ABs No.6 Steve Luatua - For the future?

[Larksea]

Luatua has had one test that was a dominant team victory against an under par aussie side and he really just did his job nothing special and importantly had a really good work rate didn't make any glaring errors or silly penalties.

My main concern about Luatua is how he will fear in the really physical encounters. I've seen him get dominated a few times in super rugby against south African sides in particular, kinda a bit like Thomson. Really good energy and work rate but he got found out in physical encounters. He is a big guy but overall he's not particularly powerful or strong like Messam/Kaino or even Vito (Vito is bloody strong but at times just doesn't seem to use all of it).

Shields is a work in progress for sure but he has genuine physicality and power. It would be much easier for Shields to add polish to his game than it would be for Luatua or Whitelock to develop the natural power shields seems to have. And it's something that would be of high Value in the AB's back for balance. In McCaw, Read and Sam Whitelock and Retalick and others we have guys in that "workhorse" role. The squad could really use a genuine threat ball running forward, Messam and Read would be the best two forward runners in the squad right now but shields power running probably trumps even those guys.

Still think the most significant advantage Luatua has had is that the blues had space for him in the starting lineup, he would have struggled to get starts in any other franchise, that is the issue shields and whitelock have had this year.

 

[ABs2011]

While I was very impressed with Luatua's run-on performance against the Ozzies and happy to see him show the ability to step up at international level, my preference for Luatua over the others (bar Messam) is based on watching him play for Auckland and the Blues. Of note, these are two teams (particularly the Blues) who have struggled to gain parity in the forwards yet Luatua has still shone out as a class above.

Luatua would struggle to get a start in the other franchises? Are you kidding me? Let's have a look at that more closely:
Hurricanes? Shields v Levave v Luatua = Luatua!
Highlanders? Hoeata v TJ Ioane v Luatua = Luatua!
Crusaders? G Whitelock v L Whitelock v Luatua = Luatua!

All those three clubs would have him starting in a heartbeat! The only question is who would start between Messam and Luatua?

In terms of the most significant advantage Luatua has? I think you are missing the obvious - it is that the All Black selectors picked him to start and therefore he is considered better than the other options! To be honest the central argument you keep coming back to against Luatua is counter intuitive. To try and use the fact that Luatua has commanded starting Super Rugby and All Black run-on spots while the others have not as a point in favour of the unwanted players makes little sense to me. Players earn starting spots because they are better than the rest - you seem to be dismissing that a bit too quickly.


Anyway based on what I've seen of Luatua (and what the AB selectors have indicated), with respect to the thread ***le, I am saying Luatua is the future for the AB No. 6 spot - no doubt about it! I also think we've argued this one to death now

 

[nickdnz]

Crusaders? G Whitelock v L Whitelock v Luatua = Luatua!

All those three clubs would have him starting in a heartbeat! The only question is who would start between Messam and Luatua?

To be fair I don't neccesarly agree with this. Jordan Taufua has hardly been given any change for the Crusaders - and I rate him certainly as a better prospect than George Whitelock - and certainly more than Luke Whitelock. Same with Jimmy Tupou.

 

[ABs2011]

To be fair I don't neccesarly agree with this. Jordan Taufua has hardly been given any change for the Crusaders - and I rate him certainly as a better prospect than George Whitelock - and certainly more than Luke Whitelock. Same with Jimmy Tupou.

Not sure what you disagree with? Who would you start over Luatua? Jordan Taufua?

My example was in reply to Larksea who said "he (Luatua) would have struggled to get starts in any other franchise". I very much doubt that is the case.

 

[nickdnz]

Not sure what you disagree with? Who would you start over Luatua? Jordan Taufua?

My example was in reply to Larksea who said "he (Luatua) would have struggled to get starts in any other franchise". I very much doubt that is the case.

I disagree that just because Luatua is a better player than George Whitelock - that he'd necessarly being given the chance to show it with the Crusaders.

 

[ABs2011]

I disagree that just because Luatua is a better player than George Whitelock - that he'd necessarly being given the change to show it with the Crusaders.

I like Jordan Tuafua but he himself has not cemented a starting Super Rugby spot - far from it (has he even started a single game?)
My point is that it is highly likely Luatua would have gotten starts with the Crusaders this past season had he been there. To do that, for the most part he would have needed to be sleected ahead of G Whitelock who commanded that position for most of the year - hence why I made that comparison. Quite simply last year Tuafua got limited Super Rugby game time so there was not that much point bringing him into the equaiton.

 

[TRF Mr Fish]

I like Jordan Tuafua but he himself has not cemented a starting Super Rugby spot - far from it (has he even started a single game?)
My point is that it is highly likely Luatua would have gotten starts with the Crusaders this past season had he been there. To do that, for the most part he would have needed to be sleected ahead of G Whitelock who commanded that position for most of the year - hence why I made that comparison. Quite simply last year Tuafua got limited Super Rugby game time so there was not that much point bringing him into the equaiton.

The fact that Taufua didn't get many starts is kind of the point Nick was making. He's a better prospect than Whitelock but wasn't given much game time, so Whitelock was preferred because of his experience. For that reason he probably would've been preferred over Luatua too.

 

[ABs2011]

The fact that Taufua didn't get many starts is kind of the point Nick was making. He's a better prospect than Whitelock but wasn't given much game time, so Whitelock was preferred because of his experience. For that reason he probably would've been preferred over Luatua too.

Ah OK I see - sorry, for some reason I missed that point. I disagree, I think Luatua is a better player than Whitelock AND he would have been given game time. Even if that is debatable surely you agree Luatua would have started for the Hurricanes and Highlanders?

 

[nickdnz]

Ah OK I see - sorry, for some reason I missed that point. I disagree, I think Luatua is a better player than Whitelock AND he would have been given game time. Even if that is debatable surely you agree Luatua would have started for the Hurricanes and Highlanders?

For the Highlanders? Certainly because they had terrible looseforwards.

For the Hurricanes? Quite possibly - but that said Shields didn't start all that many games and he's considerably more promising than Levave. But yeah, if he played like he did for the Blues then he would probably have started with the Canes. The point that Invictus got, was that I don't believe talent necessarly equates to starting positions. There is a heap of other factors coaches weigh up which rightly or wrongly mean the best players sometimes miss out. Luatua was lucky that he played for the Blues as there was no incumbant blindside and therefore talent was all that mattered.

 

[ABs2011]

For the Highlanders? Certainly because they had terrible looseforwards.

For the Hurricanes? Quite possibly - but that said Shields didn't start all that many games and he's considerably more promising than Levave. But yeah, if he played like he did for the Blues then he would probably have started with the Canes. The point that Invictus got, was that I don't believe talent necessarly equates to starting positions. There is a heap of other factors coaches weigh up which rightly or wrongly mean the best players sometimes miss out. Luatua was lucky that he played for the Blues as there was no incumbant blindside and therefore talent was all that mattered.

Yup that is fair I think. At the end of the day though whether he was lucky or not is besides the point now because he got his starts, he took the chances and has gone from strength to strength, fromAuckland Schoolboy level, club rugby, Auckland ITM cup, Blues and now the ultimate level with the ABs. Others like Whitelock, Shields et al have had their opportunities as well but have not taken them like Luatua has. Therefore Luatua, with all the talent in the world now also has the on field performances to boot. It puts him in a different class of players from those fullahs now in my books!

 

[jessta]

Ok pretty clear after tonights game, luatuas our man

 

[Jaguares]

Amazing game of Luatua was the best forward and along with Aaron Smith, the best on the field

 

[Kapa O Pango]

Another outstanding performance from Luatua last night. Making a very good break and almost finished with a try. Very good at the breakdown and also winning ball in the rucks. Solid tackling and some good carries. Messam got some good competition by Luatua.

 

[ABs2011]

He will only get better as well.
At the end of the day, whilst others may argue there are better prospects around, Luatua has had two chances in the ABs jersey and blown everyone away. The kid can't do much more than that. Others are not even going to get a look in at this rate. I personally think we are seeing the beginnings of a player that will be one of the most dominant all round forwards in the game. To be fair he is not that far off already and he is only 22!

 

[sifplay]

We know about Luatua's size and skills now he just has to find a bit of mongrel and put a shoulder on a few people in defence.

 

[Sam Owen]

Well so far Luatua has played better than Vito (whos had more All Black games). All Black for the future? Most def.

 

[IRISH RUGBY MAN]

Luatua has played a good couple games and is most defo the future no. 6 but I'm still not sure if I'd pick him against the Boks. Messam just offers that bit more physicality at the minute. I'd probably pick him against Argentina though

 

[ABs2011]

Messam out for match v Argentina so looks like Luatua will get another chance to prove himself to the doubters

 

[ABs2011]

After one AB start, understandably there were a few doubters, 2 games in and the doubters have gone suspicioulsy quiet, now Luatua will get his 3rd start in a row so I'm wondering at what point credit will be given where credit is deserved?

 

[jessta]

After one AB start, understandably there were a few doubters, 2 games in and the doubters have gone suspicioulsy quiet, now Luatua will get his 3rd start in a row so I'm wondering at what point credit will be given where credit is deserved?

hahaha spot on bro