What would be the best position to play as a 1.83m 75kg (6”0 ,165lbs) (gaining weight!)

[sakura]

I would temper your expectations to add 20kg of muscle as well. You are still young and may have a lot of growth in you but 20kg is a lot.

Whatever weight training you do, make sure you just follow a programme and eat a lot. After the initial muscle gaining phase you get you will probably need to add weight, then diet down a little rinse and repeat as it's difficult to add muscle without fat. But if you are gaining just keep doing what you are doing until it stops working.

Also do you have any specific workout recommendations for a flanker/8? From my own research squats deadlifts and flat bench press where the best, also I found some useful exercises like training my neck with a resistance band. Any recommendations would be appreciated

 

[NZbloke]

Reckon you've pretty well covered the exercises for those positions... also very important to keep practicing over & over again the skill sets for either 7 or 8, the more you do that the more comfortable you'll feel playing in a position.

 

[Which Tyler]

Just a note on the weight training - unlike weight lifting, rugby is dynamic - so try to incorporate balance into your training - both in and of itself; but also whilst lifting.
So progress squats and deadlifts to single leg variations (reduce weight first, then build back up). Progress from there to a bosu board (reduce weight first, then build back up). Progress from bosu board to wobble board.
Progress bench presses to having your back on a bosu board / gym ball (reduce weight first, then build back up) etc.

To bring in balance training, simply spend time on one leg; then on one leg with your eyes closed, then on one leg with eyes closed on a rocker board, then a bosu board, then a wobble board. Then add challenge such as one leg on a wobble board, whilst juggling, or catching and passing a medicine/rugby ball - talking of which, don't forget to simply practice catching and passing a rugby ball, static and on the move.

It's good that you've included neck strengthening - a very good way of minimising concussion risk; but remember to include isometric (nothing moves; so completely solid resistance) to progress up through the resistance band severity, and to include dead weight. Also add proprioceptive training for control of your neck (and leg, even to the arm can't hurt) - strap a laser pointer to your head, and trace various patterns on a wall for control (similar with foot, similar with arm [not hand/wrist])

Also add in core strength (planks, superman and dead bug tracks, bridges etc - with the progressions), pilates and ideally some form of wrestling (Greko-Roman, Ju-Jitsu, Judo etc) or even just scrum down with a single partner and try to push each other over - no foot movement allowed.
And don't forget the shoulders, so military presses, rows, pec flies, and abduction exercises.
Beyond that, Nordic Curls are brilliant at preventing hamstring injuries, Copenhagen Scissors for the adductors, and Crab/Monster walks for the abductors.




I'd also, very strongly suggest that if any of these are new to you (and especially those in the last line), do them with someone who knows what they're talking about initially - and I don't mean a gym buddy, or even a regular personal trainer. I mean a physiotherapist or chiropractor (or osteopath depending on location), or a personal trainer with extra training in rehab.
ETA: Also remember that all of these things have different names depending on location, profession, age of therapist etc etc (I generally prefer naming them by action)

 

[Which Tyler]

Some good resources here:
Rugby specific overview: https://www.englandrugby.com/participation/coaching/activate


The following are NOT exclusive, and all of the exercises I've mention have progressions. I'm including them for illustrative purposes only...
Single leg Squat:
Single leg Deadlift:
Balanced bench press:
Bosu single leg squat (unweighted):
Wobble board balance:
Single Leg Catch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZD1bKYRAgjU
Bosu Pass: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xOkkAGZUKis
Neck strengthening (flexion only, don't forget extension and side-bending): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x86Dx9xoNOY
Neck proprioception: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=12JZT-tXsNE
Superman: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KHCfvpHtFYE
Dead Bug: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P9RM_KwhgnM
Bridge: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shLBJayRrD8
Military Press: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2r84dRILxM4
Row: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WS8U9Dzzy70
Shoulder abduction: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F1xP5gCCzKs
Pec Fly: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z8BClZqz128
Nordic Curl (she cheats just before dropping): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypBDnCQy1h4
Copenhagen: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6qfTLKhjnk
Crab / Monster Walk: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i0w7KczRvkk


Again, for many of these, don't try without professional assessment as to your starting level, training of technique, and oversight of progression.
ETA: Sorry, I don't know how to turn off the automatic embedding (any mod.s want to get involved there? @TRF_Olyy @TRF_heineken )

 

[sakura]

Some good resources here:
Rugby specific overview: https://www.englandrugby.com/participation/coaching/activate


The following are NOT exclusive, and all of the exercises I've mention have progressions. I'm including them for illustrative purposes only...
Single leg Squat:
Single leg Deadlift:
Balanced bench press:
Bosu single leg squat (unweighted):
Wobble board balance:
Single Leg Catch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZD1bKYRAgjU
Bosu Pass: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xOkkAGZUKis
Neck strengthening (flexion only, don't forget extension and side-bending): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x86Dx9xoNOY
Neck proprioception: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=12JZT-tXsNE
Superman: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KHCfvpHtFYE
Dead Bug: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P9RM_KwhgnM
Bridge: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shLBJayRrD8
Military Press: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2r84dRILxM4
Row: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WS8U9Dzzy70
Shoulder abduction: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F1xP5gCCzKs
Pec Fly: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z8BClZqz128
Nordic Curl (she cheats just before dropping): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypBDnCQy1h4
Copenhagen: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6qfTLKhjnk
Crab / Monster Walk: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i0w7KczRvkk


Again, for many of these, don't try without professional assessment as to your starting level, training of technique, and oversight of progression.
ETA: Sorry, I don't know how to turn off the automatic embedding (any mod.s want to get involved there? @TRF_Olyy @TRF_heineken )

Wow this is awesome! Thank you so much man this is a really big step forward of my original training plan! Also really appreciate the time you took for me, I couldn't ask for this haha… Amazing I'll definitely include these to my schedule

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Wow this is awesome! Thank you so much man this is a really big step forward of my original training plan! Also really appreciate the time you took for me, I couldn't ask for this haha… Amazing I'll definitely include these to my schedule

Remember though that the above is the added extra. Your main weight training should be squats, deads, bench and press. You can add stuff but focus on progressing on those for a good few years. If you e for someone to teach you then the Olympic lifts are great but better not to risk it if you don't have a trainer.

The best thing to do would be something like him wendlers 531 or the Texas 5x5 until you have a good level of strength. Just make sure that weight training adds to your rugby and you don't exhaust yourself before game day.

I'm 35 now, if I could give young men some advice, it would be, work on calf and hamstring flexibility. And to lots of hypertrophy work for the delts. I focused on power but could have really used some thicker padding on them.

 

[sakura]

Remember though that the above is the added extra. Your main weight training should be squats, deads, bench and press. You can add stuff but focus on progressing on those for a good few years. If you e for someone to teach you then the Olympic lifts are great but better not to risk it if you don't have a trainer.

The best thing to do would be something like him wendlers 531 or the Texas 5x5 until you have a good level of strength. Just make sure that weight training adds to your rugby and you don't exhaust yourself before game day.

I'm 35 now, if I could give young men some advice, it would be, work on calf and hamstring flexibility. And to lots of hypertrophy work for the delts. I focused on power but could have really used some thicker padding on them.

Oh thanks a lot I'll do that! Also is there maybe a way to improve my knees for getting less injury? I sometimes ruin my knees with a lot of running and also if I walk too many stairs… maybe this is just technique and nothing I can do about it with exercises but its definitely worth it to ask

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Oh thanks a lot I'll do that! Also is there maybe a way to improve my knees for getting less injury? I sometimes ruin my knees with a lot of running and also if I walk too many stairs… maybe this is just technique and nothing I can do about it with exercises but its definitely worth it to ask

My old physio used to say nearly every knee problem was caused by the hips. Not sure that's entirely true but maybe go see a physio if can afford and if not, do a 6 week block of daily hip work, if it helps great, if not try a 6 week block of other online physio stuff for knees. But I'd really just see a physio.

On top of that I'd avoid extra running, if you want to cardio use a rower or elliptical, or make sure you don't run on a hard service.

 

[sakura]

My old physio used to say nearly every knee problem was caused by the hips. Not sure that's entirely true but maybe go see a physio if can afford and if not, do a 6 week block of daily hip work, if it helps great, if not try a 6 week block of other online physio stuff for knees. But I'd really just see a physio.

On top of that I'd avoid extra running, if you want to cardio use a rower or elliptical, or make sure you don't run on a hard service.

Oh thanks a lot I'll ask the chiropractor where I'm currently at for his opinion aswell and if he doesn't know it I make sure to see a physio thanks!

Also I was thinking of getting a threadmil, there was one thats foldable and easy to store under my bed that has shockdemping (senz sports M2000)
I thought even tho I know running is bad for my knees I thought it would still be important to train for sprinting and endurance running for a game, or do you think any form of cardio works fine if I just got the right form etc while running?

 

[Which Tyler]

Remember though that the above is the added extra. Your main weight training should be squats, deads, bench and press. You can add stuff but focus on progressing on those for a good few years.

Mostly, but not quite.
The exercises above are the add-ons beyond squats, deadlifts and bench-press; but they're not to be put off for a few years first and not to be ignored in favour of doing more squats deadlifts and bench presses.
They're mostly about giving you the control to be able to use the power gained from the basics in the gym, and preventing injury in the first place.

My old physio used to say nearly every knee problem was caused by the hips. Not sure that's entirely true but maybe go see a physio if can afford and if not, do a 6 week block of daily hip work, if it helps great, if not try a 6 week block of other online physio stuff for knees. But I'd really just see a physio.

On top of that I'd avoid extra running, if you want to cardio use a rower or elliptical, or make sure you don't run on a hard service.

Your old physio... went too far with that. Far more knee problems are cause by the hips than most people think (and the same is true the other way around) but that's a long way from being "nearly every"
I absolutely agree to see a physio.
As for "extra running" it depends what baseline we're talking about. The people with the healthiest knees are those jogging 2-10km 2-3 times per week. There's a whole host of things to do for "knees that hurt when running" before reaching the stage of "don't run".
Running is brilliant for most knee problems - as is walking. Advice to avoid is simply out of date.
That said, rower / elliptical is fine advice - avoiding hard surfaces depends on what the alternatives are, and other factors for the individual patient.

I thought even tho I know running is bad for my knees I thought it would still be important to train for sprinting and endurance running for a game, or do you think any form of cardio works fine if I just got the right form etc while running?

You know wrong (probably) - but don't worry, it's just one of those things that "everyone knows" and is simply not true in the significant majority of cases.
I'd strongly recommend seeing either (or both) a physiotherapist or chiropractor about all of this anyway, from the feet upwards. I'd recommend starting the progressions of the exercises I suggested above in conjunction with a physio (or chiro if they're into this stuff) - and feel free to take my list along with you.

 

[sakura]

Mostly, but not quite.
The exercises above are the add-ons beyond squats, deadlifts and bench-press; but they're not to be put off for a few years first and not to be ignored in favour of doing more squats deadlifts and bench presses.
They're mostly about giving you the control to be able to use the power gained from the basics in the gym, and preventing injury in the first place.


Your old physio was wrong - or rather, went too far with that. Far more knee problems are cause by the hips than most people think (and the same is true the other way around) but that's a long way from being "nearly every"
I agree to see a physio.
As for "extra running" it depends what baseline we're talking about. The people with the healthiest knees are those jogging 2-10km 2-3 times per week. There's a whole host of things to do for "knees that hurt when running" before reaching the stage of "don't run".
Running is brilliant for most knee problems - as is walking. Advice to avoid is simply out of date.
That said, rower / elliptical is fine advice - avoiding hard surfaces depends on what the alternatives are, and other factors for the individual patient.


You know wrong - but don't worry, it's just one of those things that "everyone knows" and is simply not true in the significant majority of cases.
I'd strongly recommend seeing either (or both) a physiotherapist or chiropractor about all of this anyway, from the feet upwards. I'd recommend starting the progressions of the exercises I suggested above in conjunction with a physio (or chiro if they're into this stuff) - and feel free to take my list along with you.

Yes I will do! I started to go to my chiro because he gave really good discounts to students (50%!) and I had walked with issues in my shoulder that feeled weird for some years. But the last time I went to him it turns out he almost made it into professional rugby and he once played a match against the All Blacks back in the days. Hes a pretty cool guy, and he now does some coaching at the local rugby club here I think, he's originally from the US so its funny he ended up here, what a coincidence haha. But hes pretty busy and I only see him once in a few weeks so I can't ask him everything… but when I see him I definitely show him all you guys sent and get some help of him

So you would say that if I get some good shockdemping shoes and a threadmil for some extra relief while running it should be fine? (And also do the exercises and check if its in my hips and improve some form etc)

I hope I have my new squat bar and weights this week. Can't wait to try the exercises

( https://powerracks.nl/products/squat-rack-complete-home-gym big improvement from my 10kg dumbells! )

 

[Which Tyler]

So you would say that if I get some good shockdemping shoes and a threadmil for some extra relief while running it should be fine? (And also do the exercises and check if its in my hips and improve some form etc)

It depends what's wrong with the knees and why they hurt when you run.

Years post-injury, most knee pain whilst running is because "everyone knows not to run with knee pain" so the brain just create pain. In which case, the right treatment is to re-train the brain not to think that (and there are many things that can help with that - mostly by applying a nice placebo pack and then proving to the brain that it's previous opinion was wrong).

Or it might need some sports tape (which can help with the above). Or it might need some shock absorption such as running on soft but predictable surfaces (which can help with the above). Or it might need some shock absorption in terms of trainers and insoles (which can help with the above, but also build dependency). Or it might need an orthopaedic brace (which can help with the above, but also build dependency). Or it might need a relatively minor retraining of your running gait (which can help with the above). Or it might need a major re-working of your running technique (which can help with the above). Or it might be that the hip, or the ankle are actually the areas that need to be addressed, but it's coming out in the knee as the point of previous injury. It's highly unlikely, but it might even be that there's still some damage from the previous injury that needs to be worked through first.


Ultimately, the best thing to do (shy of seeing a professional) is to run barefoot on a soft, predictable surface (like a rugby pitch), and start off with jogging tiny distances (say 10m) to prove to the brain that it's not an absolute that running = pain, and that you're just haggling with it as to what level of challenge is fair to start feeling pain at. That might be distance, it might be speed, it might be introducing side-steps, it might be uneven/unpredictable surfaces, it might be harder surfaces, it might be drag-running, it might be...
Start pathetically small, prove the concept, and build from there.


FTR: I may never got remotely close to playing against the All Blacks - but I have treated one (and a Bok Prop).
Using variations on the theme of the advice above I've also got a patient from being medically discharged from the army, and told she'd never walk unaided, to ditching the stick and running half-marathons.

 

[sakura]

It depends what's wrong with the knees and why they hurt when you run.

Years post-injury, most knee pain whilst running is because "everyone knows not to run with knee pain" so the brain just create pain. In which case, the right treatment is to re-train the brain not to think that (and there are many things that can help with that - mostly by applying a nice placebo pack and then proving to the brain that it's previous opinion was wrong).

Or it might need some sports tape (which can help with the above). Or it might need some shock absorption such as running on soft but predictable surfaces (which can help with the above). Or it might need some shock absorption in terms of trainers and insoles (which can help with the above, but also build dependency). Or it might need an orthopaedic brace (which can help with the above, but also build dependency). Or it might need a relatively minor retraining of your running gait (which can help with the above). Or it might need a major re-working of your running technique (which can help with the above). Or it might be that the hip, or the ankle are actually the areas that need to be addressed, but it's coming out in the knee as the point of previous injury. It's highly unlikely, but it might even be that there's still some damage from the previous injury that needs to be worked through first.


Ultimately, the best thing to do (shy of seeing a professional) is to run barefoot on a soft, predictable surface (like a rugby pitch), and start off with jogging tiny distances (say 10m) to prove to the brain that it's not an absolute that running = pain, and that you're just haggling with it as to what level of challenge is fair to start feeling pain at. That might be distance, it might be speed, it might be introducing side-steps, it might be uneven/unpredictable surfaces, it might be harder surfaces, it might be drag-running, it might be...
Start pathetically small, prove the concept, and build from there.


FTR: I may never got remotely close to playing against the All Blacks - but I have treated one (and a Bok Prop).
Using variations on the theme of the advice above I've also got a patient from being medically discharged from the army, and told she'd never walk unaided, to ditching the stick and running half-marathons.

Thanks again for the great in depth advice! I'll try that out soon too thanks!

 

[BPM]

Ah man. Don't even get me started …

I'm considering dusting off my boots but my body probably isn't up to it anymore.

My left ankle and my right knee are my problem areas but probably caused by my hips and calves being tight as hell. I do try to work on it, but it's easier said than done with a very sedentary job.