Maybe (if Conrad Smith is out injured still which I doubt), but we're down on centre options. Plenty of wing options out there - and I'd certainly argue Ben Smith has the skill set as a 13 but not so much at 14.
-
Help Support The Rugby Forum :
All Blacks Watch - Countdown to June
- Thread starter TRF Mr Fish
- Start date
Maybe (if Conrad Smith is out injured still which I doubt), but we're down on centre options. Plenty of wing options out there - and I'd certainly argue Ben Smith has the skill set as a 13 but not so much at 14.
Regan
Academy Player
- Joined
- Apr 25, 2010
- Messages
- 321
- Country Flag
- Club or Nation
He's committed to no one yet. He's been selected for the squad yes but he still hasn't declared his international allegiance. He was selected for Samoa last year and pulled out - so his selection means nothing. Whilst he is a decent Super/ ITM Cup player I still don't think he's AB material just yet however his ability to play wing, centre and even fullback is huge. Especially now that we have little centre cover. He is only 24 so he's still got a big future ahead and we need to invest our time into younger centres or else we'll end up with none eventually. He is at the moment considered a fringe All Black by Hansen.
I'm pretty sure he's aware where he's at and will most likely decline the Samoa selection.
I think Leuia would be under serious consideration by the All Black selectors.
he's basically been the Hurricanes best back, I recon he is definitely one of NZ's top 3 form wingers and really only Savea is a sure bet for selection.
he's basically been the Hurricanes best back, I recon he is definitely one of NZ's top 3 form wingers and really only Savea is a sure bet for selection.
I think our usual endless depth of talent on the wings is actually pretty slim right now. With Jane injured and Guildford and Gear in ok but not spectacular touch plus Masaga going overseas.
you would also expect Guildford has some other problems going against him apart from form, you would think that unless he finds fantastic form and keeps absolutely clean in every aspect he may not be offered another NZRU contract.
The form wingers up for all black selection behind Savea are Halai, Moala, Tikoirotuma and Leiua
and of that group the most likely are Halai and Leiua
considering the options and even more so if Leiua is gone it's likely that Savea may end up the only specialist winger in the squad with Ben Smith, Ranger and maybe even Piutau covering.
You could say yes Gear would get selected but his form hardly fills me with confidence. Like he would be the default selection because of lack of other options.
you would also expect Guildford has some other problems going against him apart from form, you would think that unless he finds fantastic form and keeps absolutely clean in every aspect he may not be offered another NZRU contract.
The form wingers up for all black selection behind Savea are Halai, Moala, Tikoirotuma and Leiua
and of that group the most likely are Halai and Leiua
considering the options and even more so if Leiua is gone it's likely that Savea may end up the only specialist winger in the squad with Ben Smith, Ranger and maybe even Piutau covering.
You could say yes Gear would get selected but his form hardly fills me with confidence. Like he would be the default selection because of lack of other options.
I think it's a boost sure, but Samoa often has some great wing options and I wouldn't say (at the moment - regardless of age) I probably wouldn't pick him ahead of Tuilagi and Lemi on the wings. Despite what Larksea says - I hardly think hes close to an All Blacks selection (nor do I think any of the others except maybe Halai are close, and even then I'd be suprised). In many ways I think hes a better selection at centre. He has been good for the Canes' recently, but I don't think he get many starts if Jane was there.
he and Halai may be long odds but all it will take is one or two injuries and they will be right in the mix, Halai has the try count and the size but Leiua has versatility.
you would think ranger and Ben Smith would be the front runners to get game time on the wings but with the midfield options short you never know.
I really think there are going to be at least a couple of surprise selections with all the players either injured or going overseas and form going up and down accross the board. Hansen clearly signaling to the NZ public and players that there are changes coming and previously established players may give way to younger in form players.
my understanding is that a training squad of all but highlanders players will be named tomorrow of about 34 players of that I recon 26-28 would make the final squad.
No McCaw, Adam Thomson or Kahui.
pretty sure just the loose forward selections could create a 5 page thread
you would think ranger and Ben Smith would be the front runners to get game time on the wings but with the midfield options short you never know.
I really think there are going to be at least a couple of surprise selections with all the players either injured or going overseas and form going up and down accross the board. Hansen clearly signaling to the NZ public and players that there are changes coming and previously established players may give way to younger in form players.
my understanding is that a training squad of all but highlanders players will be named tomorrow of about 34 players of that I recon 26-28 would make the final squad.
No McCaw, Adam Thomson or Kahui.
pretty sure just the loose forward selections could create a 5 page thread
Regan
Academy Player
- Joined
- Apr 25, 2010
- Messages
- 321
- Country Flag
- Club or Nation
Thanks for that
From what I had read previously he hadn't committed to anyone so good to hear he's made up his mind. Being a Hurricanes fan it's great to have another player hitting the international scene (even if it isn't for the ABs) Samoa isn't a bad squad and they should give Scotland and Italy good games, possibly wins. Tbf if Leiua was to have chosen the ABs he probably would have ended up like players like Gear - hardly making the cut most of the time and ending up with little AB game time. It is of course hard to say as we don't have a crystal ball but regardless he's chosen his birth nation and he should help Samoa continue to grow.
- Joined
- Jul 8, 2010
- Messages
- 2,293
- Country Flag
- Club or Nation
Uncapped Auckland Blues backs Frank Halai, Charles Piutau and Francis Saili have been rewarded for some scintillating Super Rugby performances by being included in New Zealand's wider training squad for next month's series against France.
All Blacks coach Steve Hansen included the Blues trio along with a sprinkling of other new faces in a 38-man squad for two training camps ahead of the three home tests against the French.
Winger Halai, the leading try scorer in Super Rugby, grabbed a hat-trick in Saturday's victory over Melbourne but fullback Piutau and centre Saili have been just as impressive in the powerful backline along with Rene Ranger, who was also included.
Blindside flanker Steven Luatua has also shone under the guidance of new Blues coach John Kirwan this season and earned a call-up with other uncapped forwards Ben Afeaki and Jeff Toomaga-Allen, both props, lock Dominic Bird and Brad Shields.
Back-row forward Shields was included in a similar squad ahead of last year's 3-0 whitewash of Ireland but was not among the nine new All Blacks blooded by Hansen in 2012.
Hurricanes scrumhalf TJ Perenara, who had an outstanding season last year until it was cut short by an ankle break, also earned a call-up, as did goal-kicking Crusaders flyhalf-centre Tom Taylor.
Hansen has retained the old guard of World Cup winners although there is no place for former captain Richie McCaw, who will remain on sabbatical until after the Super Rugby season.
"The camps will give us the opportunity to prepare a foundation on which we can grow our game throughout the series," said Hansen.
"As with last year, it will also give us a small window of opportunity to introduce some young players into the ways of the All Blacks and allow both these players and All Blacks management to get to know each other a little better."
Hansen said exclusion from the training camps did not necessarily mean players would not be in the squad he will name for the France series on June 2.
France, who lost to New Zealand in the 2011 Rugby World Cup final, play tests at Auckland (June 8), Christchurch (June 15) and New Plymouth (June 22).
SQUAD:
Forwards: Ben Afeaki, Dominic Bird, Sam Cane, Dane Coles, Wyatt Crockett, Ben Franks, Owen Franks, Andrew Hore, Liam Messam, Steven Luatua, Keven Mealamu, Kieran Read, Brodie Retallick, Luke Romano, Brad Shields, Jeff Toomaga-Allen, Victor Vito, Samuel Whitelock, Ali Williams, Tony Woodcock.
Backs: Beauden Barrett, Daniel Carter, Aaron Cruden, Israel Dagg, Hosea Gear, Frank Halai, Tawera Kerr-Barlow, Ma'a Nonu, TJ Perenara, Charles Piutau, Rene Ranger, Francis Saili, Julian Savea, Aaron Smith, Ben Smith, Conrad Smith, Tom Taylor, Piri Weepu.
All Blacks coach Steve Hansen included the Blues trio along with a sprinkling of other new faces in a 38-man squad for two training camps ahead of the three home tests against the French.
Winger Halai, the leading try scorer in Super Rugby, grabbed a hat-trick in Saturday's victory over Melbourne but fullback Piutau and centre Saili have been just as impressive in the powerful backline along with Rene Ranger, who was also included.
Blindside flanker Steven Luatua has also shone under the guidance of new Blues coach John Kirwan this season and earned a call-up with other uncapped forwards Ben Afeaki and Jeff Toomaga-Allen, both props, lock Dominic Bird and Brad Shields.
Back-row forward Shields was included in a similar squad ahead of last year's 3-0 whitewash of Ireland but was not among the nine new All Blacks blooded by Hansen in 2012.
Hurricanes scrumhalf TJ Perenara, who had an outstanding season last year until it was cut short by an ankle break, also earned a call-up, as did goal-kicking Crusaders flyhalf-centre Tom Taylor.
Hansen has retained the old guard of World Cup winners although there is no place for former captain Richie McCaw, who will remain on sabbatical until after the Super Rugby season.
"The camps will give us the opportunity to prepare a foundation on which we can grow our game throughout the series," said Hansen.
"As with last year, it will also give us a small window of opportunity to introduce some young players into the ways of the All Blacks and allow both these players and All Blacks management to get to know each other a little better."
Hansen said exclusion from the training camps did not necessarily mean players would not be in the squad he will name for the France series on June 2.
France, who lost to New Zealand in the 2011 Rugby World Cup final, play tests at Auckland (June 8), Christchurch (June 15) and New Plymouth (June 22).
SQUAD:
Forwards: Ben Afeaki, Dominic Bird, Sam Cane, Dane Coles, Wyatt Crockett, Ben Franks, Owen Franks, Andrew Hore, Liam Messam, Steven Luatua, Keven Mealamu, Kieran Read, Brodie Retallick, Luke Romano, Brad Shields, Jeff Toomaga-Allen, Victor Vito, Samuel Whitelock, Ali Williams, Tony Woodcock.
Backs: Beauden Barrett, Daniel Carter, Aaron Cruden, Israel Dagg, Hosea Gear, Frank Halai, Tawera Kerr-Barlow, Ma'a Nonu, TJ Perenara, Charles Piutau, Rene Ranger, Francis Saili, Julian Savea, Aaron Smith, Ben Smith, Conrad Smith, Tom Taylor, Piri Weepu.
- Joined
- May 29, 2007
- Messages
- 4,120
- Country Flag
Hosea Gear has signed for Toulon and will probably be excluded from the June test squad.
My revised (28 man) squad would therefore be:
Hookers - Mealamu, Hore, Coles
Props - Woodcock, Franks, Franks, Afeaki
Locks - Retalick, Romano, Bird
Loose Forwards - Read, Cane, Messam, Vito, Luatua
Halfbacks - Weepu, Smith
First Fives - Carter, Cruden, Barrett
Centres - Nonu, Smith, Saili, Ranger
Outside Backs - Dagg, Smith, Piutau, Savea
With a top 23 of:
1 Woodcock
2 Mealamu
3 Franks
4 Romano
5 Retalick
6 Messam
7 Cane
8 Read
9 Smith
10 Carter
11 Savea
12 Nonu
13 Smith
14 Dagg
15 Smith
16 Coles
17 Franks
18 Afeaki
19 Bird
20 Luatua
21 Weepu
22 Cruden
23 Ranger
My revised (28 man) squad would therefore be:
Hookers - Mealamu, Hore, Coles
Props - Woodcock, Franks, Franks, Afeaki
Locks - Retalick, Romano, Bird
Loose Forwards - Read, Cane, Messam, Vito, Luatua
Halfbacks - Weepu, Smith
First Fives - Carter, Cruden, Barrett
Centres - Nonu, Smith, Saili, Ranger
Outside Backs - Dagg, Smith, Piutau, Savea
With a top 23 of:
1 Woodcock
2 Mealamu
3 Franks
4 Romano
5 Retalick
6 Messam
7 Cane
8 Read
9 Smith
10 Carter
11 Savea
12 Nonu
13 Smith
14 Dagg
15 Smith
16 Coles
17 Franks
18 Afeaki
19 Bird
20 Luatua
21 Weepu
22 Cruden
23 Ranger
I like that side though finding it harder and harder to think of reasons to keep nonu in, all he seems capable of in super rugby is hitting the ball up and missing tackles. Should we just expect him to come out of a phone booth somewhere and become a world class 12 with a black uniform on?
I also think ranger should be given a chance as the clear form 13 in NZ.
IF A smith is selected he will likely be behind Weepu, big if though TKB is prob the best 9 in NZ right now. I had hoped Perenara would have come on more than he has though I still think he will become an established AB at some point.
heck i wonder if Ranger is an option at 12?
I also think ranger should be given a chance as the clear form 13 in NZ.
IF A smith is selected he will likely be behind Weepu, big if though TKB is prob the best 9 in NZ right now. I had hoped Perenara would have come on more than he has though I still think he will become an established AB at some point.
heck i wonder if Ranger is an option at 12?
Toulouse* One of the few SANZAR wingers NOT going to Toulon.
- Joined
- May 29, 2007
- Messages
- 4,120
- Country Flag
Whoops ta, I knew it was Toulouse but apparently I'm conditioned to just write that they're going to Toulon now...
- Joined
- May 29, 2007
- Messages
- 4,120
- Country Flag
Sounds like it will be a 31 man squad, my final three would be Kerr-Barlow, Crockett, and one of Shields and Thrush. Were it up to me, I'd go with Shields. Thrush is a stop gap player - in Bird, Whitelock, Retalick and Romano you have four locks who, unless something goes horribly wrong, will be our four locks at the World Cup. I don't know if there's much use in blooding Thrush - especially when Luatua can cover lock if need be.
Just because I can, here's the squad I would pick and their current caps/ages.
Hooker
- Mealamu (102 caps, 34 years old)
- Hore (74, 34)
- Coles (3, 26)
Prop
- Woodcock (96, 32)
- Franks (23, 29)
- Crockett (11, 30)
- Franks (44, 25)
- Afeaki (0, 25)
Lock
- Romano (11, 27)
- Retallick (13, 21)
- Bird (0, 22)
Flanker
- Messam (20, 29)
- Luatua (0, 22)
- Shields (0, 22)
- Cane (4, 21)
Number 8
- Read (48, 27)
- Vito (20, 26)
Halfback
- Smith (13, 24)
- Weepu (69, 29)
- Kerr-Barlow (2, 22)
First Five
- Carter (94, 31)
- Cruden (20, 24)
- Barrett (5, 22)
Centre
- Nonu (76, 31)
- Saili (0, 22)
- Smith (66, 31)
- Ranger (3, 26)
Outside Back
- Dagg (25, 24)
- Smith (12, 26)
- Savea (5, 22)
- Piutau (0, 21)
Just because I can, here's the squad I would pick and their current caps/ages.
Hooker
- Mealamu (102 caps, 34 years old)
- Hore (74, 34)
- Coles (3, 26)
Prop
- Woodcock (96, 32)
- Franks (23, 29)
- Crockett (11, 30)
- Franks (44, 25)
- Afeaki (0, 25)
Lock
- Romano (11, 27)
- Retallick (13, 21)
- Bird (0, 22)
Flanker
- Messam (20, 29)
- Luatua (0, 22)
- Shields (0, 22)
- Cane (4, 21)
Number 8
- Read (48, 27)
- Vito (20, 26)
Halfback
- Smith (13, 24)
- Weepu (69, 29)
- Kerr-Barlow (2, 22)
First Five
- Carter (94, 31)
- Cruden (20, 24)
- Barrett (5, 22)
Centre
- Nonu (76, 31)
- Saili (0, 22)
- Smith (66, 31)
- Ranger (3, 26)
Outside Back
- Dagg (25, 24)
- Smith (12, 26)
- Savea (5, 22)
- Piutau (0, 21)
Last edited:
- Joined
- May 29, 2007
- Messages
- 4,120
- Country Flag
And Bird out needing surgery - so Thrush gets a bench spot in the All Blacks (presumably) after not even being part of the original 38 man squad! He'll be counting his blessings.
God I hope so. Peranara has so much going for him. People have criticized him for certain things, but I still rate him the best halfback in New Zealand. Two things I think he does better than any halfback I've ever seen: I think his scramble defense is superb, TKB is very good around the ruck, but in loose play from a line break Peranara is amazing. The other is I genuinely have never seen a player with the hands Peranara has, it's like he seems to have sticky glue to them. His delivery has sometimes been a tad delayed when the forwards have been under pressure, but he rarely ever seems to lose ball and he catches things he has no right to catch. On top of that his support play and sniping are very good. So yeah, very happy he should get a chance.
Can't see how he won't get in. Agree hes very lucky, in a funny way at least.
On form he deserves it - he's been one of the hardest workers for the Canes and genuinely provided a lot od good work in the loose. That said - had Ali Williams, Sam Whitelock and Dominic Bird (who I really wanted to see get a chance as well) been fit - they'd have been preferred. Saw a news clip which reminded me that Thrush was IRB JR Player of the year like 9 years ago - and considering hes 28 years old now it seems like a long time coming. Happy for him to get the chance though - been for a few runs up Mt Kaukau and I've seen him do it on his time off this year, so it seems he's been working overtime to get in form this season.
The only thing I worry about with Thrush is hes not the best set-piece opperator, the Canes scrum isn't exactly tight with him there and hes good but not geat in the lineouts.
admartian
First XV
- Joined
- Jul 2, 2009
- Messages
- 1,749
- Country Flag
- Club or Nation
^Agreed. The dude is probably the most talented, natural ball-runners out of the 3. While Aaron Smith is probably quickest off the mark, Perenera looks good with ball in hand.
Sucks he didn't make it - I'd have had him over Weepu. Take some of the losses now (if that's what Weepu is in for - experience) and have the three get used to competing against each other in the Black jersey.
Sucks he didn't make it - I'd have had him over Weepu. Take some of the losses now (if that's what Weepu is in for - experience) and have the three get used to competing against each other in the Black jersey.
austingtir
First XV
- Joined
- Aug 7, 2011
- Messages
- 2,710
- Country Flag
I think all three of those new halfbacks are still a bit young to be fighting each other for the first choice spot. This year i honestly think Hansen is mad if he doesnt select Weepu as first choice (after his concussion) for at least the series against france and go from there. You need an old fulla there to keep them fighting hard to get a spot not just hand it to them on a plate. Peranara to me has the most potential out of the three young guys and i am very suprised that he was not ahead of smith or barlow.
austingtir
First XV
- Joined
- Aug 7, 2011
- Messages
- 2,710
- Country Flag
Also i see on yahoo a poll that has Ben Smith 85% of people think he should be first choice 15...... In previous years the coaches have pretty much leant the way the poles have gone so heres hoping.
