the backrow, but only really excels when given a fixed role for a run of games, and has been running at 6.

So a 6 at 7, a 7 at 8 and a 7/8 at 6....

I still suspect that Eddie looks for straight line speed with regards to who wears the 7 shirt, and that's the part that determines who's 6 and who's 7. As odd as his running style is, Hask can still cover ground.

Fairly sure Clifford's seen more as an 8 a Quins and has probably booked more time there.

Exactly the team I expected bar the lack of Robshaw. Not sure what that's about, if anyone needs a rest you'd have thought it'd be Hask.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Haha Dan Lydiate and Moriarty back-row - maybe we actually have a chance after all?
Please don't start Haskell.

Edit: Damm, Haskell is starting

Ok so slightly embarrassed to ask this but actually who is Teimana Harrison and how good is he? Looking for honest answers.
Hmm, just youtubed him and watched him for a bit. Couldn't believe it at first, we seem to have a backrower who plays with the skill and physicality of a kiwi - jst looked it up, and he's a kiwi .

How good, though?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Haha Dan Lydiate and Moriarty back-row - maybe we actually have a chance after all?
Please don't start Haskell.

Edit: Damm, Haskell is starting

Ok so slightly embarrassed to ask this but actually who is Teimana Harrison and how good is he? Looking for honest answers.
Hmm, just youtubed him and watched him for a bit. Couldn't believe it at first, we seem to have a backrower who plays with the skill and physicality of a kiwi - jst looked it up, and he's a kiwi .

How good, though?

Kiwi lad from the same neck of the woods as Hartley.
Very very good player. Great at the breakdown and a hard carrier, tackler and rucker. Been the best player on the pitch whenever I've seen Saints play.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

I should imagine that Kvesic will play a part against Wales esp. as he is the only backrow replacement.

Barring injuries he'll get 15/20 minutes and that's when he needs to show Eddie what he's got.

Which is not remotely going to outweigh the 100s of club minutes he'll have been watched this season. Not saying I agree, but Jones clearly doesn't rate rate him that much and that's all there is to it. And when Underhill and Hughes (wouldn't be surprised to see him at 6) are in the picture the odds of him getting a run plummet further.

 

[Raggs]

Who was Kvesic actually picked in front of by Lancaster? Every time Lancaster tried to pick Fraser he was broken, so we can't count him. The only other 7s I can think of available to Lancaster were Seymour and Wallace I think? Now EJ is picking Harrison in front of him as well.

Has Kvesic been as close to breaking into the seniors as we've thought? Or is he only there because he's pretty much one of the last choices for openside?

 

[Duck a l'Orange]

Who was Kvesic actually picked in front of by Lancaster? Every time Lancaster tried to pick Fraser he was broken, so we can't count him. The only other 7s I can think of available to Lancaster were Seymour and Wallace I think? Now EJ is picking Harrison in front of him as well.

Has Kvesic been as close to breaking into the seniors as we've thought? Or is he only there because he's pretty much one of the last choices for openside?

It's pretty moot because Lancaster picked basically zero flankers other than Robshaw, Wood and Haskell.

Croft, Johnson, Clark, Kvesic, etc, featured briefly but it wasn't as if Lancaster was searching desperately for a new breed of flanker.

 

[Raggs]

Perhaps, but Kev wasn't often picked in the EPS either I don't think, generally Saxons, with Clarke always seemingly favoured.

I hope he gets a genuine shot, but when Hughes and Beaumont come back, we may well see Vunipola move to 6 and one of those two in the 8 shirt (or some combo), leaving even more of our 6.5 types competing for the 7 shirt.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

On Hughes: has Eddie Jones ever mentioned him?
I've had a quick Google but can't see him ever bringing him up, just 101 articles saying "Hughes will certainly be starting next 6n" etc.
Maybe he's not as much a shoe in as everyone thinks.

 

[Patchey]

On Hughes: has Eddie Jones ever mentioned him?
I've had a quick Google but can't see him ever bringing him up, just 101 articles saying "Hughes will certainly be starting next 6n" etc.
Maybe he's not as much a shoe in as everyone thinks.

I really would like to think this...

But if his form stays the same the only reason not to pick him would be quibbles about the nature of his eligibility.

And seeing as Jones is happy to kick Te'o, I'm not sure that's an issue for him.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Kvesic must be extremely frustrated. There's obviously something the coaches don't like and if he's got real international ambitions I wonder if he's thought of taking himself off to SH for a year or so to see if he can improve his game in a different environment. He's been playing in the AP for quite a while now and keeping doing the same old is likely to lead to the same old outcome.

It would take him out of contention for a while, but then again he's not really in it. Probably doesn't help that Gloucester's not exactly a hotbed of excellence at the moment either.

 

[Duck a l'Orange]

Kvesic must be extremely frustrated. There's obviously something the coaches don't like and if he's got real international ambitions I wonder if he's thought of taking himself off to SH for a year or so to see if he can improve his game in a different environment. He's been playing in the AP for quite a while now and keeping doing the same old is likely to lead to the same old outcome.

It would take him out of contention for a while, but then again he's not really in it. Probably doesn't help that Gloucester's not exactly a hotbed of excellence at the moment either.

He should move to Toulon/Clermont/Racing 92 on a one year contract. Immediately he would become the best player ever and every newspaper would scream for his selection.

Then he just has to come back to England and take his pre monogrammed England 7 shirt.

Edit to add: Teimana Harrison has got rid of his god awful neck beard and is now roughly 800% more endearing.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

And those dreadlocks he used to have....yeesh

 

[Duck a l'Orange]

Has Lawes bulked up recently? I know he's been criticised recently for not being as strong in the tight as he has been (I can remember him being referred to as the "grunt" lock in 6 Nations threads around 2013).

He looks a lot heavier around the chest and shoulders in photos from today's captains run than he has done. Something to do with the personal programme every England player's supposed to have been given by Jones perhaps?

 

[Peat]

Kvesic must be extremely frustrated. There's obviously something the coaches don't like and if he's got real international ambitions I wonder if he's thought of taking himself off to SH for a year or so to see if he can improve his game in a different environment. He's been playing in the AP for quite a while now and keeping doing the same old is likely to lead to the same old outcome.

It would take him out of contention for a while, but then again he's not really in it. Probably doesn't help that Gloucester's not exactly a hotbed of excellence at the moment either.

The answer is almost definitely physical power and I'm not sure he can do anything about it.

Kvesic's position could be worse. He was in the 6N squad, he's in this match. He's missed out to Harrison for this tour which is a blow, but lets be honest, Harrison will probably be mainly carrying tackle bags. There's a lot of talented back rows who are simply nowhere in contention.

I don't think Jones' plans for England are set in stone yet. He doesn't fit the current template, but he's clearly got Jones' eyes on him, so its up to him to make a claim for a place like a player like him. I suspect the best thing he can do is carry/link like Hooper or Tipuric.

 

[Every Time Ref]

Outside chance but he could play himself into more serious contention in this game. Let's say Haskell picks up a knock, Kev gets 40 minutes or more, has a stormer and blows Tipuric off the park. I think Jones is open to being persuaded by a strong claim, and more importantly he will consider England performances much more important than Gloucester ones.

Jones is not an idiot, he does not think Kev's Prem form is unimpressive, he presumably has reservations about his ability to step up to international level. If Kev gets his chance and does step up, I reckon Jones will recognise that.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

The answer is almost definitely physical power and I'm not sure he can do anything about it.

Kvesic's position could be worse. He was in the 6N squad, he's in this match. He's missed out to Harrison for this tour which is a blow, but lets be honest, Harrison will probably be mainly carrying tackle bags. There's a lot of talented back rows who are simply nowhere in contention.

I don't think Jones' plans for England are set in stone yet. He doesn't fit the current template, but he's clearly got Jones' eyes on him, so its up to him to make a claim for a place like a player like him. I suspect the best thing he can do is carry/link like Hooper or Tipuric.

I think it's mainly the physicality which was also something Andy Saul and Fraser were both told to work on at certain points (from interviews I remember seeing).

Harrison is as good on the ground and much more physical (saints biased obviously) but kvesic should look to get stronger and more powerful while keeping his mobility and work rate. Maybe it's a Gloucester conditioning thing?

 

[Which Tyler]

Outside chance but he could play himself into more serious contention in this game. Let's say Haskell picks up a knock, Kev gets 40 minutes or more, has a stormer and blows Tipuric off the park. I think Jones is open to being persuaded by a strong claim, and more importantly he will consider England performances much more important than Gloucester ones.

Jones is not an idiot, he does not think Kev's Prem form is unimpressive, he presumably has reservations about his ability to step up to international level. If Kev gets his chance and does step up, I reckon Jones will recognise that.

He's got a real uphill task to do that - Tipuric is injured. Wales are playing 2 BSFs

 

[Every Time Ref]

So he's practically guaranteed a spot!