[2023 Six Nations] England Squad

[Vieux Talonneur]

The Irish will definitely be better rested than us. Not so the French. For a few random players seasonal appearances in all comps, including Saturday:

Dombrandt 16, Alldrit 21

JVP 20, DuPont 21

Steward 19, Ramos 18

Genge 16, Baille 14

George 16, Marchand 21

 

[LIONSxv]

Maybe that's over simplifying things but what I wanted to say is that he doesn't seem big enough to play international rugby at lock. He's not offering what the rucking, tackling hard hitting aspects of a lock that the game needs.

Maybe he works in a pack with a massive other 5 but meh.

Not big enough you mean in terms of height or weight ? He is 6 6 and 18 stone which is about average from what I can see. The best lock in world ATM tadhg beirne has a very similar physique

It was only 2-3 years ago that Itoje was widely regarded (outside of this forum) as one of the best locks in the world

 

[g6mcg]

If/when England can drop Itoje you'll have a bloody strong team.

Front row looks more of an issue, some decent players but mostly towards the end of careers.

Lots of back row options - yes there's some "Premiership tax"/overhype (something I've never been guilty of...) but you'd back good international players to emerge from that, providing they get a decent run in the team rather than constantly being jettisoned for someone performing slightly better domestically.

 

[Jakedood]

I have just seen that for all the flack that Itoje's getting, he's actually made the most tackles of any England player, the second most dominant tackles (after Ludlam) and the most breakdown steals.

He isn't playing as well as he used to but he is still putting in some shift.

I actually thought he's been markedly improved the last two weeks, being a bit of a melter, more involved, turnovers etc, so I'm not quite sure if it's just a repetitive narrative or what but I like how he's played. Certainly he vastly outplayed Chessum against France

 

[Geordie]

I thought that was Arundell?

All hail London Irish...saviour of the England rugby team.

 

[Geordie]

Interesting 5 mins....pretty much what we're saying.

 

[LIONSxv]

Interesting 5 mins....pretty much what we're saying.

Very interesting take, parts I completely agree with re Tighthead prop. Hooker is also a problem

I don't agree that it's bleak at Lock and the back row. He could bring in Martin and Ted Hill who are big physical ball carriers.
Then we have multiple options coming through at 8. Mercer been the obvious.

They over simplify the size issue for me. England do not lack size. They do however lack aggression and it seems fitness

 

[Wasps92]

That's why I said on here a few times, not always to universal acclaim, that I felt Underhill was our most important player. Simply because he made dominant hits that could change momentum.

I was awe in of him 2018-2019. Such a shame how it's panned out for him since then. Still only 26 but it looks like his best years are behind him sadly.

 

[BrokenWing]

I thought Stephen Jones was quite kind to England listening to him today.

I listened up until he was asked who he'd bring in for Ireland… ooh, what exciting bolter is he going to throw in…

Tuilagi and Vunipola.

Visionary.

 

[Jimbo]

I thought Stephen Jones was quite kind to England listening to him today.

I listened up until he was asked who he'd bring in for Ireland… ooh, what exciting bolter is he going to throw in…

Tuilagi and Vunipola.

Visionary.

Not sure it's what I would do, in fairness to him England whilst frequently outplayed never really got pumped in the manner whilst they played not like we did on Saturday, it's too late to change things too much pre World Cup so maybe damage limitation is the way to go, I'm devoid of any answers right now, Dombrandt at 8 hasn't worked and I'm not sure I can see that changing any time soon would you realistically play someone uncapped this close.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

I have just seen that for all the flack that Itoje's getting, he's actually made the most tackles of any England player, the second most dominant tackles (after Ludlam) and the most breakdown steals.

He isn't playing as well as he used to but he is still putting in some shift.

From the 6N website v France: 1 pass, 1 line out won, no line out steals. 23m carried (5th best in the pack) from 7 carries (joint most in the pack). No pens conceded, 2 turnovers won, 1 lost. 10 tackles made - 3rd most in team, but 2 missed.

Some of that's OK, but not exactly head turning in our biggest game so far. But you can argue anything you like with stats, especially limited stats……

The much maligned Dombrandt made the most metres of any forward by a distance, only the half backs made more passes and he made a team high 13 tackles with the highest tackle success rate in the pack. Yet virtually everyone here is saying that he's not up to it.

Stats tell one story. The judgement and feel of a player's impact to the naked eye, not to mention body language, is more subjective but just as important. One of the big things is that his early career presence, aura, call it what you will has wilted.

 

[Saintjay]

14 tries conceded this six nations. Most ever for England during 6N's era. Ireland still to come. Deep joy.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

'Everybody hates England', says Ireland wing Mack Hansen

Hansen and Ireland can win a first Grand Slam since 2018 if they dispatch England in Dublin

www.telegraph.co.uk

I know it happens every year but imagine the shitstorm if any England player said that about any other nation

 

[Becca]

'Everybody hates England', says Ireland wing Mack Hansen

Hansen and Ireland can win a first Grand Slam since 2018 if they dispatch England in Dublin

www.telegraph.co.uk

I know it happens every year but imagine the shitstorm if any England player said that about any other nation

This sort of thing makes me very angry.

 

[AlRums]

Not big enough you mean in terms of height or weight ? He is 6 6 and 18 stone which is about average from what I can see. The best lock in world ATM tadhg beirne has a very similar physique

It was only 2-3 years ago that Itoje was widely regarded (outside of this forum) as one of the best locks in the world

Only by English fans

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

'Everybody hates England', says Ireland wing Mack Hansen

Hansen and Ireland can win a first Grand Slam since 2018 if they dispatch England in Dublin

www.telegraph.co.uk

I know it happens every year but imagine the shitstorm if any England player said that about any other nation

If it was "everyone wants to beat England" then that's one thing but they do have a habit of turning up the rhetoric for England in a way that would not be acceptable for any other nation. Goes back to what I mentioned earlier, everyone can get fired up against England because they "hate" us, we don't have anyone we get fired up for.

 

[Saintjay]

Mack Hansen was misquoted. He actually said "Everyone hates the pommies" "Sorry i mean English".

 

[big ginger 8]

Mack Hansen was misquoted. He actually said "Everyone hates the pommies" "Sorry i mean English".

I don't have access to the Telegraph but from what appears to be the same interview we have these quotes:

The worst thing that could have happened for us was England getting pumped at home," Hansen said.

"You just know they're going to turn around. They're a great side. It didn't go their way against France, they still have unreal players. We know they're going to bounce back, we know they're going to bring a lot of energy. It'll be a completely different team to last weekend. But we want to play against the best and if they're at their best then it's going to be great, a good match."

I'm so pumped for it. It's going to be a great week, one to take in and savour. I'm so excited for it, especially at home on Paddy's Day. It's going to be unbelievable.

"I don't know if I should say too much… There's a fair bit of hatred, isn't there? It's good, though, because once the game is done they are good lads like everyone else. That **** happened… how long ago now? But it does add a bit of fire to the game. I was unlucky that I didn't get to play last year, so fingers crossed I get to play next Saturday."


Seems a bit more tongue in cheek than the headline and pretty complimentary overall.

 

[Wasps92]

'Everybody hates England', says Ireland wing Mack Hansen

Hansen and Ireland can win a first Grand Slam since 2018 if they dispatch England in Dublin

www.telegraph.co.uk

I know it happens every year but imagine the shitstorm if any England player said that about any other nation

**** off back to Australia you convict ****.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

Manu Tuilagi in frame to return for England’s ‘free swing’ in Ireland

Steve Borthwick will be forced into another midfield reshuffle for England’s final match of the Six Nations against Ireland on Saturday with Ollie Lawrence ruled out with a hamstring injury

www.theguardian.com

The Times reporting Manu returning as well.