Wales v Scotland

[Bluemoon]

I dont agree that this is similar to football because there was enough contact for Byrne to fall over - therefore the right call was made. In football a bad dive is made when the player isn't touched enough to make and impact or isn't contacted at all yet still dives.

Whether he made a meal of it or not only he will know.

It reminds me alot of the Tom james 'headbutt' on Oliver Azam from last year. I know its not directly related - but the head made contact so the card was given. With Byrne - Godmans foot made contact the card was given. Cest La Vie.

Tom James Headbutt

 

[shtove]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (dullonien @ Feb 17 2010, 05:01 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

I'm not so sure about that. You just have to look how effective an ankle tap is to see how easily someone can loose their balance when one of their ankles is knocked.

Agree with RC about Lee Byrne in general though. He does some sly things that annoy me. He does and always had milked these things. He's also guilty of small cheap shots off the ball (something Mite or Pres have always complained about). He should cut these things out of his game, because he's one of the best fullbacks in the world (in the top 3), so doesn't need to do these stupid little things.

Still don't think he took a dive though. If he did, it was the best timed and most authentic one I've ever witnessed (football included).[/b]

Yes, ankle tap shows how any interference is enough. Cheap shots? Happens all the time, maybe a 15 is too out in the open to hide them compared with what goes on in the pack.

 

[Hermezzz]

I don't think he had dived either, he was touched by Godman (was it Godman?) but it shouldn't have been a penalty cos Godman (again, was he?) was in the air and had no intention to stop Byrne

 

[Meh]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gingergenius @ Feb 16 2010, 05:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

I really would like post match citings and lengthy bans given for play acting. It's crept into both Union and League in the last couple of years, and it seems Byrne, Armitage and Monye are the main exponents. In my opinion, it's as bad as what Flannery did.[/b]

A possible dive, even though there's proven contact, is just as bad as kicking the hell out of somebody?

Eh? :huh:

 

[Thingimubob]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mr. One-Two @ Feb 16 2010, 07:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

I don't think he had dived either, he was touched by Godman (was it Godman?) but it shouldn't have been a penalty cos Godman (again, was he?) was in the air and had no intention to stop Byrne[/b]

meh, it was a try scoring opportunity and he was taken out, which accidental or not, is a cardable offence.
To those who think Byrne dived and are comparing him to Gerrard and co, look at it again. When a footballer dives from the slightest contact (or none at all) there's a split second where they carry on running before going down (in theatrical fation), Byrne doesnt do that. He'd have to have timed his 'dive' to perfection to make it look that realistic and natural! I mean Godmans foot clearly makes contact with Byrnes ankle (think his arm hits Byrne too), and from personal experience with ankle taps and trips, it doesnt take much contact with you're lower legs to make you lose you're balance and fall over when you're sprinting at full pelt like Byrne was.

 

[Will]

Actually Thingimubob, you're wrong on that point. The rules state that a player (in this case Godman) does not need to move out of the way of a player running onto a chipped ball. The rules instead state that the player must not deliberately move into the player's path and obstruct or hinder him. In this case Godman did not deliberately move into the way of Byrne. He jumped straight up for the ball and tried to catch it as had been chipped over him. As he made no deliberate attempt to obstruct Byrne it's then up to Byrne to miss the 6ft3, 17 stone Scotsman who's currently a foot off the ground and not just run straight into him delibately.....

And Bluemoon, for some reason the forum isn't letting me quote you directly. On your first point though, a a lot of footballers have developed the skill of diving. It's not only falling over when there is no contact at all. It also involves deliberately looking for contact so as to make the dive more convincing. Looking for contact where, if there was no intention to dive then there would be none. We've all seen the players who leave their foot in after a missed tackle, orwho delibately change their direction ever so slightly so as to come into contact with another outfield player, or even the goalie. It's a skill in itself, but that doesn't make it acceptable.

 

[dullonien]

Godman, 6ft3 and 17 stone! Are you sure?

The one thing Godman did do was stick out an arm, and by the rulebook, that is still delibriate obstruction. Still don't think he deserved a yellow card though.

Would still be unfair to judge that Byrne had delibriately looked for contact, looked like he tried to swerve around Godman.

 

[Will]

Actually, on that point (and not being fully aware of Godman's particulars)...

I've just had a look at Wikipedia and Godman is apparently 5ft 8 and 15 Stone. I was merely trying to make the point though that he's hardly a hard person to miss when he's about a foot off the ground and jumping straight in the air. You'd think that the only way not to miss him would be to run into him deliberately....?

 

[dullonien]

Just took another look at the slow motion replay they showed on Scrum V (iPlayer is anyone else fancies looking), and it was certainly Lee Byrne's fault that he got caught by Godman's boot, as Godman didn't move that foot an inch when he was in the air. Lee Byrne certainly swerved to miss him, but not quite enough by the looks of it. Godman does however delibriately stick out an arm into Lee Byrne's path. On it's own, I doubt that was enough to send Byrne falling, but combined with the boot it was.

So what caused Lee Byrne to fall was the boot, which was not Godman's fault, but he still attempted to hinder Byrne. Tough one overall, and it certainly could have gone either way looking at the slow-mo replay. However the ref doesn't have the luxury of that, and at full speed it certainly looks like a trip, and Godman doesn't help this by sticking his arm out.

Edit: understand why you're annoyed at the decision Will, I would be too. But on this occasion I'm gonna back Byrne that he didn't delibriately dive.

 

[Thingimubob]

I agree with Dull, you do have a fair point though Will! Not trying to say that Godman was deliberatly trying to bring Byrne down (just making that clear) but I really dont think Byrne dived. You made a point about the not having to move out of the path of kicker rule, does that actually count if, like Godman, a player is moving? I mean I know if you stand you're ground and dont move, then it's fine (perfect example of that was Olly Morgan kicking an up and under in last years EDF Final, running straight into a static Shanklin looking for a penalty, ref correctly ignored it, then the Blues scored straight away on the counter attack making Morgan look like a *** :lol: ) but does it still count if you're leaping through the air? Another point is maybe the reason the penalty and card were given was because the contact with small and relatively subtlen (bit like Wyn-Jones's trip, just probably minus the intent and stupidity <_< ), and would a penalty have been given if Byrne had simply crashed straight into Godman?

 

[Olyy]

Just watched the clip again, when Byrne fell he lay there holding his ankle like a footballer does 'n' all

 

[RC]

Magic sponge, quick!!!

 

[cyRil]

Boooooooriiiiiiiing!
Gaw, what do you reckon we'll do in the French game to tie people over talking **** until the Irish match?

 

[feicarsinn]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cyRil of Ospreylia @ Feb 17 2010, 07:04 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Boooooooriiiiiiiing!
Gaw, what do you reckon we'll do in the French game to tie people over talking **** until the Irish match?[/b]

Henson > Bastareaud