[2015 Six Nations] Wales

[MojoPin]

How did last summer's game work well? It was a farce of a match.

I thought it served a purpose precisely because of the reason I mentioned - it brought some players to light that otherwise might not have got a chance in that tour. Gareth Davies, Josh Turnbull and Samson Lee have all made an impact since and there are probably some others I could have mentioned. It was one sided sure but it was a cheap evening of rugby packed full of established and emerging talent. I liked seeing the up-and-comers pitted against the established names and would happily watch it again. Just my opinion but for the coaches it certainly seemed a worthwhile exercise.

 

[j'nuh]

I hope Gatland does as much as he can to pick players based in Wales now. Leaving out James Hook and bringing in Owen Williams would be a bad move IMO. Drop both, make the message clear that you need to be in Wales to play for Wales. He's got the right level of competition at fly-half within the regions to make this work. Just like England and Armitage, you might lose out on a slightly better player than the incumbents (although even that's not true because Biggar is the better fly-half), but the message you lay down is worth it. Owen Williams apparently turned down a dual contract, let him feel it and not only might he reconsider next time, it sends a message out to others.

 

[Draggs]

I thought it served a purpose precisely because of the reason I mentioned - it brought some players to light that otherwise might not have got a chance in that tour. Gareth Davies, Josh Turnbull and Samson Lee have all made an impact since and there are probably some others I could have mentioned. It was one sided sure but it was a cheap evening of rugby packed full of established and emerging talent. I liked seeing the up-and-comers pitted against the established names and would happily watch it again. Just my opinion but for the coaches it certainly seemed a worthwhile exercise.

Players who had already been capped or stood out at regional level. That probables game was nothing more than a paycheck for WRU. Nothing gained from it.
@j'nuh, players already out of Wales are eligible. Even if Hook were to sign another contract, he is exempt as it is an existing deal. Now if he were to go to London Irish, then he is out.

 

[j'nuh]

Players who had already been capped or stood out at regional level. That probables game was nothing more than a paycheck for WRU. Nothing gained from it.
@j'nuh, players already out of Wales are eligible. Even if Hook were to sign another contract, he is exempt as it is an existing deal. Now if he were to go to London Irish, then he is out.

Yeah, I read about that. I'd use the "already outside of Wales" exception to keep on picking players that are clearly important to the team (e.g. Richard Hibbard), but exclude the marginal cases (e.g. Owen Williams).

 

[Draggs]

Hibbard would be behind Owens if he was fit. We also have Phillips, Dee, Parry all coming along nicely.
I'd rather see Owen Williams on the bench then Hook/Priestland. Could go with Patchell as well.

Quite a few injuries up front especially for the Turks: Rhodri, Samson, Emyr, Ken. Nicky Smith of the Ospreys also out, so we could see Rob Evans involved. Poor Scarlets...
I think Adam Jones might return, only because of other injuries (he has looked off all season).

 

[Thingimubob]

Players who had already been capped or stood out at regional level. That probables game was nothing more than a paycheck for WRU. Nothing gained from it.
@j'nuh, players already out of Wales are eligible. Even if Hook were to sign another contract, he is exempt as it is an existing deal. Now if he were to go to London Irish, then he is out.

I dunno, didn't charge all that much ticket wise - Meant that they sold it out fairly easily.

Same for judgement day this year, tickets are a tenner!

I don't think it was a complete waste of time, gave a few players a chance that they wouldn't have normally got.

However, you real need every player available to make the most out of it.

I.e each position 1st vs 2nd choice

Halfpenny vs Liam Williams

Roberts and Davies v Scott Williams and Allen

Biggar vs Williams/Anscombe/Patchell/Priestland

Warbs vs Tips

Hibbard vs Owens

...so on so forth.

 

[TRF_Cymro]

Hibbard would be behind Owens if he was fit. We also have Phillips, Dee, Parry all coming along nicely.
I'd rather see Owen Williams on the bench then Hook/Priestland. Could go with Patchell as well.

Quite a few injuries up front especially for the Turks: Rhodri, Samson, Emyr, Ken. Nicky Smith of the Ospreys also out, so we could see Rob Evans involved. Poor Scarlets...
I think Adam Jones might return, only because of other injuries (he has looked off all season).

Has he? He's looked a different player under Hammett to be fair. He's lost the weight and his contributing in the tight and loose. Definitely should be be in the Wales squad. Disagree about Hibbard too. Hibbs is our number one. Owens will push him when fit but Hibbs is still our best hooker.

 

[Draggs]

General consensus is that Adam has been a joke. Says a lot when Newport scrum has an advantage. Samson is the number one by far.
Hibbard is a weak point in the scrum, same for Gloucester. His width appears to weaken the scrum.

 

[TRF_Cymro]

General consensus is that Adam has been a joke. Says a lot when Newport scrum has an advantage. Samson is the number one by far.
Hibbard is a weak point in the scrum, same for Gloucester. His width appears to weaken the scrum.

General consensus? From where? Seen him week in and week out and he is improving every game. Hammett and Gatland have asked him to do more and so he has done. If I recall correctly I didn't think the officiating of the scrum at that Dragons game was to clever either.

 

[j'nuh]

General consensus is that Adam has been a joke. Says a lot when Newport scrum has an advantage. Samson is the number one by far.
Hibbard is a weak point in the scrum, same for Gloucester. His width appears to weaken the scrum.

Hibbard's not really weak in the scrum. Most people are pointing to that Hibbard is practically a prop-sized hooker who likes to scrummage high, whereas Afoa scrummages ridiculously low, and they can't get the chemistry right; one of them has to compromise on their natural scrummaging position. Both are good scrummagers, they just need to be with the right unit.

 

[goodNumber10]

Ainscombe in the Squad:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/30887514

Forwards: Gethin Jenkins (Cardiff Blues), Paul James (Bath), Rob Evans (Scarlets), Aaron Jarvis (Ospreys), Samson Lee (Scarlets), Scott Andrews (Cardiff Blues), Richard Hibbard (Gloucester), Kristian Dacey (Cardiff Blues), Scott Baldwin (Ospreys), Alun Wyn Jones (Ospreys), Jake Ball (Scarlets), Bradley Davies (Wasps), Luke Charteris (Racing Metro), Dan Lydiate (Ospreys), James King (Ospreys), Sam Warburton (Cardiff Blues, Capt), Justin Tipuric (Ospreys), Taulupe Faletau (Newport Gwent Dragons).

Backs: Mike Phillips (Racing Metro), Rhys Webb (Ospreys), Gareth Davies (Scarlets), Dan Biggar (Ospreys), Rhys Priestland (Scarlets), Gareth Anscombe (Cardiff Blues), Cory Allen (Cardiff Blues), Jamie Roberts (Racing Metro), Jonathan Davies (Clermont Auvergne), Scott Williams (Scarlets), Tyler Morgan (Newport Gwent Dragons), Hallam Amos (Newport Gwent Dragons), Alex Cuthbert (Cardiff Blues), George North (Northampton Saints), Liam Williams (Scarlets), Leigh Halfpenny (Toulon).

 

[MojoPin]

Pretty good if largely predictable squad selection. A couple of surprises though...how Scott Andrews got into that side is beyond me, I know there are quite a few players injured but still...

Also not sure about Priestland's inclusion - I'm not one of his detractors, in fact I think he's exceptional when he plays with confidence. BUT, his impending move to Bath to me suggests that Wales is slipping in his priorities. I don't blame him in the slightest - a lot of Welsh fans have an appalling attitude towards him - but if his priority is club rugby now then I would have given Owen Williams a shot to see if he is a prospect for the World Cup or not. As it stands now I don't think he'll feature any time soon unless there are some pretty extensive injuries.

As far as Adam Jones and James Hook are concerned....sadly I don't think they're essential to Wales any more and it's right that others are given a chance, IMO. Although Jones would have been far preferable to Scott Andrews in my book.

Good to see Kristian Dacey included but Elliot Dee would have been a good choice too, and for me the biggest surprise is the omission of Josh Navidi. With no Dan Baker on the scene at the moment that leaves Faletau as the only specialist 8, which seems bonkers! Unless perhaps they'd give Warbs/Lydiate/Tipuric/King a temporary move in the event of an injury? Little bit bizarre, that one.

Glad to see Anscombe involved too - he hasn't had a lot of game time but he has refreshed the Blues in the wake of Patchell's injury.

Also glad to see Gareth Davies back - I still think he could push for our number 1 scrum half given enough time to shine. Rhys Webb is great too but he's had a little bit of a head start thanks to injuries and it'll be great to see them push each other. No idea how Phillips fits into that equation but I suspect he'll be the backup on the big games against England and Ireland since he has had so much experience.

And chipping in on the hooker debate - I'd also agree that Hibbard is our number one choice. Been a bit shaky since the Lions tour but he's great for starting a match with real intensity. Owens is superb as well but he works well as an impact sub too, ripping the ball away from the opposition and keeping the energy levels going once Hibbard starts to wane. They're a great combo and I wish we could have Owens back in the squad to push Hibbard that little bit harder.

Very excited for the England match now...can't wait! Going to be a good competition this year I reckon.

 

[Every Time Ref]

Question for Welsh posters (or indeed anyone who wants to answer) - would you pick Williams over Halfpenny at fullback? I doubt Gatland will, but personally I think on balance I would. Williams has looked excellent and offers something a bit different in that big, meaty Wales backline; Halfpenny is still a class act, and during the World CUp he'd be my choice as a big game player, but although very dependable and one of the best under a high ball in the world, his attacking flair is not what it used to be for whatever reason. On top of that, it was Biggar's placekicking performance this year that swung it for me.

 

[SelimNiai]

I would pick Halfpenny. Williams still has that knack of doing something incredibly daft, though he has been better in that regard recently, wheras Halfpenny is that much ore solid and gives us an extra kicking option.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

L.Williams on the wing?

Just out of interest IF Wales fail to get out of the group stages would Gatland still keep his job?

 

[Every Time Ref]

L.Williams on the wing?

Actually that might be the answer, Cuthbert was gash in the autumn and from what I've heard hasn't played well domestically either. Is Williams a finisher though? Gatland likes finishers on those wings, obviously

 

[MojoPin]

Actually that might be the answer, Cuthbert was gash in the autumn and from what I've heard hasn't played well domestically either. Is Williams a finisher though? Gatland likes finishers on those wings, obviously

Yeah, I'd put Williams on the wing as well. Both Cuthbert and North have been misfiring lately - Cuthbert more so though as he hasn't produced much on a regional level. And North created Cuthbert's try in the Autumn so that's been evened out. The one arguement for Cuthbert is that his defensive play is generally better than North's - he's quite good at picking the right line when he's running back to help slow down an opposition's attack.

I'd give North/Cuthbert a run out and see who performs - whoever loses is then replaced by Williams and the position becomes his to lose. He's does have the odd moment of insanity but in general his defensive play is solid, albeit not on Halfpenny's level. Leigh is someone who will make that try-saving tackle - he's rarely in the bin and is as level-headed as they get. Not to mention the fact that he's up there with the very best goalkickers in the world. His attacking play has been diminished since the Lions tour but you can't discount just how bloody good he was out in Australia. Last time him and Williams played side by side they worked well together I think, with Halfpenny using his superb positioning skills before handing off to Willliams for a counter attack.

 

[Every Time Ref]

The one arguement for Cuthbert is that his defensive play is generally better than North's - he's quite good at picking the right line when he's running back to help slow down an opposition's attack.

Really? I obviously don't watch as much of him as you so maybe I'm wrong, but my impression from the internationals I've seen is that Cuthbert can be something of a liability in defence, no? North isn't ever likely to get massive plaudits for defence but I had him down as a pretty solid, no frills / no mistakes kind of defender.

 

[MojoPin]

Really? I obviously don't watch as much of him as you so maybe I'm wrong, but my impression from the internationals I've seen is that Cuthbert can be something of a liability in defence, no? North isn't ever likely to get massive plaudits for defence but I had him down as a pretty solid, no frills / no mistakes kind of defender.

Don't get me wrong he's still not great - up until the last test on the SA tour I would have totally agreed with you. But North's howler was as bad if not worse than Liam Williams' in hindsight and he hasn't shown much sign of improving since then - not for Wales at least. On the Lions tour North was way more solid and even through last year's Autumn Internationals. Most days I would choose North over Cuthbert, but felt it was fair to acknowledge that he is capable of a fairly decent defence, even if he hasn't shown it lately.

 

[Every Time Ref]

Fair enough, I've been over in the England thread defending my Bath boy Jonathan Joseph from accusations of defensive weakness recently, I know how you feel!

As an Englishman though, if the teamsheets come out on February 6th and I see Gatland has dropped North and retained Cuthbert, I will be grinning from ear to ear ...