England 2024/25

[McTallshort]

Will Greenwood got selected on the 97 Lions tour without having played for England, along with an unknown welsh hooker called Barry Williams.

Things were slightly different then.it was coming out of the amateur era and international selection was all over the place. England had 3 centres at the time Guscott, Carling and De Glanvile so Greenwood wasn't getting selected but Geech had seen him play for Quins and Tigers and knew he would suit the game he wanted to play and he always picked a potential bolter. Keith Earl was uncapped in 09. Not sure about Barry Williams but he didn't have a great tour

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Things were slightly different then.it was coming out of the amateur era and international selection was all over the place. England had 3 centres at the time Guscott, Carling and De Glanvile so Greenwood wasn't getting selected but Geech had seen him play for Quins and Tigers and knew he would suit the game he wanted to play and he always picked a potential bolter. Keith Earl was uncapped in 09. Not sure about Barry Williams but he didn't have a great tour

Also Carling had retired
But as said it's massive different era

The Lions have a completely stacked back row options it's not like his tries yesterday where even amazing.

Will be interesting once his second season comes in though and teams start to man focus on him, Alfie Barbeary in his first season was similar.

 

[McTallshort]

Also Carling had retired
But as said it's massive different era

The Lions have a completely stacked back row options it's not like his tries yesterday where even amazing.

Will be interesting once his second season comes in though and teams start to man focus on him, Alfie Barbeary in his first season was similar.

He hadn't actually retired. Apparently he was hoping for Lions selection but when it became apparent it wasn't going to happen he made himself "unavailable". Geech talks about it in his book.

 

[BrokenWing]

The Lions have a completely stacked back row options it's not like his tries yesterday where even amazing.

Even if they were amazing, that shouldn't be the metric used to pick back row players.

 

[Crash Hamster]

Much talk about poor defences in the Prem, but from the Champions Cup quarter finals, an average of 29.25 points scored per team with only one English team present. Winners averaged 42.75.

Defence optional amongst the two French, one Scottish and one Irish teams who lost?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Think I'm becoming a Super Rugby brained sicko in my old age because Bath vs Gloucester was infinitely more entertaining than Toulon vs Toulouse

 

[Lé Ddanno]

Think I'm becoming a Super Rugby brained sicko in my old age because Bath vs Gloucester was infinitely more entertaining than Toulon vs Toulouse

Cut that **** out quick you'll start sleeping upside down

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Cut that **** out quick you'll start sleeping upside down

It's when the mullet comes out that he's really in danger.

 

[Lé Ddanno]

It's when the mullet comes out that he's really in danger.

He's had one ever since Jonny Hill went to Sale

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Much talk about poor defences in the Prem, but from the Champions Cup quarter finals, an average of 29.25 points scored per team with only one English team present. Winners averaged 42.75.

Defence optional amongst the two French, one Scottish and one Irish teams who lost?

It's a very good point. It's funny that English teams start scoring loads of try's and narrative is immediately we've got poor defences rather than brilliant attack.

Then Europe which changes the anti English narrative again. Maybe globally rugby is just focussing more on attack and defences haven't gotten worse, attacks have just improved.

Would be interested to see stats on the various competitions but it will always be warped by French and URC teams sending the bin juice to away games.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Well if the RWC is our ultimate aim, knockout matches tend to be pretty tight - 5 of the 7 QF onwards games in 23 were decided by 6 points or less with another by less than 2 scores.

Defence still matters.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

It's a very good point. It's funny that English teams start scoring loads of try's and narrative is immediately we've got poor defences rather than brilliant attack.

Then Europe which changes the anti English narrative again. Maybe globally rugby is just focussing more on attack and defences haven't gotten worse, attacks have just improved.

Would be interested to see stats on the various competitions but it will always be warped by French and URC teams sending the bin juice to away games.

The narrative is entirely driven by the English though

 

[McTallshort]

What's all this flak Pollock seems to be getting?

 

[Not Mike Brown's Sock]

What's all this flak Pollock seems to be getting?

People just calling him an arse on social media mostly

 

[TRF_Olyy]

In terms of his personality?
He's always come across.......confident.......in his on field actions/interviews,
Think it went up a notch during the 6N with the Lawes article where, while he praised Pollock's skills, you could read between the lines and see he really doesn't like him - also tells two stories of him needing to be put back in his box for acting the ******** in training (one with Saints and one with England)
and now that he's playing well on the European scene he's got eyes from other nations on him too, and he really does exemplify all the negative stereotypes about English rugby players: arrogant, posh, floppy blonde hair

Doesn't help that every other media article these days is about him/bigging him up for the Lions

 

[McTallshort]

and he really does exemplify all the negative stereotypes about English rugby players: arrogant, posh, floppy blonde hair

Doesn't help that every other media article these days is about him/bigging him up for the Lions

If people have a problem with that then **** them too be honest.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

People will always have a problem with English players tbh, just part and parcel

 

[Not Mike Brown's Sock]

People will always have a problem with English players tbh, just part and parcel

He's leaning into the stereotype, and I have no problem with that tbh. He is a posh english bloke with floppy hair. Let him play the heel, it's good for the sport.

Having a panto villain is a good thing for the story.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

People will always have a problem with English players tbh, just part and parcel

I mean not like other players don't get the same reaction

Lowe is equally disliked

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

I mean not like other players don't get the same reaction

Lowe is equally disliked

True, although many will see it a bit differently with Pollock being a kid who needs to pay his dues, be kept in his box for a while etc.

Stuff em I say. There's substance to the way he plays and I think our camp can totally do with that injection of energy and enthusiasm - its infectious and can lift the whole mood.

I'm not picking him over the Currys just yet, but he should be in the conversation. Some kids can burst on the scene, look the part for 5 minutes then vanish, while others just seem ready and he's one of the latter. Things have been going his way, but he's risen to every challenge so far.

But manage him properly - let him be himself and grow up naturally. Don't try to extinguish the spark - every dressing room needs some ebullient characters.