A Political Thread

[McTallshort]

He added: "We have no issue with people expressing criticisms of Israel … but to deny the right of a Jewish state to exist within the Middle East crosses a line into anti-Zionism."

I didnt realise anti-Zionism was a crime.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

He added: "We have no issue with people expressing criticisms of Israel … but to deny the right of a Jewish state to exist within the Middle East crosses a line into anti-Zionism."

I didnt realise anti-Zionism was a crime.

It clearly isn't, but there is often a conflation or being Jewish and the state of Israel. There are a lot of Jews who equate being Jewish and Israel as the same thing. Hence why criticism of Israel (not illegal), anti Semiticism (which is illegal) and Anti Zionism can often overlap. I suppose the very existence of Israel is inextricably linked to the Holocaust, which is very sensitive subject for all Jews. So to question the right for Israel to exist is to then touch on the Holocaust. Even though there are Ultra Orthodox Jews themselves who are anti Zionist.

 

[Car]

How does German chancellor Angela Merkel stay in power for so long? Is there nothing in the German constitution that limits the terms a leader can serve?

For the president (who's the head of state and can be re-elected once only) yes, for the chancellor (the head of government) no. Just think of her political mentor Kohl who stayed in power for 16 years.

 

[ncurd]

Corbyn's problem is the makeup of the Labour party he personally may not be an anti-semite but he has a party that includes many. His power base is purely in how much the membership support him if that were to collapse he'd be straight to the back benches.

He's a cult like figure among Labour grass roots and any critism for him is met with absolute demonisation. Even though his responses about the Russian nerve agent were quite honestly naive and stupid loads are defending him on it. Same goes for this he condemns the act or when his supporters people hurl abuse at anyone.

Problem is if he were to purge the Labour membership of all its muck he'd end up severely weakening his power base.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

The rest of the world seems to now be joining in condemning Russia and expelling diplomats. If this continues with even harsher measures, it could have been a huge miscalculation by Putin. He obviously expected it to be similar to the Livinenko incident where there was very little response and obviously believed the UK was isolated. I guess the rest of the world is getting fed up with Russian bare faced lying.

 

[Not Mike Brown's Sock]

The rest of the world seems to now be joining in condemning Russia and expelling diplomats. If this continues with even harsher measures, it could have been a huge miscalculation by Putin. He obviously expected it to be similar to the Livinenko incident where there was very little response and obviously believed the UK was isolated. I guess the rest of the world is getting fed up with Russian bare faced lying.

He will be most concerned with the reaction of Eastern Europe I think

 

[McTallshort]

The rest of the world seems to now be joining in condemning Russia and expelling diplomats. If this continues with even harsher measures, it could have been a huge miscalculation by Putin. He obviously expected it to be similar to the Livinenko incident where there was very little response and obviously believed the UK was isolated. I guess the rest of the world is getting fed up with Russian bare faced lying.

of the lying, the cyber attacks (NHS), the bullshit it pumps out on social media, its drugs cheating, its interference with sovereign states democratic processes and its general belief that it can do anything because it thinks everyone is as stupid and gullible as its own population (Vladimer anyone?)

 

[Not Mike Brown's Sock]

I don't think that it's a belief that the rest of the world is unaware of what it does, it's a firm belief that we cant really do anything about it, which we can't.

We aren't going to go to war because of MAD. The UN is a redundant organisation when it comes to conflict between permenant members and they have the power when it comes to oil.

At the end of the day, we can conduct proxy wars with them in the middle East and expel their diplomats, but they don't care about that. It just becomes a big man contest where nobody is every gonna come out on top, it just cant end in todays military climate.

They can do what they want in the knowledge we ain't gonna do anything significant about it.

 

[McTallshort]

I don't think that it's a belief that the rest of the world is unaware of what it does, it's a firm belief that we cant really do anything about it, which we can't.

We aren't going to go to war because of MAD. The UN is a redundant organisation when it comes to conflict between permenant members and they have the power when it comes to oil.

At the end of the day, we can conduct proxy wars with them in the middle East and expel their diplomats, but they don't care about that. It just becomes a big man contest where nobody is every gonna come out on top, it just cant end in todays military climate.

They can do what they want in the knowledge we ain't gonna do anything significant about it.

You would be surprised at what can be done. Do you think only the Russians and North Koreans can carry out cyber attacks on Government infrastructure? And your not just expelling diplomats you are expelling spies so their intelligence runs out very quickly.

As for Proxy wars...the war in Syria has crippled the already dysfunctional Russian economy. The on going war in the Ukraine is also having an effect. Don't forget Russia's GDP is 60% of the UK's its OK Putin posturing like the Soviet Union but what he must remember is what happened to the Soviet Union.

If no other nation had reacted to the nerve agent attack then I would agree with you but everyone even in the EU is coming out in support because everyone if fed up with old drunk at the bar still trying to be a hard man.

 

[Not Mike Brown's Sock]

You would be surprised at what can be done. Do you think only the Russians and North Koreans can carry out cyber attacks on Government infrastructure? And your not just expelling diplomats you are expelling spies so their intelligence runs out very quickly.

As for Proxy wars...the war in Syria has crippled the already dysfunctional Russian economy. The on going war in the Ukraine is also having an effect. Don't forget Russia's GDP is 60% of the UK's its OK Putin posturing like the Soviet Union but what he must remember is what happened to the Soviet Union.

If no other nation had reacted to the nerve agent attack then I would agree with you but everyone even in the EU is coming out in support because everyone if fed up with old drunk at the bar still trying to be a hard man.

When was the last cyber attack conducted by the west though? They are only ever significant if they interfere with the democratic process and we are unlikely to do that.
In terms of intelligence, expelling a few diplomats is gonna have very little impact and it's naieve to think otherwise.
GDP is irrelevant in this situation, Russia has a massive military because that is where it invests it's money, unlike most of the west.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

When was the last cyber attack conducted by the west though? They are only ever significant if they interfere with the democratic process and we are unlikely to do that.
In terms of intelligence, expelling a few diplomats is gonna have very little impact and it's naieve to think otherwise.
GDP is irrelevant in this situation, Russia has a massive military because that is where it invests it's money, unlike most of the west.

Russia still relies heavily on trade with the rest of the world, particularly oil. Sure it would hurt us to put sanctions on Russia but it would hurt them a hell of a lot more. We can buy oil from elsewhere, they will struggle to sell it elsewhere. Putin was doing the old bully tactic of picking a fight where he thought there would be no retaliation. Like all bullies, if they are faced with someone who is prepared to front up, they often back down. It's taken the world too long to realise but the more we let Russia act without consequence, the more they will do it. Putin and Russians want to be the hard men of Europe again and have got it into their heads that they are because nobody has done anything about it.

Nope the expelling of diplomats must be followed up with action to let Putin know everyone has had enough of his pseudo-KGB bullshit. Let him act the tough man at home and the longer he acts that way, the greater the pressure we should apply.

 

[Not Mike Brown's Sock]

Russia still relies heavily on trade with the rest of the world, particularly oil. Sure it would hurt us to put sanctions on Russia but it would hurt them a hell of a lot more. We can buy oil from elsewhere, they will struggle to sell it elsewhere. Putin was doing the old bully tactic of picking a fight where he thought there would be no retaliation. Like all bullies, if they are faced with someone who is prepared to front up, they often back down. It's taken the world too long to realise but the more we let Russia act without consequence, the more they will do it. Putin and Russians want to be the hard men of Europe again and have got it into their heads that they are because nobody has done anything about it.

Nope the expelling of diplomats must be followed up with action to let Putin know everyone has had enough of his pseudo-KGB bullshit. Let him act the tough man at home and the longer he acts that way, the greater the pressure we should apply.

Trade wars with oil are dangerous and we are unlikely to risk it. We can get oil from elsewhere, but when the oil weapon is used effectively, it leaves the buyer far more vulnerable (quadrupling in price in 1973 when production was reduced by 25% in the Arab world). I don't really know what else there is you can do?

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Trade wars with oil are dangerous and we are unlikely to risk it. We can get oil from elsewhere, but when the oil weapon is used effectively, it leaves the buyer far more vulnerable (quadrupling in price in 1973 when production was reduced by 25% in the Arab world). I don't really know what else there is you can do?

It's all about relative power of buyer vs seller. Russia makes up a sizeable chunk of total EU oil and gas imports, however the EU makes up a much much larger chunk of Russia's total exports. To use some numbers I pulled out my arse, it is like Russia being responsible for 20% of EU oil and gas but the EU making up 70% of total Russian exports of oil and gas. Whilst sanctions would hurt is, they would hurt Russia far more. Russia has more to lose economically from sanctions on their exports than the west does. Obviously the more countries get on board, the greater the impact on the Russian economy.

 

[McTallshort]

When was the last cyber attack conducted by the west though? They are only ever significant if they interfere with the democratic process and we are unlikely to do that.
In terms of intelligence, expelling a few diplomats is gonna have very little impact and it's naieve to think otherwise.
GDP is irrelevant in this situation, Russia has a massive military because that is where it invests it's money, unlike most of the west.

Yeah thats why its using 50 year old planes in Syria and its only functioning Aircraft carrier is barely able to float.

And those diplomats are Spies. They sit behind diplomatic immunity but they in fact work for the intelligence service of the country they represent.....Thats why they are the first people to be given the boot when things get difficult.

And we don't know when the West conducted its last cyber attack and its doubtful anyone in Russia/North Korea/Iran would admit to it happening.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Yeah thats why its using 50 year old planes in Syria and its only functioning Aircraft carrier is barely able to float.

And those diplomats are Spies. They sit behind diplomatic immunity but they in fact work for the intelligence service of the country they represent.....Thats why they are the first people to be given the boot when things get difficult.

And we don't know when the West conducted its last cyber attack and its doubtful anyone in Russia/North Korea/Iran would admit to it happening.

Stuxnet was kinda a western virus attack on the Iranian nuclear program, although I remember seeing something about it and they say that, despite Stuxnet being produced by the Americans, it was actually the Israelis who used it without informing them (as usual).

 

[Bada-Bing!]

One thing that strikes me as bizarre is Putin and the Kremlin have shown no concern for Yulia, who is herself a Russian citizen, who was visiting her father at the time. A Russian citizen who is poisoned on foreign soil and yet Putin's spokes person on RT news doesn't even mention her? Yes, her father is of "zero" value to Russia, but what about one of your own Citizens?

Tell tale sign that Russia are guilty. If they weren't wouldn't they want to co-operate to at least get to the bottom of her being poisoned or why she is lying in a critical condition in a Salisbury hospital.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

This is an interview with one of the "alleged" Litvinenko killers, who was made an MP in 2007 and also awarded an honour by Putin for services to Russia. He seems to know a surprising amount about Polonium 210. Not surprisingly the interviewer declines his offer of a cup of tea.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Over in Americaland, Laura Ingraham has been losing advertisers left right and centre for her decision to mock one of the school shooting survivors for not getting into the college he wanted, and then following up with a pathetic attempt to fix it by saying "in the spirit of the holy week", you know as opposed to in the spirit of not being a complete twat?

Looks like those stupid, whinging, ignorant youth have found the Achilles heels of the right wing, forget about looking for their sense of compassion or decency, just go for their power and money. Long may the young people in America continue this campaign against Fox and the detestable individuals who act like them.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

Question- has Corbyn shown he is unfit to be PM? His response to the Salisbury poisionining and the the anti-Semiticism he is being accused of and his own making.

 

[McTallshort]

Question- has Corbyn shown he is unfit to be PM? His response to the Salisbury poisionining and the the anti-Semiticism he is being accused of and his own making.

What is the deal with anti semiticism and the Labour Party? Is it down to Israel or The Daily Mail?