Australian National Club Competition

[Dumbo]

Was it something like... 3 teams in NSW, 2 teams in Qld, 1 team in VIC and 1 team in WA?

Man... you go to wonder what the f&*k is happening in South Australia

 

[sanzar]

Almost, it's NSW 3 teams, Qld 2, ACT 1, WA 1, and Vic 1.

Dunno about SA... they haven't been shown any interest since the rams played down there!

 

[Dumbo]

Think they moved on to killing backpackers...

 

[Kimmy_The_Kiwi]

NZ's comp will always be better

 

[The TRUTH]

Like ........ totally

 

[sanzar]

Originally posted by Kimmy_The_Kiwi@Jun 2 2006, 04:09 PM
NZ's comp will always be better

Quiet you Cataberian bulldog Queenslander of NZ! .

 

[Rassie]

Sanzar be a gentlemen, don`t forget Kimmi is only a teenage girl ! !!!!

A proper answer to her innuendo should have been : "Yeah, OK, but since the dark ages of rugby kiwi babes supporters < any others"

 

[Wally]

Great news this.

The QRU has two options with where it bases its two teams. It's either going to split Brisbane between north and south or have a team based in the city and another on the Gold Coast. My opinion is that they go for the later to encourage the growth of the game in this state, the only negative is that it would be competiting with the ***ans in their inaugral year. I don't think there is much chance of a team in Townsville at the current time.

How will NSW allocate its teams? I hope they don't stick with clubs like Randwick and Eastern Suburbs. Here is a great chance to spread rugby union to an area like Gosford, which is untouched by rugby league at the moment. Perhaps have two Sydney teams based at Waratah Stadium and another at Gosford.

Rugby's problem of course is it doesn't have another window. They have a issue in that they need somewhere to play the non-Wallaby players once the S14 has finished. Now either that can be in the Sydney and Brisbane club comps or it can be in some new comp but either way you'd want to keep professional players playing 25-30 quality matches per year. That means at least 12 weeks on top of a minimum 13 match S14 program. The S14 players become available at the end of May at the earliest and given the international scheduling commitments that really isn't possible for the ARU to change. Even with 12 weeks starting from the beginning of June whichever comp is used is always going to be fighting in the shadow of NRL/AFL finals countdown and the Wallabies local season.

If they play these S14 players in the existing comps then the national expansion and growth of the game in centres like Perth is hampered, if in a new comp then there's all the funding problems. I suppose the ARU's view is that although it knows it will probably run at a loss (at least until the second or third year when they strike a $60m seven year deal with Fox Sports), the benefits for the game in terms of national exposure and player development are worth it. Yes, it'll still live in the shadow of the other codes but the national league has a better chance of taking at least some of the limelight than does the Sydney comp or Brisbane comp. As for the season length, 12 weeks is only one week shy of the old S12 and three weeks short of the S14. They both seem to be accepted as real professional football comps.

For the ARU I really think it's all a case of dammed if you do, dammed if you don't. I find it hard to criticise them in that situation.

 

[rugged]

Yes, it is indeed a step forward for Australian rugby.

Wally, you are right about the QRU's 2 alternatives. I would go for the Brisbane and Gold Coast options too as it would be easier to get the public to support their home town than their side of the river. I can't imagine getting all involved in barracking for Brisbane northside!!

I wonder then how it might work in Sydney. I assume that they can't just uproot players and pay for their accomodation for the duration of the comp and pre-training (they probably will have to for Melbourne though!) as most would have jobs and university courses that keep them tied to Sydney. It would be hard to travel to and from Gosford/Woollongong and Sydney even three times a week. But then again it would be hard to get people to barrack for certain groups of suburbs within Sydney.

 

[THE CHIROPRACTOR101]

sanzar or wally...can ya guys work on this aussie comp and get sum more info pinned so this can join tha nz one and curry cup..u guys can post game schedule

rassie my old friend would like to put input on tha curry cup?..lets get southern hemisphere cracking for the aftermath of the trinations

 

[sanzar]

Yeah, no worries chiro. Just as soon as it becomes available... might be a while yet mind you.

 

[THE CHIROPRACTOR101]

dats allrite aslong as the info is there

 

[Mr. Laxative]

Having had plenty of time for next year's concept to sink in I have thought (fairly quickly) about how such a competition could be improved. Below is my ideas for such a competition.

My comp would be have four divisions with 8 teams in each. This would mean 32 teams:
10 from NSW
10 from QLD
3 from the ACT, Sth Inlands and Far South Coast
3 from WA
2 from VIC
2 from SA
1 from NT
1 from TAS

Comencing in June and finshing in mid-September, the tournament would be played on a home/away basis and would last 18 weeks (inlcuding the two weeks of finals). The point system will be the same as the S14 and the top 4 of each division will progress to the semi-finals. The semis would be played at the home grounds of both the 1st and 2nd placed team but all finals will be played over a weeekend at Aussie Stadium. The top 2 teams from each division would be promoted the following year, where as the bottom 2 would be relegated.

This tournament should keep players, not playing tests at top match fitness (barring injuries), in preperation for a possible Spring Tour selection and may also act as a springboard for untapped talent.

The tournament should be broadcast free-to-air and I would hope that ABC and Channel 7 share the rights.



This is only a very brief outline, so please discuss and if you want to ask any questions do so. Even help me expand on it!

 

[BigTen]

Interesting post Jacko - but I have some questions for you:

1) Players - where would you get them from? Given that your top thirty are going to be on Wallaby duties. I figure that you'd need 30 players for each squad. 32 x 30 is 960 players. That is a lot and it would mean that the quality of rugby would get quite poor after a few rounds.

2) Funding - given that you want free-to-air tv it would mean that you couldn't sell the rights package for that much. The players would need to be paid, the coaches and backroom staff as well. And how about flying these guys all around the country every second week.

3) The crowds - every comp needs to get reasonable crowds and would you expect people to turn up to watch games that would be well below the standards of Super 14 and international tests.

I like your idea but I think that it is seriously flawed and I am sure that if you actually sat down and thought about it you'd agree with me.

The clubs would hate it as well as it would basically end them when you plundered all of their players.

I think how they have done is actually pretty good - depending on how they split up the NSW, and QLD teams of course - that is probably the biggest challenge at the moment.

The ARU is going to have to look at building up rugby in some of the other states. I guess WA could share a couple of games with NT and VIC could also do it with SA and TAS. In a few years maybe those states could actually field their own teams. They do need to keep it to no more than 12 teams though as any more and all they do is dillute the talent too thinly and make it tough to fund it to an adequate level.

 

[sanzar]

Yeah, I think Jacko has some how been tricked into believing that we have more people playing rugby than we do have AFL or League... Your idea makes a lot more sense BT, what Jacko is suggesting is like what Murdoch tried to do with the superleague... and we all know how that turned out.

 

[BigTen]

Baby steps.

 

[eastsrule]

The APC will destroy NSW club rugby.

The standrad of Toohey's New Cup football has imporved dramatically in the past 2 years. What this new APC does is limit the oppurtunities to these players. There is only 3 teams from Sydney and the top 3 teams on the table at the moment (Randwick, Easts and Uni) will be formed into one team. That makes a lot of sense.

For example, at halfback, Easts hvae Luke Burgess who in my opinion is hte best halfback in Australia. He competes with Patrick Phibbs for the Brumbies reserve spot who coincidentally plays for Randwick... Meanwhile the new Uni guy is pretty decent, so what happens to the guy on the bench and behind the other two.

What should have happened is strengthening the club competitions. All this does is weaken grassroots rugby.

 

[sanzar]

How will it destroy NSW club Rugby? The clubs aren't going to disappear, they'll still have their own competition, the only difference is that it will have to take a back seat to the national one... and regardless of whether you think Tooheys New Cup standard has improved a lot in the last 2 years, it is still NO WHERE NEAR the standard of the Super 14 or New Zealands NPC... The other problem of course is that the level of public interest in NSW of Qld club rugby is nothing short of laughable, so pathetically low that the Tooheys New GF generally has about as many people as the average Souths Game in the NRL. With a National comp, the ARU has a chance to also garner more public interest in Australian rugby outside the big teams, the money produced from which could be further used to enhance the grass roots.
As for the problems of player saturation, well what will happen of course with situations like yours is that if one club has too many talented players that they can't find a starting sport for all of them, those players will probably be lured to other clubs.

 

[Mr. Laxative]

Okay, time to better my idea.

How about 10 from NSW, 10 from QLD and 1 each from everywhere (bar NT and TAS)? That's 24 - this way there could be 4 divisions of 6 with the same concept. This way most or all (help me...) of the clubs from QLD and NSW will be involved and thus shouldn't affect the club comps too much - in fact you probably could dissolve them.

Just a thought.

 

[sanzar]

Jacko, no offence, but I still get the impression that you don't quite understand the point of this national comp. The reason there's only 8 teams is because that way the talent will be more highly saturated within each team and thus ensure that the skill level of the new comp will be significantly higher than the current club competitions in NSW and QLD. A 24 team competition would mean that the best talent was spread thin and the quality of the competition wouldn't be much better than the current club format.