[2014 Mid-Year Tests] New Zealand vs England (1st Test)

[Ragey Erasmus]

34-19 to the ABs. Just can't see England winning the first game. Right now I'm just hoping the players show they are international standard and have potential.

 

[Tony Manx]

I hope that the predictions here, by the English posters as yet, are correct but even with ring rustiness, I really cannot see how England are going to score other than through penalties and Burns to kick those...really? Has to be NZ by at least 40 and probably more!!!

 

[TheSaffycen]

RE: Hartley.

He was never dropped form the EPS and was always the next inline should Youngs be injured and vice versa - the point is he didn't parachute a form player from outside the EPS into take an EPS players position. i don't really care if people think this is right or wrong it's lancasters call, but it's consistent.

In fairness he is consistent with the picking of his players. Gray has always been in around the set up and is now on the bench against the All- Blacks....

Also my prediction New Zealand 40 England 11

 

[j'nuh]

RE: Burns.

Second Third choice yet signed by one of the biggest clubs, not just in England but, in the World. Obviously it's more than just Lancaster and Catt who see something in him.

Regardless, Lancaster has been consistent in his selection process, he selects from within the EPS unless injury occurs. Cipriani was always pencilled into play in the Canterbury game - if he isn't i think people can moan .

You're arguing a straw man here. There's absolutely no one saying that Burns won't get better with time. I know you've only been on this forum since February, but in the two seasons before this (2011-12, 2012-13), the vast majority of the England fans on this forum were in consensus that Burns should be starting for England. Even ahead of Farrell. This forum has been massively pro-Burns. He had that exciting play style that England fans craved after the World Cup, and I, among many, were getting frustrated with how he wasn't getting any opportunity to showcase his talents. Some believe (including myself, and I still believe it to be the case) that Burns lost out to Farrell initially because of nepotism.

But what's also true is that he has been, quite possibly, the biggest flop in the Premiership this season. He has truly been that bad. Bad enough to cause a split between Gloucester fans, where half are even questioning his commitment. His lack of belief throughout the season was apparent to see. For example, whilst the rest of the Gloucester team stayed on the pitch at the end of a particularly bad match, he left to the changing rooms to lash out. Another is that Nigel Davies stated that Burns kept being picked as the primary goal kicker because he had the highest percentage in training. Yet come match day, he would put in poor kicking performances nearly every time.

He's a great talent in a bad point for form. Thing is that Cipriani lost it years ago, and is only starting to get back to his best. Who knows how long Burns will be out of form? He could already be back in form, he could recover it in a year, he could recover it in 5. He may never. But whilst he has proved

 

[Big Ewis]

34-19 to the ABs. Just can't see England winning the first game. Right now I'm just hoping the players show they are international standard and have potential.

you feel England can produce 19 points in NZ ? Well I mean they do have guys like Brown, Tuilagi, Yarde...

 

[TRF_Olyy]

under 50 - more than 10.

I reckon 45-21

I can see that - maybe a penalty or so less for England.
Also reckon we'll get a couple of injuries - probably Marler and Wilson, knowing our luck.

 

[donmcdazzle]

We're not going to be cohesive enough to put on 40 points. You guys are over-estimating how good we will be. It'll be NZ: 20-30 England:10-15

 

[Big Ewis]

We're not going to be cohesive enough to put on 40 points. You guys are over-estimating how good we will be. It'll be NZ: 20-30 England:10-15

NZ have started tours off nicely in the past, they don't always need a game to get into the flow. Put 40 on a fine Ireland squad in the first test two summers ago.

 

[Darwin]

Wow, you English are a pessimistic bunch aren't you

As has been mentioned this isn't an ideal match for the ABs. We are expected to win comfortably, but if we do this will simply be attributed to a weakened England side. If England get close (say within 10 points) it will be a national disaster, and if the unthinkable happens and we lose the world will have ended for most Kiwis.....

There are a few concerns I have with this ABs side. Up front Woodcock is past his best, Coles is improving but still not world class, while Franks seems to have gone backwards these last few years. McCaw is still tackling well but has noticebly lost a lot of pace, and we are missing our most important player (and the best player in the world) at 8. The backline is less of a concern, but Cruden has looked completely out of sorts these last few weeks after returning from injury, and we will miss Savea's pace and power on the wing.

Obviously we still should win this match (hopefully comfortably), but personally I don't think it will be by as large a margin as many are suggesting...

 

[barkinghooker]

Looks like rain on Saturday. Might be a lower scoring game.. 11 degrees with medium chance of rain.

 

[Aristodemus]

I also worry but we have to understand that it is NZ on their own patch, I will be happy if we give them a game. Excited to see Eastmond & Tuilagi though, I really hope they make the impact I know they can.

 

[Maverick1987]

RE: Hartley.

He was never dropped form the EPS and was always the next inline should Youngs be injured and vice versa - the point is he didn't parachute a form player from outside the EPS into take an EPS players position. i don't really care if people think this is right or wrong it's lancasters call, but it's consistent.


RE: Burns.

Second Third choice yet signed by one of the biggest clubs, not just in England but, in the World. Obviously it's more than just Lancaster and Catt who see something in him.

Regardless, Lancaster has been consistent in his selection process, he selects from within the EPS unless injury occurs. Cipriani was always pencilled into play in the Canterbury game - if he isn't i think people can moan .

RE burns

Tbh I wouldn't pick him over his brother at the moment or Goode or Slade and I might even be tempted to start Alex Goode if he was available that's how poor he's been. I'm a tigers fan and I'm chuffed we have signed him because I believe the magic will come back but until then he doesn't deserve to start and it quite frankly sends out a very bad message to people looking to break into this squad before the RWC next year When he bought Billy V into the squad he started him because club form merited it . I believe he doesn't trust Cipriani because of what's gone on in the past rather than on what's happening at present . Was rowntree in the coaching setup with MJ ?

 

[iINDOMINUSxx]

will Cipriani be englands starting 10? here something to bring back the old days when he got his first full start

 

[TRF_Olyy]

will Cipriani be englands starting 10?

Is this a joke?

 

[iINDOMINUSxx]

Is this a joke?

yeah

 

[ratsapprentice]

...you wouldn't want him to beam you up.

 

[Big Ewis]

As has been mentioned this isn't an ideal match for the ABs. We are expected to win comfortably, but if we do this will simply be attributed to a weakened England side. If England get close (say within 10 points) it will be a national disaster, and if the unthinkable happens and we lose the world will have ended for most Kiwis.....

wow, so it's like that in NZ ay...we'll send you the side we sent to Scotland last winter then. That ought to freak NZ - tha - fucq - out. A large contingent of the kiwi people would fall prey to a dementia-inducing psychosis from merely visualizing the possibility of losing to that side. Hansen would likely die of a heart attack instantly after hearing the news. Trees would start to melt...yeah I mean, well, it would really creep em the shhit out.
Now we forever know the All-Blacks are terrified of playing weakened Tier 1 teams at home.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

you feel England can produce 19 points in NZ ? Well I mean they do have guys like Brown, Tuilagi, Yarde...

More hope than believe. I was going on 2 unconverted tries and 3 penalties. The ABs actually infringe a lot at the breakdown but get away with it.

 

[donmcdazzle]

More hope than believe. I was going on 2 unconverted tries and 3 penalties. The ABs actually infringe a lot at the breakdown but get away with it.

And everything was going so well...

 

[nickdnz]

More hope than believe. I was going on 2 unconverted tries and 3 penalties. The ABs actually infringe a lot at the breakdown but get away with it.

It's called having an "actual openside flanker". England should look into it.