Wouldnt go as far to say we dont need them. Tonga current squad does not have a decent fetcher or a fetcher of Latu's standard. You take away Latu, Taione, and to a lesser extent T-Pole(yellow card against Samoa nearly cost Tonga) from the last World Cup and Tonga would have never done that well.
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Vuna named in Tonga squad
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That was 2007,its 2011 now-the game is faster now.Tonga have a young flanker Kolomatangi that plays NPC for Counties.Right up there for breakdown turnovers last season.And the game now is all about the breakdown and turning over ball.Tonga has 2 trump cards this World Cup-a good 7 and a good 10.Key positions in the modern game.In my opinion this is a better squad than 2007-I can see them beating Japan and Canada and then rolling France in the decider to be second qualifier in their group.The French have a healthy respect for Tongans as many of them play there.Also remember that France play the All Blacks before they play Tonga.We all know the French are vulnerable away from home normally and I understand every Tongan in NZ will at Wellington for that game-it will seem like it is a home game for Tonga.I know who my money will be on!
AfakasiAssasin
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2007/2011
1 Tonga'huia/Tonga'huia or Lea'aetoa
2 Lutui/Taukafa or Telefoni
3 Pulu/Taumololo or Pulu
4 Hehea/Tuineau or Hehea
5 Fa'aoso/Timani or Fa'aoso
6 T-Pole/Mafi or Kalamafoni
7 Latu/Koloamatangi or Afu
8 Maka/Maka or Vahafolau
9 Tui'polotu/Fisilau or D Morath
10 Hola/K Morath
11 Tu'ifua/Vuna or Fatafehi
12 Taione/Kefu or Mailei
13 Hufanga/Piutau
14 Vaka/Malupo Helu or Pakalani
15 Lilo/Lilo
I guess on paper when you compare the squads, Id have to agree. Tonga does look stronger this world cup..Though I feel the Backrow was better in 2007 and was the key to their successful run. The forward pack looks to be pretty devastating... If they can squeeze abit of juice from the back line, 2 wins is a reasonable task with a chance to upset a depleted France,unlikely, but it can be done. As you said Tonga will feel like they have the home advantage playing in Wellington plus Tonga will have a 9 day rest with France coming off Playing New Zealand may leave them depleted. I think Tonga should rest their stars for the opener and target France Japan and Canada if they are to progress.
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We all know who Kolomatagi is, and although he is Tongas best option, he is nowhere near as good as Latu. Kolomatagi is really a 6 that has the skills to cover 7 if he needs to (and in the case of Tonga, he needs to). To say that he is a "Trump card" as a 7 is ridiculous.
agreed Tonga doesnt have anyone as good as Latu when it comes to turnovers. Latu was the reason Hola got opportunities to kick for goal against Samoa and England. Im hoping Morath gets that same opportunity as hes probably got the highest kicking % in the shute shield right now.
What is not ridiculous is that Latu is not playing in 2011 so comparisons are irrelevant.Koloamatangi is listed in the Churchill Cup team so we will be able to gauge his ability a little there.Remember he has featured against New Zealands best in the NPC last season and that is something Latu could never do.Plus Koloamatangi is young and on the way up and highly regarded in the Chiefs franchise.The World Cup could be the making of him.That is of course if he is available.We will know in 10 days.
The word is that some players put on the World Cup 50 list were not consulted first.Vuna has openly said his first priority is Australia and I believe Pakalani is also unavailable.Remember they cannot play for Tonga and get a Super 15 contract in Australia and New Zealand.(with the exception of the Rebels)Represent an Island nation and you are a leper and Japan and Europe are your only alternatives.
Lets wait until we see if Koloamatangi fronts-then after a few games we will be able to judge if our differing estimations of his and Latus ability are valid.
The word is that some players put on the World Cup 50 list were not consulted first.Vuna has openly said his first priority is Australia and I believe Pakalani is also unavailable.Remember they cannot play for Tonga and get a Super 15 contract in Australia and New Zealand.(with the exception of the Rebels)Represent an Island nation and you are a leper and Japan and Europe are your only alternatives.
Lets wait until we see if Koloamatangi fronts-then after a few games we will be able to judge if our differing estimations of his and Latus ability are valid.
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Nili Latu played quite a few seasons for Bay of Plenty, including an instrumental role in winning the ranfurly shield and being named BOP player of the year in '05. He also went on to play 2 seasons with the Chiefs and a season with the Hurricanes..
You say Koloamatagi featured against "New Zealands best", well Nili Latu was once a member of the New Zealand Secondary Schools and Under 19 sides, not only has he featured against NZs best, but at one stage he was New Zealands best.
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Thats why Kahn Fotuali'i, Simon Lemalu, Anthony Perenise, Mahonri Shwalger etc are all playing for NZ sides in this years Super 14.
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You initiated a comparison in the first place.
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What are you talking about? Koloamatagi has played just one fairly solid season of ITM cup rugby.
Nili Latu played quite a few seasons for Bay of Plenty, including an instrumental role in winning the ranfurly shield and being named BOP player of the year in '05. He also went on to play 2 seasons with the Chiefs and a season with the Hurricanes..
You say Koloamatagi featured against "New Zealands best", well Nili Latu was once a member of the New Zealand Secondary Schools and Under 19 sides, not only has he featured against NZs best, but at one stage he was New Zealands best.
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Koloamatagi is currently an invitational member of the Chiefs development setup outside of the contracted wider squad. Thats great, but he still has a while to go to catch up to what Nili Latu has already achieved in the Chiefs setup.
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That isn't neccessarily the case in New Zealand. Pacific Islanders are exempt from the 'no-overseas players" rule, although every player has to get individual dispensation from the NZRU.
Thats why Kahn Fotuali'i, Simon Lemalu, Anthony Perenise, Mahonri Shwalger etc are all playing for NZ sides in this years Super 14.
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Don't get me wrong, i rate Koloamatagi highly. if you just scroll up you will see that i singled out as Tongas best option at 7 before you got here. Its just that he is only a talented young player at this stage, where as Latu is probably the greatest pacific island 7 since Micheal Jones.
Of course I initiated the comparison of Latu and Koloamatangi because other members keep saying that Latu is needed.He isnt!Nor will be selected-end of story!For the record,Latu was only a backup flanker for others at both the Chiefs and the Hurricanes.Why do you think he left for Japan-he wasnt going to be selected in Super 14 again.
As far as Koloamatangi and the Chiefs training squad goes,his time will come maybe.Then maybe not-Id say that NZ Under 20s flanker Sam Cane is the Chiefs and NZ Rugby's next flanker project ahead of Koloamatangi.We must remember that NZ rugby always had many options in most positions so some really good young players have missed out.Koloamatangi may be one of those.If he opts for Tonga,he will surely have to head for Europe.Not a bad second option really and probably better salary.
Sure there are "exempted" Island players for Super 15-but franchise coaches have to virtually beg the NZRFU to gain their services.Viliame Maafu and Junior Polu two notable examples from last season.You will note that Fotuali'i,Perenise and Schwalger was only for this season-all gone to Europe for next season.The general rule in NZ and Oz is you must be available to play for their national team.Thats why Vuna is tossing up right now-might as well save his time!He is most unlikely to be selected for Australia.
Koloamatangi is not only Tonga's best option-he is presently their TOP option-hence in my opinion a trump card.Like I said earlier,the ability to get turnover ball is vital under the current breakdown rules-ask any Super 15 coach.
I would just like to see Tonga get a fair go at the World Cup 2011.Getting their best available players is important for them.The Ikale Tahi will have fantastic support in NZ-and when Island players represent their country,it is not about money.Its about pride in the jersey!Money cant buy that.
Thanks for your opinions-we dont have to agree.But debate is great.Give me your opinions on some of the other players.Maybe you will be there to support Tonga.I hope so!
As far as Koloamatangi and the Chiefs training squad goes,his time will come maybe.Then maybe not-Id say that NZ Under 20s flanker Sam Cane is the Chiefs and NZ Rugby's next flanker project ahead of Koloamatangi.We must remember that NZ rugby always had many options in most positions so some really good young players have missed out.Koloamatangi may be one of those.If he opts for Tonga,he will surely have to head for Europe.Not a bad second option really and probably better salary.
Sure there are "exempted" Island players for Super 15-but franchise coaches have to virtually beg the NZRFU to gain their services.Viliame Maafu and Junior Polu two notable examples from last season.You will note that Fotuali'i,Perenise and Schwalger was only for this season-all gone to Europe for next season.The general rule in NZ and Oz is you must be available to play for their national team.Thats why Vuna is tossing up right now-might as well save his time!He is most unlikely to be selected for Australia.
Koloamatangi is not only Tonga's best option-he is presently their TOP option-hence in my opinion a trump card.Like I said earlier,the ability to get turnover ball is vital under the current breakdown rules-ask any Super 15 coach.
I would just like to see Tonga get a fair go at the World Cup 2011.Getting their best available players is important for them.The Ikale Tahi will have fantastic support in NZ-and when Island players represent their country,it is not about money.Its about pride in the jersey!Money cant buy that.
Thanks for your opinions-we dont have to agree.But debate is great.Give me your opinions on some of the other players.Maybe you will be there to support Tonga.I hope so!
AfakasiAssasin
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I find New Zealand super franchise teams very hesitant to start non eligible NZ players even they are the best available in their position. As I said in his prime, Latu should be a starter in Most run on sides around the world.
I think tonga can do well if they gel the same way they did last world cup. It's all good assembling a good team on paper as is the case with Samoa and Fiji, but if the team chemistry isn't there..blowouts are inevitable against the tier 1 sides. I do have mad support for all the Pacific Islands at the world cup (except when Samoa play Fiji) and I do hope they can do as well if not, better than the last time around.
For the love of god, put a space between sentences. I'm not sure how anyone can rank Koloamatangi above Latu, even now. Latu if he had stayed in New Zealand could have potentially earned himself one or two All Blacks caps, and almost certainly would have made the Jr All Blacks. Koloamatangi looks promosing, but he isn't really proven to be a real game breaker. You mentioned how good he was for Counties but he certainly hasn't acheived what Latu did for the Chiefs or Canes (and he would have likely got more time for the Canes had Masoe, Collins and So'oialo all been around then, and stated when the former two were rested.
Tonga will just have to do without, all because he stood up for the players. I don't understand how the board can be so stubborn though. Its not a given Tonga will beat Canada or Japan (I think its been 4 yrs since Tonga beat Japan) and they need to win those games. Winning those games means more funding from the IRB. I am hoping Tonga can win those games and then give France a good run as they did to the Springboks and to a lesser extent England.
Side note Bay Of Plenty have signed Jamie Nutbrown for this yrs ITM Cup because they were not sure where Taniela Moa stood with Tonga. Bay Of Plenty also said that players can be included into any squad 32 days before the World Cup. Im hoping a few names including Moa's get included in Tonga's World Cup squad.
Side note Bay Of Plenty have signed Jamie Nutbrown for this yrs ITM Cup because they were not sure where Taniela Moa stood with Tonga. Bay Of Plenty also said that players can be included into any squad 32 days before the World Cup. Im hoping a few names including Moa's get included in Tonga's World Cup squad.
You dont stand up for your players by putting a gun to the head of the authorities!The IRB threatened Tonga with expulsion from ALL world rugby because of the non-accountability of IRB funding.That is why the Tongan government became involved and we have the Tongan Rugby Authority until February 2012.Bob Tuckey,currently in charge,is an ex IRB vice-president.
Of course beating Japan and Canada is not a given but its a strong possibility-assuming Tonga has all its players available.The last game against Japan in Samoa,Their forward pack was sub-standard-Tongahuia,Filise etc will offer a greater platform for their backs.Remember Tonga scored the most points in the PNC despite this.EVery game was close so there is plenty of room for improvement.
Isotolo Maka has openly said on Radio 531pi in Auckland that Moa is out of the frame.Unless Maka has a drastic change of heart,Moa wont be there.Mind you nothing would surprise when you know that some of the players in the 50-man RWC squad published had not even been approached beforehand!
Of course beating Japan and Canada is not a given but its a strong possibility-assuming Tonga has all its players available.The last game against Japan in Samoa,Their forward pack was sub-standard-Tongahuia,Filise etc will offer a greater platform for their backs.Remember Tonga scored the most points in the PNC despite this.EVery game was close so there is plenty of room for improvement.
Isotolo Maka has openly said on Radio 531pi in Auckland that Moa is out of the frame.Unless Maka has a drastic change of heart,Moa wont be there.Mind you nothing would surprise when you know that some of the players in the 50-man RWC squad published had not even been approached beforehand!
A gun to the head of authorities has to be exaggerating just a little bit 
Anyways players werent given any money so the Tongan Rugby Board would be to blame for the unaccounted funds, NOT LATU.
I have alot of respect for Isitolo Maka as a player, But all these personal issues with players will end up hurting Tonga. Why has Moa been ruled out ? Moa was with the team last year and all of a sudden left.
Isitolo Maka or The Tongan Rugby Board seem to ban quality players who WANT to play for Tonga and instead select players who either dont want to (Pakalani and Vuna) or are not sure (Timani). You wonder why Fiji and Samoa have left Tonga behind when all 3 Islands started out with the same opportunity.
Anyways players werent given any money so the Tongan Rugby Board would be to blame for the unaccounted funds, NOT LATU. I have alot of respect for Isitolo Maka as a player, But all these personal issues with players will end up hurting Tonga. Why has Moa been ruled out ? Moa was with the team last year and all of a sudden left.
Isitolo Maka or The Tongan Rugby Board seem to ban quality players who WANT to play for Tonga and instead select players who either dont want to (Pakalani and Vuna) or are not sure (Timani). You wonder why Fiji and Samoa have left Tonga behind when all 3 Islands started out with the same opportunity.
Moa went up to Tonga for the Pacific Nations Cup-went home apparently sick.Coaches subsequently found out he went to some rugby tournament in Hawaii instead.Doesnt that attitude just want the coaches to pick and rely on you!
Latu had nothing to do with the unaccounted for funds.Telling the coach you wont play because of payment issues just before a game starts is not going to endear you to anyone!
Tonga rugby has a recent history of factional infighting.Thats why the IRB and government stepped in.Many players want to play for Tonga but Southern Hemisphere players then risk their Super 15 contracts.You cant blame them for that as Tonga doesnt pay much.Thats why the majority of their players ply their trade in Europe and Japan.
Of most interest is who is fronting up in the Churchill Cup in England in June.That will reveal more.
Latu had nothing to do with the unaccounted for funds.Telling the coach you wont play because of payment issues just before a game starts is not going to endear you to anyone!
Tonga rugby has a recent history of factional infighting.Thats why the IRB and government stepped in.Many players want to play for Tonga but Southern Hemisphere players then risk their Super 15 contracts.You cant blame them for that as Tonga doesnt pay much.Thats why the majority of their players ply their trade in Europe and Japan.
Of most interest is who is fronting up in the Churchill Cup in England in June.That will reveal more.
Dissapointing Tonga hasnt gone into camp yet. The squad named looks strong enough to win it. Vili Iongi will not be going im pretty sure hes making more money playing club rugby and being apart of the Brumbies set up.
What camp-Tongan players get to England late on 2 June and a team with new players is expected to play USA on 8 June.USA will already have played England Saxons.Its always hard for Tonga to get a proper prep done.At least they will have a reasonable camp before the World Cup.
AfakasiAssasin
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Taking into consideration eligibility issues and contractual obligations I think this would be a reasonable for what the Tongan team may look like come world cup.
1 Tonga'huia
2 Taukafa
3 Pulu/Taumololo
4 Fa'aoso
5 Hehea
6 Mafi
7 Koloamatangi
8 Maka
9 D Morath
10 K Morath
11 Helu
12 Mailei
13 Fatafehi
14 Malupo
15 Lilo
16 Telefoni
17 Lea'aetoa/Filise
18 Kauhenga
19 Kalamafoni/Afu/Vahafolau
20 Fisilau/Havea/Paea
21 H Tonga'huia
22 Taufua
1 Tonga'huia
2 Taukafa
3 Pulu/Taumololo
4 Fa'aoso
5 Hehea
6 Mafi
7 Koloamatangi
8 Maka
9 D Morath
10 K Morath
11 Helu
12 Mailei
13 Fatafehi
14 Malupo
15 Lilo
16 Telefoni
17 Lea'aetoa/Filise
18 Kauhenga
19 Kalamafoni/Afu/Vahafolau
20 Fisilau/Havea/Paea
21 H Tonga'huia
22 Taufua
Thats what im saying its DISSAPOINTING they havnt gone into camp yet. I think Canada has been in camp for a week now. Guess having these games will be great for Tongas PNC chances. Japans getting good game time though. Fiji and Samoa playing play top teams like the All Blacks and Wallabies respectively, which would be preperations than any. Good luck to the boys , interesting to see if Telefoni shows up I reckon hes the goods.
