England Six Nations thread

[TRF_Olyy]

In a week, and if Adam Jones couldn't do it?

I'd back him to, and I'm a big healy fan these days.
Unlike many props these days Wilsons bread and butter is his scrummaging, and unlike Jones he doesn't have the conditioning of a pre-pro/amateur prop.

 

[TRF_Cymro]

Ah resort to slagging Jones off ...didn't take long ...

 

[Jockstap]

Ah resort to slagging Jones off ...didn't take long ...

He's just jealous of his magnificent hair.

 

[TRF_Cymro]

He does have a lovely mane.

 

[Jockstap]

He does have a lovely mane.

I'm pretty sure it's the source of all his powers.

 

[Jockstap]

I'd back him to, and I'm a big healy fan these days.
Unlike many props these days Wilsons bread and butter is his scrummaging, and unlike Jones he doesn't have the conditioning of a pre-pro/amateur prop.

I dunno mate, to play an international after only 50 minutes of rugby in five weeks is a bit of an ask.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I dunno mate, to play an international after only 50 minutes of rugby in five weeks is a bit of an ask.

That's true, but I think it's more his longevity that'd be the problem, than initial skill.
I'd expect him to do as well as ever for the first 40 (give or take a few) minutes, but fade dramatically afterwards.

 

[j'nuh]

I know I might get some flak for this, but... is there anything stopping us calling up Hoani Tui? He should have qualified on residency? I mean, I know he won't even be in England next year, but if only to get us through this 6N...

We've been saying it for ages now, but Cole has been well and truly crocked by overplaying as far as I can make out.
If someone knows any better correct me, but AFAIK a bulging disk is normally a result of pressure over a long period.

I was interested... 1411 minutes this season, excluding friendlies. Some players have more (eg Rob Cook has more than 1600 minutes so far), but that is insane for a prop. 17 starts and 3 bench games this season. Of his 17 starts, he stayed on the pitch for 70 or more minutes on all but one occasion, 11 games he played for 80 minutes. The one game where he came off before the 70 minute mark was for England btw.

I think it's fair to say he's been run into the ground. Turns out Castro moving from Tigers was a big blow to English rugby.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I know I might get some flak for this, but... is there anything stopping us calling up Hoani Tui? He should have qualified on residency? I mean, I know he won't even be in England next year, but if only to get us through this 6N...

In theory: No.
I'm presuming we'll call up a replacement for Cole, if he's out for the whole tournament.
In practise: Yes.
Tui has been a shadow of his former self this season. He's not done well under the new scrum laws at all, and has had more terrible games than good recently, and really the only game I've thought he looked decent in, this season, was vs Bath on Saturday. He's also moving to France at the end of the season and I can't see Lancaster handing out a few token caps to someone who will then be out of the picture by the time the next international period roles around.

 

[brumtom]

Nobody wants a player and ***an like Dan Cole out, he's the player a team expects to see in the trenches. It would be ignorant to think that this wasn't coming with his playing time over the last 18 months. He needs to rest, he has a huge year ahead of him next year and we need to find some strength in depth. Wilson isn't terrible but it's hard to compare him against our number 1 choice. We all shat it when Corbs knee goes haywire but Lancaster will have to find a way, just like he did with Burrell etc etc. I'd rather have it happen now than the next 6nations. I do worry about a neck injury though.


When will Coles, Corbs and Hartley come back ? It used to be my fave playing team and they were deadly when firing.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

If you want a stop gap there are many players like mercey for saints who are strong in the scrum and won't give away any penalties but won't give you much in the loose. There must be a few players like that who have played Saxons level.

I guess the thing with Thomas is they assumed they could improve his scrummaging while keeping his loose game the same.

Brooke's? Doran-jones if we have to?

 

[Patchey]

Regarding the idea that seeing Thomas get some game time might be good because of his carrying, I don't think he's going to be able to show his best work in the loose if he's being turned inside out by Healy. From a physical point of view he'll be knackered if there are lots of scrums and mentally he's going to have his confidence ruined after a couple of scrums. I don't see him performing in other areas of the pitch if/when the scrum goes badly.

If you want a stop gap there are many players like mercey for saints who are strong in the scrum and won't give away any penalties but won't give you much in the loose. There must be a few players like that who have played Saxons level.

I guess the thing with Thomas is they assumed they could improve his scrummaging while keeping his loose game the same.

Brooke's? Doran-jones if we have to?

Doran-Jones? Please no. Not after his performances this season.

Who are the Saxons props?

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Looking online I think collier, Henry Thomas and doran jones are but merry started for the Saxons the other week.

Maybe Thomas will be ok? If GR gives him him some great scrummaging training! He did it with other props!

 

[Patchey]

Looking online I think collier, Henry Thomas and doran jones are but merry started for the Saxons the other week.

Maybe Thomas will be ok? If GR gives him him some great scrummaging training! He did it with other props!

I'd pick Collier over Doran-Jones anyday. If Merry did well for the Saxons though I imagine he'd be next in line.

I'm inclined to belive that Rowntree sees something in Thomas, unlike the backs coaches he seems pretty ruthless at getting rid of players who don't deserve to be in the squad. However I do question whether an extra week of work will improve Thomas that much. I've never played front row in a contested scrum but I imagine getting good at it takes a long time, hence why professional props usually only start to be consistantly good in thier mid twenties.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Maybe Thomas will be ok? If GR gives him him some great scrummaging training! He did it with other props!

Nope. He's almost certainly the worst scrummager to be involved with the senior setup ever, by a very long margin.

I don't think Thomas was brought in with the intention of actually playing him - just for training because he has great potential.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

He's been in/around the England squad for like a year now, and his scrummaging hasn't improved one iota - he was rubbish vs Saracens on Friday, I don't think an extra week will make much difference.
Doran-Jones is poor, and Brookes is probably the same level as Thomas: Good in the loose, can't scrummage.

Mercey would be a decent shout, better in the scrum than other options, same goes for Collier.

 

[ratsapprentice]

If someone comes in I think it will be Collier.

 

[Mumbles119]

Like the shout of Collier. Is Cooper-Woolley just a bit too early?

It could and would be great to see a talented youngster come off the bench, be totally unfazed, and make a good impact.

(Trying to come to terms on taking a positive risk vs short term safety)

 

[Patchey]

Like the shout of Collier. Is Cooper-Woolley just a bit too early?

It could and would be great to see a talented youngster come off the bench, be totally unfazed, and make a good impact.

(Trying to come to terms on taking a positive risk vs short term safety)

Too early for Cooper-Wooley IMO, I think he's in the same boat as Kyle Sinkler. Post-2015 they be involved, not ready yet though.

 

[ratsapprentice]

I'm pretty sure Collier is considered next in line, he only missed out on his Saxons debut because of an injury.