England 2022/23

[HamJan]

Agreed. I think he was a bad choice to begin with.

Main issue is that a new man will have their own way of doing things. It's now less than a year to the RWC. If Seibold doesn't leave until after the AIs, that's basically just the 6N for the new guy to get players to buy into him and get the system embedded in competitive games. Ridiculous state of affairs really.

Mitchell and Jones fell out over Jones trying to prevent Mitchell from watching his son play cricket. That may just have been the straw that broke the camel's back, but I doubt there's a great deal of trust between them.

I remember reading that at the time, but I think I read later on that Mitchell said it was a bit of a storm in a teacup (or words to that effect). I had a suspicion at the time that Mitchell was viewed by the RFU as Eddie's successor, and that a move into club rugby with Wasps would strengthen his connections between international and the clubs. Tbh, I'd be happy to have him back.

 

[Which Tyler]

On another note (and this may be stupid), why didn't the RFu buy Worcester and turn it in to the first centrally run club?

Would be a good thing for getting coaches experiences?

Might be stupid I know.

A] they can't afford to
B] no-one in PRL would allow it

 

[pagliaccio_euforico]

On another note (and this may be stupid), why didn't the RFu buy Worcester and turn it in to the first centrally run club?

Would be a good thing for getting coaches experiences?

Might be stupid I know.

it's been done in America when an owner wants to sell and they can't find a buyer. League runs it short term and then sells it.

Wasps and Worcester players who move abroad can play for England — The Times and The Sunday Times

Wasps and Worcester Warriors players who are forced to move abroad after the financial collapse of their clubs will be eligible for England selection up until the 2023 World Cup, The Times can reveal. The RFU’s strict regulation is that players must be based in England to play for the national...

apple.news

wasps and warriors will be allowed to play abroad

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

It's not really a 'ridiculous state of affairs' though. As I see it, the guy's simply been offered a job that suits him better.

He wasn't bringing anything obvious so I'd see this as more of an opportunity than a setback.

Do other nations have such a high turnaround of support coaches though? I get they can be offered better jobs but that should be the case in all nations. If we are also losing all these coaches to the club game then we should have an abundance of apparently international ready club coaches operating and yet that doesn't seem to be materialising. Something is not right.

 

[BPM]

While I don't think the high turnaround is a good thing and I recognise 'something is not right', I'm also not sure we'd hear much about it if coaches from other countries were leaving their posts. The only time it makes our news is if it's major like NZ getting rid of Mooar and Plumtree but even then that was more newsworthy because it was instead of Foster.

I think being a specialist coach and a 'international ready' coach are two different things. Gustard was exposed away from his comfort zone of defence coaching and while Borthwick is doing a very good job at Tigers, he'd probably tell you himself that he's not ready for the top job with England.

It's not always Eddie either. Some of the turnover during covid was for other reasons - Wisemantel for example. The overall pattern is a worry, but with Seibold, I'm really not too bothered.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

I hope Rodd really nails his scrummaging at some point as the rest of his game is very impressive.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

I hope Rodd really nails his scrummaging at some point as the rest of his game is very impressive.

He's still very young, it'll come. Got a fair bit of filling out to do.

 

[Noonz]

Saw that Will Stuart and possibly Big Joe are out for the Autumn Nations series. I'm betting Sinckler to be recalled but who will get called in for Wing? I hadn't seen May or Anthony Watson in the last squad so perhaps one of them?

 

[HamJan]

I think he'll go for Daley

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I reckon May - EJ has always liked him and he got through 80mins unscathed on the weekend

 

[HamJan]

I reckon May - EJ has always liked him and he got through 80mins unscathed on the weekend

I could see that, but Daley has had a good start to the season from what I've seen and offers cover in lots of positions, which Eddie likes. That said, I'm not a fan of his defensive capabilities at 15 but he's been great on the wing for both England and the Lions In the past.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Forwards
Alex Coles (Northampton Saints, uncapped)
Luke Cowan-Dickie
Tom Curry
Ellis Genge
Joe Heyes
Jonny Hill
Maro Itoje
Courtney Lawes
Lewis Ludlam
George McGuigan (Newcastle Falcons, uncapped)
Val Rapava Ruskin (Gloucester Rugby, uncapped)
David Ribbans (Northampton Saints, uncapped)
Bevan Rodd
Sam Simmonds
Kyle Sinckler
Jack Singleton
Hugh Tizard (Saracens, uncapped)
Billy Vunipola
Mako Vunipola
Jack Willis

Backs
Henry Arundell
Joe Cokanasiga
Owen Farrell
Max Malins
George Furbank
Will Joseph
Jonny May
Cadan Murley (Harlequins, uncapped)
Jack Nowell
Guy Porter
Raffi Quirke
Marcus Smith
Freddie Steward
Manu Tuilagi
Jack van Poortlviet
Ben Youngs

Unavailable for selection due to injury: Alfie Barbeary, Ollie Chessum, Nic Dolly, Alex Dombrandt, Charlie Ewels, George Ford, Tommy Freeman, Jamie George, Sam Jeffries, Nick Isiekwe, Harry Randall, Will Stuart, Sam Underhill, Jack Walker.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Four looseheads and 2 tightheads is a bit weird

 

[HamJan]

Forwards
Alex Coles (Northampton Saints, uncapped)
Luke Cowan-Dickie
Tom Curry
Ellis Genge
Joe Heyes
Jonny Hill
Maro Itoje
Courtney Lawes
Lewis Ludlam
George McGuigan (Newcastle Falcons, uncapped)
Val Rapava Ruskin (Gloucester Rugby, uncapped)
David Ribbans (Northampton Saints, uncapped)
Bevan Rodd
Sam Simmonds
Kyle Sinckler
Jack Singleton
Hugh Tizard (Saracens, uncapped)
Billy Vunipola
Mako Vunipola
Jack Willis

Backs
Henry Arundell
Joe Cokanasiga
Owen Farrell
Max Malins
George Furbank
Will Joseph
Jonny May
Cadan Murley (Harlequins, uncapped)
Jack Nowell
Guy Porter
Raffi Quirke
Marcus Smith
Freddie Steward
Manu Tuilagi
Jack van Poortlviet
Ben Youngs

Unavailable for selection due to injury: Alfie Barbeary, Ollie Chessum, Nic Dolly, Alex Dombrandt, Charlie Ewels, George Ford, Tommy Freeman, Jamie George, Sam Jeffries, Nick Isiekwe, Harry Randall, Will Stuart, Sam Underhill, Jack Walker.

Elliot Daly? what do I know?

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

To be fair, we have a good selection of wingers now. May has been decent but is definitely some way off his best and it feels like he is now on a downward trajectory. Malins has great try scoring form, Arundell is always an option and Coka has recently seen an uptick in his form, although his defence is still suspect. I think he just needs to find some confidence again and offers a crashball option in the centre that the others don't. Radwan has looked less impressive this season but still an option and then there is always Nowell, who is still dependable even if his actual try scoring record now is pretty poor.

EDIT, didn't see the team above. Nailed it.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Swear I watch a different Adam Radwan than everyone else, his form this season has been good - certainly better than Cokanasiga, May and Nowell so far (the latter two have barely played though)
Don't think it was even that bad last season when everyone was jumping down his throat - he was just playing in a poor side

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Four looseheads and 2 tightheads is a bit weird

And Marler not one of them.

Some rewards for form but a few head scratchers too.

Even in the absence of Slade, no Marchant. Daly playing very good rugby in his proper position is overlooked. Lawrence may have a bit more to do yet, but he's starting to properly show what he's capable of.

While I was a bit critical of Murley in the Premiership thread I'd still rather see him given a chance over Malins / Nowell who didn't work last year.

Has Simmonds really done anything to warrant inclusion? If you want an athlete to cover 8 from the bench I'd go Earl all day long at the moment even though he's mainly playing at 7. That said I'd take T Willis over both.

Virtually a whole XV of injuries isn't good, even if some are pretty peripheral.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

And Marler not one of them.

Some rewards for form but a few head scratchers too.

Even in the absence of Slade, no Marchant. Daly playing very good rugby in his proper position is overlooked. Lawrence may have a bit more to do yet, but he's starting to properly show what he's capable of.

While I was a bit critical of Murley in the Premiership thread I'd still rather see him given a chance over Malins / Nowell who didn't work last year.

Has Simmonds really done anything to warrant inclusion? If you want an athlete to cover 8 from the bench I'd go Earl all day long at the moment even though he's mainly playing at 7. That said I'd take T Willis over both.

Virtually a whole XV of injuries isn't good, even if some are pretty peripheral.

Didn't notice this the first time. Are we seriously just building our whole midfield around Tuilagi again and not considering any of the others...?

 

[BPM]

No. We're building it around Porter.