[2021 Six Nations] England vs France (13/03/21)

[Dai Yorkshire]

As was I brother...

I don't think that was the same England that we played, to beat France we will have to up our game considerably. I've never really understood the bashing England has had especially from their own fans, as some of the individuals they have are some of the best in the World, I played in the BR and I have never understood the adulation given to Billy as a number 8 he does the same thing every game (head down and Charge) I was always told someone who does not differ his game is easily stopped, but he did have a better game yesterday than he has for some time, perhaps because he was underrated but, what he does he does well if you let him.

 

[Welsh Exile]

Don't get ya?

Past tense. You was drunk. I say that pussy talk. I'm on day 2 of a 8 day bender.

 

[bushytop]

Past tense. You was drunk. I say that pussy talk. I'm on day 2 of a 8 day bender.

 

[Welsh Exile]

View attachment 9875

It was ok pre Covid as you could just disappear for a week and the Mrs would know the score. Now you've got to lock the kids and the Mrs up in the attic for the whole week. Such an inconvenience

 

[bushytop]

I don't think that was the same England that we played, to beat France we will have to up our game considerably. I've never really understood the bashing England has had especially from their own fans, as some of the individuals they have are some of the best in the World, I played in the BR and I have never understood the adulation given to Billy as a number 8 he does the same thing every game (head down and Charge) I was always told someone who does not differ his game is easily stopped, but he did have a better game yesterday than he has for some time, perhaps because he was underrated but, what he does he does well if you let him.

I ain't shocked by England beating France... in fact it was only us Welsh boys who thought England had it in them iirc.

 

[Welsh Exile]

I ain't shocked by England beating France... in fact it was only us Welsh boys who thought England had it in them iirc.

it's strange. I expected a riot in here today given how many people were hoping they would lose. Strange isn't it. It's almost like people were just saying that but didn't really mean it.

 

[Reiser99]

it's strange. I expected a riot in here today given how many people were hoping they would lose. Strange isn't it. It's almost like people were just saying that but didn't really mean it.

I believe it's more apathy. Yes the win is great, but it doesn't feel like the core issues have been fixed.

 

[Welsh Exile]

I believe it's more apathy. Yes the win is great, but it doesn't feel like the core issues have been fixed.

In my experience it usually takes the English a month or 2 to get over a Wales defeat so I hear ya mate.

Joking aside, there never was a crisis. You were never as good as people were making out in the WC and you were no where near as bad as people were/are making out now.

 

[bushytop]

In my experience it usually takes the English a month or 2 to get over a Wales defeat so I hear ya mate.

Joking aside, there never was a crisis. You were never as good as people were making out in the WC and you were no where near as bad as people were/are making out now.

If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same;
... you'll be a Man, my son!

 

[ncurd]

In my experience it usually takes the English a month or 2 to get over a Wales defeat so I hear ya mate.

Joking aside, there never was a crisis. You were never as good as people were making out in the WC and you were no where near as bad as people were/are making out now.

Your wrong on both accounts, you don't have as good a game as you that in a SF at a RWC against NZ without being a pretty good team.

Equally it's absolutely a crisis if after that with pretty much the same players you play like absolute dog **** for the best part of a year. Also one swallow doesn't make a summer we were good yesterday but I've witnessed way to.many England false dawn's to get excited that were back to our best. Especially as many players sith questions are still not playing well.

 

[Welsh Exile]

Your wrong on both accounts, you don't have as good a game as you that in a SF at a RWC against NZ without being a pretty good team.

Equally it's absolutely a crisis if after that with pretty much the same players you play like absolute dog **** for the best part of a year. Also one swallow doesn't make a summer we were good yesterday but I've witnessed way to.many England false dawn's to get excited that were back to our best. Especially as many players sith questions are still not playing well.

Yeah, you're a pretty good team, a very good one in fact. But not the best team. You won't like to hear this but that was one of the worst performances from a New Zealand side ever. You were still very good, though, coz, you know, you're a very good team but all that ******** about being the best and Itoje being the best as the English media were banging on about was largely BS. Just as the ******** about you being crap now is rubbish.

 

[bushytop]

Your wrong on both accounts, you don't have as good a game as you that in a SF at a RWC against NZ without being a pretty good team.

Equally it's absolutely a crisis if after that with pretty much the same players you play like absolute dog **** for the best part of a year. Also one swallow doesn't make a summer we were good yesterday but I've witnessed way to.many England false dawn's to get excited that were back to our best. Especially as many players sith questions are still not playing well.

He never said you weren't tbf.

 

[Jimbo]

Your wrong on both accounts, you don't have as good a game as you that in a SF at a RWC against NZ without being a pretty good team.

Equally it's absolutely a crisis if after that with pretty much the same players you play like absolute dog **** for the best part of a year. Also one swallow doesn't make a summer we were good yesterday but I've witnessed way to.many England false dawn's to get excited that were back to our best. Especially as many players sith questions are still not playing well.

Nail on the head here, I can't remember a game post NZ semi final where I have actually though England played well for the majority of the game.

 

[ncurd]

You won't like to hear this but that was one of the worst performances from a New Zealand side ever.

Whilst it's not a vintage side that's simply not true hell, they were easialy worse when we beat them 38-21 at that was the McCaw team.

 

[Reiser99]

Your wrong on both accounts, you don't have as good a game as you that in a SF at a RWC against NZ without being a pretty good team.

Equally it's absolutely a crisis if after that with pretty much the same players you play like absolute dog **** for the best part of a year. Also one swallow doesn't make a summer we were good yesterday but I've witnessed way to.many England false dawn's to get excited that were back to our best. Especially as many players sith questions are still not playing well.

TBh I do agree with him about the SF. I think many people (including myself) were overly confident after that win and made England out to be better than they were based on that performance. Then reality hit and as people have said, the SF was the exception, not the rule.

 

[Welsh Exile]

Whilst it's not a vintage side that's simply not true hell, they were easialy worse when we beat them 38-21 at that was the McCaw team.

My point is NZ had a bad day at the office. You can dispute that if you want and I don't mean to take anything away from England as they played very well but NZ weren't at the races.

 

[ncurd]

TBh I do agree with him about the SF. I think many people (including myself) were overly confident after that win and made England out to be better than they were based on that performance. Then reality hit and as people have said, the SF was the exception, not the rule.

I disagree reality is that performance for that team was it's ceiling and if we played that well the following week we'd might have gone home victors but instead we couldn't scrum and our ball handling skills were utter ******** so we kept having scrums. Lets remember that year we gave a good Ireland side two absolute pastings and France as well. 2019 era England when at their best were one of the best sides in the world. However they were awfully inconsistent and would follow up great wins with average at best performances like Wales and Scotland in the 6 nations.

 

[Not Eddie Jones]

Yeah, you're a pretty good team, a very good one in fact. But not the best team. You won't like to hear this but that was one of the worst performances from a New Zealand side ever. You were still very good, though, coz, you know, you're a very good team but all that ******** about being the best and Itoje being the best as the English media were banging on about was largely BS. Just as the ******** about you being crap now is rubbish.

England wins don't count shock.

We came second in a competition to determine who was the best team in the world. And to get to the final we beat the team ranked number 1 in the world. Pretty sure we were good.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

I'd definitely be closer in agreement with @ncurd . I think England in 2019 were an exceptional side with a lot of guys at their absolute athletic peak, but they weren't the cleverest at all by any means. Outsmarted by Wales and then beaten physically as well as tactically by South Africa. Since then, and until yesterday, teams just knew they had to deal with England physically and they'd probably beat themselves through bad discipline.

It's the opposite side of the same coin as us in 2018, an exceptionally clever side who needed parity up front to win games, but if you beat us physically like Wales, England and NZ did in 2019 (Japan was different because once Sexton was out the brain left the team and injuries did play a part overall) we were a shadow of that team.

I think both teams need a bit of a remodelling, and to be fair to both coaches they appear to be trying with a shift in tactics, but both are doing it with guys who were pivotal when the teams were good who aren't what are needed. Healy, Mako, Daly, Earls and Murray are all guys who aren't capable of starting and performing in the manner that international rugby is currently being played but would probably be stellar bench options, both teams have issues in the halfbacks that the coaches are very slow to address and, fortunately for England their problems seem to stop there for me, we have more.

A bit of a tangent there but ultimately England do need to change their focus, gameplan and personnel up, but not as much as many seem to think and they were very, very good in 2019 but not a smart enough side to win a world cup. Yesterday was pretty big for them in my opinion, they weren't incredible and France should be sick with themselves really, but it was a very mature performance to stick in there and take the chance to win. If we pulled something like that off next week I'd be quite optimistic.

Edit: Worth noting that the SF was overrated though, still very very good but not the best performance ever like was touted. That NZ team weren't incredible at all, a few teams had thoroughly controlled them throughout the world cup cycle. Comfortably the third best side at a rather weak tournament.

 

[Welsh Exile]

England wins don't count shock.

We came second in a competition to determine who was the best team in the world. And to get to the final we beat the team ranked number 1 in the world. Pretty sure we were good.

Jesus, where did I say you weren't good or that your wins don't count? Nice strawman.