[2014 Mid-Year Tests] France

[TheSaffycen]

actually think Huget is better than Tomane ? i dont agree

And your reason for this ? I just rate him above Tomane as Huget just had a great 6 nations and looked like the most dangerous France back, considering that playing for France on the wing is nigh on impossible as you hardly see the ball scoring 3 tries in 5 games isn't bad. What are your reasons for rating Tomane above Huget ? Tomane to me has just never impressed me when I have seen him.

 

[racingmetro92]

Debaty is always a substitute, so i dont think he'll start against Aussies

 

[Big Ewis]

Huget has really, really come alive this year. He may have been a bit more so-so before with huge games and then relative silence for a little while, 2013-2014 he's been on some heck of form. He really should be considered one of the top wingers in the world right now, definitely Top 10. He was there to finish every single opportunity each time, never faltered, just starving for the line, a true winger's appetite, or interceptions and all (saved France in MF last March...).

Anyways, Fofana has been a bit more discreet every once in a while this year. We couldn't exactly say he's had a bad 2014 so far though. He was on fire against Italy like very few backs can be, has shown some very good improvement in the passing, can do those ultra quick flick-passes now à la Conrad Smith, is a lot more sound on defense. We're just seeing a more mature, some times more discreet Fofana. And he can't score 2013 Twickenham tries every match either...

And interesting head-to-head vs Saffycen.
The scrum, at worst, will be still a bit shaky but won't find itself at fault against the fkn Wallaby tight 5, no issues. It would be nice though if we get back to a genuine 'French level' in the scrum and pulverize them there. Again, would be a huge advantage, and we could use advantages these days...

Some of the guys I pick to have a nice series for France given their opponents: Picamoles, Debaty, Slimani, possibly Fofana.

 

[TheSaffycen]

Some of the guys I pick to have a nice series for France given their opponents: Picamoles, Debaty, Slimani, possibly Fofana.

It will be interesting to see how Slimani and Debaty will do, Debaty is a monster in the loose and Alexander can't challenge him in the scrum, Slimani looked okay in the 6 nations which is a real test of props and Robinson/Slipper aren't world class scrummagers. Australia is the perfect team for a young prop to come and try himself on the intl' stage. I think the guy that is going to have a massive series is Brice Dulin, he looked very good for France (7.5) and he was playing in wet and poor pitches making meters and catches. I think he will show a lot of people that he really could become the best full back in the world. Picamoles will have to be at his carrying best because he will be up against McCalman, Higginbotham and maybe Hodgson who are big tackling and carrying guys, less so Hodgson.

Debaty is always a substitute, so i dont think he'll start against Aussies

As I said above I would start Debaty because scrummaging wont be a big ask, he can carry well and its a big weakness for the Aussies as they don't normally have big guys who can keep bringing the Debaty's, Kayser's and Picamoles down, that's why I think Burban may have a big role to play in this series.

 

[Big Ewis]

now now, I appreciate the enthusiasm, but Dulin will most probably not better Mike Brown, and most definitely not Folau. The rest he's at least as good, or better. Criminally underrated, but that's been said before on this forum...
about Picamoles, I picked him to have a good game because of how he loves to work at the base of the scrum (being an 8) and the try he scored against the Wallabies, albeit in a very different makeup, in that 2012 game in Paris. If the scrum dominates, as it should, we'll find situations whether within their 22 or even not that deep where our scrum will get good momentum and Picamoles can just start his vehicle and bulldoze past a few gold jerseys and either punch in a score himself or make the offload.

Agreed on your comments about Slimani and Debaty.
And well pointed out, Burban can give us a bit of heavy ball carrying, and indeed watching the Wallabies struggle against MASS vs the Boks who kept moving forward with each impact, and getting slaughtered on both occasions last times out, they might have a hard time handling Picamoles, Debaty and co. on a consistent basis.

Maybe a great time to play Tolofua also...if Szar is out injured or wtvr, I really think we should pick him although our lineouts will be febrile during his playing time...

Honestly, we needn't play a super technical game with loads of tactics and what not against the Wallabies. Force is what they fear and we ought to shut em down on attack and pound them when we get the ball. Basically pound em on both ends
Easier said than done, but I'm sure even PSA can handle the coaching for this series given the players he'll have...
I'm not saying the Wallabies are an easy foe at all, I'm saying we have the weapons to shut them down. In a completely chaotic period last November, France managed to suffocate the All-Blacks...

 

[TheSaffycen]

Well if it's carrying ability you want
1.Debaty 2.Tolofua 3.Slimani 4.Maestri 5.Vahaaminha 6.Burban 7.Chouly 8.Picamoles
16.Kayser 17.Domingo 18.Mas 19.Pape 20.Dusautoir/Le Roux 21.Galan

EDIT The starting pack weight is 936kgs!!!!!
The bench is 684KGS !!!!
Big Ewis right now

 

[Big Ewis]

TheSaffycen....

I'm sorry my friend, but you leave me no choice. I was hinting at this conversation about mass to come to an end, but you've cornered me and have provoked my innermost instinctive, destructive nature. It must come out. From my own creation....a horrible offspring, unfathomable. Unspeaka....There's little...time.......oh noo.....Saffycen, TRF.......the world !....don't look below...DON'T LOOOOK !!! WHATEVER YOU DO !!!!!!!
GE...... OUT WHILE.. YOU STILL CAAAAAAAAAAAAAAN !!!!!

 

[Shaggy]

Well lets talk FRANCAIS !!! Not literally because my French is **** but some talking points-
- How will Fofana do ? I have not seen much of him this year but he wasn't the player we saw last year. In the six nations he was not at his brilliant best and in the semi-final of the HCup he was completely shut down by Barritt and co. Is this down too teams putting out players just too shut him down and nullify his threat or is he not on form ? The Top 14 guys can inform me if he is on form or is he in a slump ? He seems to struggle against out and out defensive 12's like Barritt, could McCabe completely shut him down ?
- Is the scrum as big a weapon as it was before ? At their best Domingo and Mas where feared by EVERY nation for their scrummaging power, under the new rules they look a shadow of their former self. Australia are quite well known for **** poor scrummaging and can France destroy Oz up front and take away any platform the Wallabies backs need.
-Will they actually play like a team ? France could be a real force if they played as a team, but with the FFR seemingly not able to see that PSA is a waste of space and that he should be removed from his post as soon as possible. They have some real talented players but look like they have never seen a rugby ball in their lives, they have to rely on individuals getting a half break and then other players realising what's on and playing their natural game.
-Anyway I thought I would put up my 15's for both France and Australia (bold for the better player)
1.Debaty vRobinson
2.Kayser vMoore
3.Slimani vAlexander
4.Vahaaminha vHorwill
5.Maestri v Dennis
6.Nyanga v McCalman
7.Dusautoir v Hooper
8.Picamoles v Higginbotham
9.Parra v Genia(out of form)
10.Tales v Cooper
11.Medard v Cummins
12.Fofana v McCabe
13.Fritz v Ashley-Cooper
14.Huget v Tomane
15.Dulin v Folau

I'm not sure who will be Horwill's locking partner to be honest, but I'm pretty sure it won't be Dave Dennis, who plays most of his rugby at Blide side, and occasionally at Number 8 ... they may pick Will Skelton who is a massive unit, and provides a bit of go forward ball in open play ... not sure if Genia is a dead cert to start either (but it's hard to see him not in the match day squad), it could be the Brumbies Halfback, Nick White who starts, as he's the form halfback at the moment

 

[TheSaffycen]

I'm not sure who will be Horwill's locking partner to be honest, but I'm pretty sure it won't be Dave Dennis, who plays most of his rugby at Blide side, and occasionally at Number 8 ... they may pick Will Skelton who is a massive unit, and provides a bit of go forward ball in open play ... not sure if Genia is a dead cert to start either (but it's hard to see him not in the match day squad), it could be the Brumbies Halfback, Nick White who starts, as he's the form halfback at the moment

Yeah I must be honest that I wasn't sure who would start in the second row, I put Dennis in there as he is the Tahs captain and he has played rugby at lock before. Skelton is a good player but I don't think he is ready, from the little I have seen, but they do need a massive lock to help with scrumming, and Douglas is not intl' quality. I wouldn't be surprised if he plays Simmons.
Watching the Blues v Reds game Genia is so poor at the moment, wasn't great last year, White also has the goal kicking bonus.

 

[Big Ewis]

little update for you (little) fukkers:
Co-captain Papé and tighthead Nicolas Mas to be rested probably for the tour. That removes a lot of experience from the group, respectively 33yo and 54 caps then 33yo and 70 caps.
But I wonder who they'll take as second TH...hopefully not Ducalcon. Maybe they'll use Debaty as TH as they did last time France faced the Aussies, and have Domingo+Forestier at LH.

Backs coach Lagisquet is looking at center Felix le Bourhis from Bordeaux for this tour as a potential new face: 26yo, 87kg, 1m82. Good try scorer, good pace.

PSA to announce the group on Wednesday.

 

[FrenchFan]

interesting head 2 head -only thing i doubt half the Fra players mentionned will be there

atm local grapevine says Maestri Picamoles NYanga Fritz Huget Doussain may not all make trip

Clerc will want to get in contention for a place for WC but could be "asked" to focus on club duty

i've heard these are being heavily discussed atm btw club & nat. selector

Medard may go but not up to the level any longer IMHO

not sure about Dusautoir's impending return to full match fitness - he is due to come back agst Grenoble 2morow, either as a sub or first start, not sure yet

big question mark on Galan Tolofua Camara availability

my take is that about 60% of above will make the trip

 

[Big Ewis]

Yes FrenchFan it's true availability will be a big concern, and a very consequent one. On one hand it makes me very excited, because maybe we'll get to see more of the Le Bourhis, Yann David, Lamerat, Le Devedec, Pélissié...
on the other hand it does the opposite of answering our problem: it makes us even more scattered all over the place and largely inconsistent with selection, and therefor we resume our lack of chemistry issues.
We've got so many guys it's cool to try em out, and it'd be lovely if we could string, like, 3 sides and go up against big nations and their B and C sides too, but as of now it's France vs Australia and we need to win, and to do that we need chemistry...

 

[FrenchFan]

well this is not news. the FFR selection commitee have known that for a long time. If PSA's policy is to develop players into their position and to the benefit of the squad with the RWC in mind then this is an opportunity for him to do so. But I have my reserves because last trip to NZ didn't show that. And when the opportunity has been around this season of developping a N8 like Galan (who has kept Picamoles on the bench this season) he hasn't done so, as Galan, who is the best No 8 behind Picamoles in the league, has yet to be capped under PSA. so when does he start?
One thing is to beg for players (and our Philippe is having to do a lot of sucking up atm), another is to manage them and grow them into a specific role, which he hasn't done enough in 3 years.

The ball is very much on his side now...

PS dont want to rain on your parade but I don't rate Yann David as an Intl. He is a solid Top 14 centre but not an Intl one. His form with us in last seasons doesn't say otherwise.

 

[Big Ewis]

true, David hasn't had as good a season this year in particular, but the guy is a fkn BULL.



There's some absolute BRUTAL-NESS in there.

 

[Tahman15]

Well lets talk FRANCAIS !!! Not literally because my French is **** but some talking points-
- How will Fofana do ? I have not seen much of him this year but he wasn't the player we saw last year. In the six nations he was not at his brilliant best and in the semi-final of the HCup he was completely shut down by Barritt and co. Is this down too teams putting out players just too shut him down and nullify his threat or is he not on form ? The Top 14 guys can inform me if he is on form or is he in a slump ? He seems to struggle against out and out defensive 12's like Barritt, could McCabe completely shut him down ?
- Is the scrum as big a weapon as it was before ? At their best Domingo and Mas where feared by EVERY nation for their scrummaging power, under the new rules they look a shadow of their former self. Australia are quite well known for **** poor scrummaging and can France destroy Oz up front and take away any platform the Wallabies backs need.
-Will they actually play like a team ? France could be a real force if they played as a team, but with the FFR seemingly not able to see that PSA is a waste of space and that he should be removed from his post as soon as possible. They have some real talented players but look like they have never seen a rugby ball in their lives, they have to rely on individuals getting a half break and then other players realising what's on and playing their natural game.
-Anyway I thought I would put up my 15's for both France and Australia (bold for the better player)
1.Debaty vRobinson
2.Kayser vMoore
3.Slimani vAlexander
4.Vahaaminha vHorwill
5.Maestri v Dennis
6.Nyanga v McCalman
7.Dusautoir v Hooper
8.Picamoles v Higginbotham
9.Parra v Genia(out of form)
10.Tales v Cooper
11.Medard v Cummins
12.Fofana v McCabe
13.Fritz v Ashley-Cooper
14.Huget v Tomane
15.Dulin v Folau

I can't speak about the French side but the Wallabies side will probably be a bit different to that one. Robinson hasn't been playing all that well so he'll be replaced by either Sio from the Brumbies who had a very good year or Slipper. Slipper might play3 but unlikely. Dennis will definetly not play 5, he's a 6 or 8. Horwill will be 5 and Simmons will probably 4 though Luke Jones from the Rebels is having a great year though probably start on the bench. Fardy will be the 6 after his performances in the EOYT. 8 will be a 3 way fight between Palu, Higginbotham and McCalman. McCalman has probably been in the best form, but Palu is a beast and the Wallabies still don't know who their captain will be and Higginbotham is great captain. Toomua should be 12 but McCabe has been in career best form. While 13 is between Kurindrani and AAC. If Kurindrani is picked AAC will go on the wing.

 

[Big Ewis]

^ so what do you reckon as an Aussie fan ? Confident about this tour ?

 

[Tahman15]

^ so what do you reckon as an Aussie fan ? Confident about this tour ?

I'd say I'm quietly confident. The French finished badly in the 6n and we played well on the End of Year Tour. We also worked out our back line combinations and we found a good 6 in Fardy. Though with the French you never know what your going to get. But go the Wallabies!!

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

Yeah, Tahman15, I see the Wallabies strongest/form 15 looking something like;

Slipper - picks himself
Moore - same
Alexander/Kepu? - Alexander is a beast in the loose but I have question marks over his work at the scrum; he does seem to hold his own more often than not though SR is not test level.
Simmons - is a must as the only legitimate Aussie lock IMO
Horwill - is a must as well for captaincy/experience IMO even if Jones has looked brilliant with ball-in-hand
Fardy - is a good shout for balance; you have enough ball runners elsewhere and the donkey work this guy gets through will go a long way though I have a lot of time for Dave Dennis and Hodgson
Hooper - has been in consistently very good even if not sublime form. Only real option beyond an injured Pocock and Gill struggling for form
McCalman/Palu - in the form of his life though having Palu start and bringing McCalman on with 30min to go is possibly a good strategy.
White - seems crazy not to start Genia but White has just been so far ahead this year
Toomua - though I can't see Link not go with his golden boy
whatever wing.. I'd probably go with Tomane
McCabe - in form while Leali'ifano has only come back very recently from injury and you don't need his goalkicking with both White and Toomua at 9/10
AAC - simply because of McCabe at 12. If Toomua, Leali'ifano or heaven forbid Beale ends up at 12 I'd play Kuridrani for balance
Cummins - can't ignore the edge the badger brings in close games
Folau - probably the best ball-n-hand player ATM and majestic under the high ball even if there are some technical issues still which is to be expected

 

[Tahman15]

Alexander would probably be my tighthead. He's had a very good year and has been scrimmaging a lot better. McCalman would be my 8, he's been awesome this year, doing heaps of work and a lot of metres. 9 is very hard, White didn't play well last year for the Wallabies but Genia has been quite bad this year. That said the Reds forwards haven't been nearly has dominant as the Brumbies so that's something to take into account. I find it to hard to pick so I wont . During the EOYT last year Cooper played very well at 10 and he struck up a devastating combination with Folau and he actually hasn't been that bad at all this year at the Reds. Toomua would be my 12, he's everything that Cooper's not and he's been the 12 we've been looking for, for a long time. He runs hard and straight, he's as solid as a brickwall in defence plus he has a long and accurate boot which Quade doesn't have all the time. I thought the Cooper-Toomua combination worked very well so why change a proven combination. Kurindrani would be my 13. Again something that worked so why change it, he's big and strong and his pretty solid in defense. AAC is a great 13 as well and has been very good this year but I'd keep Kurindrani there and move AAC to 14 in place of Smokin'Joe Tomane.

 

[gaston le gaff]

He we go PSA's choice for the Tour of Down Under.......... he said he was resting Nico Mas, no FTD but that is normal he pulled a fats one and decided to get married!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
GROUPE FRANCE

AVANTS (18)
1. Thomas DOMINGO – ASM Clermont Auvergne
2. Alexandre MENINI – RC Toulon
3. Guilhem GUIRADO – USA Perpignan Roussillon
4. Benjamin KAYSER – ASM Clermont Auvergne
5. Christopher TOLOFUA – Stade Toulousain
6. Vincent DEBATY – ASM Clermont Auvergne
7. Nicolas MAS – Montpellier HRC
8. Rabah SLIMANI РStade Fran̤ais Paris
9. Alexandre FLANQUART РStade Fran̤ais Paris
10. Bernard LE ROUX РRacing M̩tro 92
11. Yoann MAESTRI – Stade Toulousain
12. S̩bastien VAHAAMAHINA РUSA Perpignan Roussillon
13. Antoine BURBAN РStade Fran̤ais Paris
14. Damien CHOULY – ASM Clermont Auvergne
15. Thierry DUSAUTOIR – Stade Toulousain (Cap)
16. Yannick NYANGA – Stade Toulousain
17. Fulgence OUEDRAOGO – Montpellier HRC
18. Louis PICAMOLES – Stade Toulousain

ARRIERES (13)
19. Maxime MACHENAUD РRacing M̩tro 92
20. Morgan PARRA – ASM Clermont Auvergne
21. Fr̩d̩ric MICHALAK РRC Toulon
22. R̩mi TALES РCastres Olympique
23. Mathieu BASTAREAUD – RC Toulon
24. Gaël FICKOU – Stade Toulousain
25. Wesley FOFANA – ASM Clermont Auvergne
26. Rémi LAMERAT - Castres Olympique
27. Yoann HUGET – Stade Toulousain
28. Felix LE BOURHIS РUnion Bordeaux B̬gles Rugby
29. Maxime MEDARD – Stade Toulousain
30. Hugo BONNEVAL - Stade Français Paris
31. Brice DULIN – Castres Olympique




PROGRAMME

07/06/2014 : Australie – France (Brisbane)
14/06/2014 : Australie – France (Melbourne)
21/06/2014 : Australie – France (Sydney)

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