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Transfers 2015/16

http://www.edinburghrugby.org/news/15/04/21/fowles-and-toolis-commit-capital-club

Nathan Fowles ----> Edinburgh


Really crappy news. We have a tendency to lose whoever we send out on loan - think that Will Cliff is the only one that ever came back from elsewhere.
Desperately need to sign a 9 for next season, now. It was always the plan for Fowles to take Cliff's place, with him potentially becoming first choice sooner rather than later. Now this....
 
http://www.edinburghrugby.org/news/15/04/21/fowles-and-toolis-commit-capital-club

Nathan Fowles ----> Edinburgh


Really crappy news. We have a tendency to lose whoever we send out on loan - think that Will Cliff is the only one that ever came back from elsewhere.
Desperately need to sign a 9 for next season, now. It was always the plan for Fowles to take Cliff's place, with him potentially becoming first choice sooner rather than later. Now this....
Well i would say that Edinburgh did make a good signing with Grayson Hart going i can understand you need a scrum half as im sure Chris Cusiter will be retiring soon.
 
Grenoble pay their players only slight more than Leinster, so I don't see how their can be 20 teams who would outspend them for Irish talent given the fact most French teams still prioritise French + SH talent ahead of other European talent.

As I say Irish system different and it kind of obvious you not aware of it. Mike Prendergast is a buddy and I know for fact Grenoble can blow Munster budget away. And Leinsters is same as us. So nothing slight about it. They may prioritise French and SH talent but don't pay little. Also they only fail to attract Irish and English players really but it certainly doesn't stop Irish guys using the French clubs in negotiations.
And just on top I said there is around 20 clubs in France with bigger wage budgets no solely for Irish but for any players. The evidence for this is shown clear in many situations.
 
Brad Barritt resigns with Sarries:

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Breaking News: <a href="https://twitter.com/bradbarritt">@bradbarritt</a> pledges his future to <a href="https://twitter.com/Saracens">@Saracens</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/BarrittSigns?src=hash">#BarrittSigns</a> <a href="http://t.co/5avu4wWeqt">http://t.co/5avu4wWeqt</a> <a href="http://t.co/kQdLmNDvoI">pic.twitter.com/kQdLmNDvoI</a></p>&mdash; Saracens Rugby Club (@Saracens) <a href="https://twitter.com/Saracens/status/590844069506654209">April 22, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
Brad Barritt resigns with Sarries:

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Breaking News: <a href="https://twitter.com/bradbarritt">@bradbarritt</a> pledges his future to <a href="https://twitter.com/Saracens">@Saracens</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/BarrittSigns?src=hash">#BarrittSigns</a> <a href="http://t.co/5avu4wWeqt">http://t.co/5avu4wWeqt</a> <a href="http://t.co/kQdLmNDvoI">pic.twitter.com/kQdLmNDvoI</a></p>â€" Saracens Rugby Club (@Saracens) <a href="https://twitter.com/Saracens/status/590844069506654209">April 22, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
He's a good player for them and is much of the reason why they are such a good defensive unit- I hope they can get hold of a nippy OC to compliment him (ie. not Bosch)
 
As I say Irish system different and it kind of obvious you not aware of it. Mike Prendergast is a buddy and I know for fact Grenoble can blow Munster budget away. And Leinsters is same as us. So nothing slight about it. They may prioritise French and SH talent but don't pay little. Also they only fail to attract Irish and English players really but it certainly doesn't stop Irish guys using the French clubs in negotiations.
And just on top I said there is around 20 clubs in France with bigger wage budgets no solely for Irish but for any players. The evidence for this is shown clear in many situations.
http://www.sportsjoe.ie/rugby/toulons-leinster-champions-cup-wages/21019
This claims Leinster's wage bill is over €10 million, is it not accurate then?
 
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"Even the team with the lowest wage bill - thought to be Bernard Jackman's Grenoble - now pay out €14m a year, up from €2.2m a decade ago." Am I missing something? I'd imagine that figure is going up for Grenoble.

So if the lowest of the top 14 is around 14 million, you think there are 6 teams spending about that in the division lower in France in order to overspend Leinster? Also as I said factoring in that Leinster will naturally be spending most of their money on Irish players vs Grenoble not wanting to - apart from James Hart which is different circumstance that makes it a rather false point to say that there are 20 French teams who would outspend Irish teams for Irish talent.

Still this argument is going nowhere, I could well be wrong and the new English money have no impact on Irish players but I think we will start seeing top Irish starters playing abroad in the next 5 years.
 
6 is probably too many, but Biarritz and Perpignan are both spending 11m euros according to wiki.
 
Not sure any of that changes my original posit. Anyway I do accept you lot know Irish funding a lot more than me, and no way it is going to be solved here. Happy to concede it for now though, that if an Irish team wanted to keep a legitimate Irish superstar I doubt they ever leave again.
 
Before any goes ape about the French wages at French rugby clubs there is a Salary cap of 10 million Euros which is policed very strictly by the DNACG. Here is an article in English explaining fairly well the whole affair. many people often confuse the budgets and Salaries

<article class="post-42028 post type-post status-publish format-standard has-post-thumbnail hentry category-france-countries tag-france tag-highlight tag-racing-metro tag-top-14 tag-toulon single featured-image" role="article" itemscope="" itemtype="http://schema.org/Article"><header class="page-header">[h=1]Top 14: Finances and the salary cap are strongly policed in France[/h]
Share2 Tweet22 2 0 Share545
</header> Contrary to what some may think, the Top 14 salary cap is rigorously policed and hefty punishments await those who transgress. Nonetheless, that doesn't prevent some French clubs finding innovative ways to reward their very best players. Gavin Mortimer reports.
image: http://keyassets.timeincuk.net/insp...uploads/sites/7/2015/01/457850188-630x407.jpg
457850188-630x407.jpg
Star power: Toulon have plenty of big names, but their finances are surprisingly stable


Among the less interesting pages on the official France Federation website is one entitled 'DNACG'. I don't recommend a visit, not unless you're an insomniac. Let me explain. DNACG stands for Direction Nationale d'Aide et de Contrôle de Gestion and, as one French newspaper recently put it, it's the "financial gendarme of professional rugby". In other words, the DNACG's job is to police the finances of the 30 professional French clubs (the Top 14 and the 16 clubs that comprise the Pro D2). The DNACG is managed by both the FFR and the LNR but answers ultimately to the former.
Why is this relevant? To allay suspicions in some quarters that French clubs have a somewhat laissez-aller attitude when it comes to finance, in particular staying within the €10m salary cap.
Nothing could be further from the truth. As any ex-pat who has lived in France will tell you, the French do many things well – cheese, wine and long lunches – but possibly what they excel in most is bureaucracy. Red Tape is an art form in France, and that applies to their rugby.
The DNACG's code of practice, as published on the LNR's website, runs to 24 pages and contains enough clauses and articles to bore all but the most stoic to tears. To cut a long story short: the DNACG has the power to scrutinise the accounts of all 30 clubs whenever it sees fit, and punish accordingly with fines up to a maximum of €2m. And they do.
image: [url]https://keyassets.timeincuk.net/inspirewp/live/wp-content/uploads/sites/7/2015/01/97387289-574x450.jpg
97387289-574x450.jpg
[/URL]Knocked back: Montauban were relegated for financial malpractice in 2010

The DNACG isn't a toothless body. If it sees financial irregularities it will act. Just ask Grenoble, Bourgoin and Montauban, all of whom have been relegated from the Top 14 in the last decade as punishment for failing to balance their books.
More recently, in the summer of 2013, the DNACG expelled Carcassonne from Pro D2 to Federale 1 (although the club was later reinstated by the FFR after they raised sufficient funds) and also suspended the contracts of four Biarritz and five Perpignan players until they were satisfied the clubs had the finances to fund them. Last season the DNACG dished out heavy fines to Perpignan, Albi, Beziers and Carcassonne and also threatened them with a points reduction if they didn't get their accounts in order.
"The DNACG has a great deal of power," explains Jerome Riondet, the former Harlequins and Grenoble three-quarter, and now a rugby consultant for beIN Sports. "Before each season the clubs present their provisional budgets to the DNACG. Let's say a club gives itself a €20m budget based on money from TV rights and anticipated income from sponsors and also a contribution from the regional council. The TV rights money is the only guaranteed income so if for whatever reason the money from the sponsors and regional council doesn't all come through there will be a discrepancy in their accounts from their initial budget. If that happens, the DNACG – who can check a club's budget at any time during a season – will punish them."
<aside class="row"> <section id="ipc-advert-id-6" class="widget ipc-advert-class"></section>
</aside> It's a similar story with the salary cap. Snide comments from across the Channel, in England, that the French ignore the €10m cap imposed by the LNR are dismissed by Riondet. "The clubs definitely respect the cap," he says.
image: [url]https://keyassets.timeincuk.net/inspirewp/live/wp-content/uploads/sites/7/2014/12/Dan-Carter-630x420.jpg
Dan-Carter-630x420.jpg
[/URL]So long: Dan Carter and NZ CEO Steve Tew say early goodbyes as Carter's departure was announced

But while the clubs must stay within the law, there's nothing that says they can't show a little innovation. Midi Olympique reported last month that Dan Carter's salary when he joins Racing Metro after the World Cup will be around €500,000; but on top of that it is alleged the All Blacks fly-half will receive a similar sum from his image rights including an estimated €300,000 from the operating company of Arena 92, Racing's new home from 2016 that will also host concerts and business conferences.
It's a strategy long employed by Mourad Boudjellal, the canny president of Toulon, who has made no secret of the fact the club has been imaginative in ensuring its top players receive the sort of sums they deserve for their talent. In an interview last season he explained that Toulon's total wage bill was €8.55m – well within the €10m salary cap – but that nonetheless a star such as Jonny Wilkinson earned income on top of his salary.
"We've created with him a commercial enterprise of products branded '10'," said Boudjellal. "This enterprise, based in France, generates a real turnover on the back of the sales of hats, t-shirts, polo (shirts), etc…should the proceeds from these sales be included in calculating the player's salary? I don't believe so."
Boudjellal – who no longer puts his own money into the club – also dismissed as "fantasy" the rumour that some of the foreign players at Toulon had money paid into bank accounts in Jersey, telling Midi Olympique: "The chief of the DNACG spent two days in Toulon and had nothing to say about our (financial) management."
Jerome Riondet believes Toulon's business model, which is based on a wide network of sponsors and commercial partners, is the most stable of all Top 14 clubs. That's not what many wish to hear, those who regard Toulon as rugby's bête noire. But doesn't success often breed envy?


<footer></footer> </article>
<aside class="secondary col-xs-12 col-md-4 col-lg-6"> <section id="ipc-advert-id-4" class="widget ipc-advert-class"></section><section id="keystone_outbrain_widget-1" class="widget keystone_outbrain_widget-class"> </section><section id="keystone-query-widget-id-7" class="palette-a widget keystone-query-widget">[h=1]Latest Issue[/h] <article class="post-44451 issue type-issue status-publish has-post-thumbnail hentry loop featured-image" role="article"> <header class="entry-header"> [h=2]May 2015[/h] </header> image: [url]http://keyassets.timeincuk.net/inspirewp/live/wp-content/uploads/sites/7/2015/04/CoverGifFmay151.gif
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[/URL]
Find out what's inside the May 2015 issue of Rugby World

<footer> </footer> </article>

</section>

</aside>
Read more at http://www.rugbyworld.com/countries...ngly-policed-france-42028#V7XMG0rVPZs76wyM.99
 
Before any goes ape about the French wages at French rugby clubs there is a Salary cap of 10 million Euros which is policed very strictly by the DNACG. Here is an article in English explaining fairly well the whole affair. many people often confuse the budgets and Salaries

<article class="post-42028 post type-post status-publish format-standard has-post-thumbnail hentry category-france-countries tag-france tag-highlight tag-racing-metro tag-top-14 tag-toulon single featured-image" role="article" itemscope="" itemtype="http://schema.org/Article"><header class="page-header">Top 14: Finances and the salary cap are strongly policed in France


Share2 Tweet22 2 0 Share545
</header> Contrary to what some may think, the Top 14 salary cap is rigorously policed and hefty punishments await those who transgress. Nonetheless, that doesn't prevent some French clubs finding innovative ways to reward their very best players. Gavin Mortimer reports.
image: http://keyassets.timeincuk.net/insp...uploads/sites/7/2015/01/457850188-630x407.jpg
457850188-630x407.jpg
Star power: Toulon have plenty of big names, but their finances are surprisingly stable


Among the less interesting pages on the official France Federation website is one entitled 'DNACG'. I don't recommend a visit, not unless you're an insomniac. Let me explain. DNACG stands for Direction Nationale d'Aide et de Contrôle de Gestion and, as one French newspaper recently put it, it's the "financial gendarme of professional rugby". In other words, the DNACG's job is to police the finances of the 30 professional French clubs (the Top 14 and the 16 clubs that comprise the Pro D2). The DNACG is managed by both the FFR and the LNR but answers ultimately to the former.
Why is this relevant? To allay suspicions in some quarters that French clubs have a somewhat laissez-aller attitude when it comes to finance, in particular staying within the €10m salary cap.
Nothing could be further from the truth. As any ex-pat who has lived in France will tell you, the French do many things well – cheese, wine and long lunches – but possibly what they excel in most is bureaucracy. Red Tape is an art form in France, and that applies to their rugby.
The DNACG's code of practice, as published on the LNR's website, runs to 24 pages and contains enough clauses and articles to bore all but the most stoic to tears. To cut a long story short: the DNACG has the power to scrutinise the accounts of all 30 clubs whenever it sees fit, and punish accordingly with fines up to a maximum of €2m. And they do.
image: https://keyassets.timeincuk.net/ins.../uploads/sites/7/2015/01/97387289-574x450.jpg
97387289-574x450.jpg
Knocked back: Montauban were relegated for financial malpractice in 2010

The DNACG isn't a toothless body. If it sees financial irregularities it will act. Just ask Grenoble, Bourgoin and Montauban, all of whom have been relegated from the Top 14 in the last decade as punishment for failing to balance their books.
More recently, in the summer of 2013, the DNACG expelled Carcassonne from Pro D2 to Federale 1 (although the club was later reinstated by the FFR after they raised sufficient funds) and also suspended the contracts of four Biarritz and five Perpignan players until they were satisfied the clubs had the finances to fund them. Last season the DNACG dished out heavy fines to Perpignan, Albi, Beziers and Carcassonne and also threatened them with a points reduction if they didn't get their accounts in order.
"The DNACG has a great deal of power," explains Jerome Riondet, the former Harlequins and Grenoble three-quarter, and now a rugby consultant for beIN Sports. "Before each season the clubs present their provisional budgets to the DNACG. Let's say a club gives itself a €20m budget based on money from TV rights and anticipated income from sponsors and also a contribution from the regional council. The TV rights money is the only guaranteed income so if for whatever reason the money from the sponsors and regional council doesn't all come through there will be a discrepancy in their accounts from their initial budget. If that happens, the DNACG – who can check a club's budget at any time during a season – will punish them."
<aside class="row"> <section id="ipc-advert-id-6" class="widget ipc-advert-class"></section>
</aside> It's a similar story with the salary cap. Snide comments from across the Channel, in England, that the French ignore the €10m cap imposed by the LNR are dismissed by Riondet. "The clubs definitely respect the cap," he says.
image: https://keyassets.timeincuk.net/ins...ploads/sites/7/2014/12/Dan-Carter-630x420.jpg
Dan-Carter-630x420.jpg
So long: Dan Carter and NZ CEO Steve Tew say early goodbyes as Carter's departure was announced

But while the clubs must stay within the law, there's nothing that says they can't show a little innovation. Midi Olympique reported last month that Dan Carter's salary when he joins Racing Metro after the World Cup will be around €500,000; but on top of that it is alleged the All Blacks fly-half will receive a similar sum from his image rights including an estimated €300,000 from the operating company of Arena 92, Racing's new home from 2016 that will also host concerts and business conferences.
It's a strategy long employed by Mourad Boudjellal, the canny president of Toulon, who has made no secret of the fact the club has been imaginative in ensuring its top players receive the sort of sums they deserve for their talent. In an interview last season he explained that Toulon's total wage bill was €8.55m – well within the €10m salary cap – but that nonetheless a star such as Jonny Wilkinson earned income on top of his salary.
"We've created with him a commercial enterprise of products branded '10'," said Boudjellal. "This enterprise, based in France, generates a real turnover on the back of the sales of hats, t-shirts, polo (shirts), etc…should the proceeds from these sales be included in calculating the player's salary? I don't believe so."
Boudjellal – who no longer puts his own money into the club – also dismissed as "fantasy" the rumour that some of the foreign players at Toulon had money paid into bank accounts in Jersey, telling Midi Olympique: "The chief of the DNACG spent two days in Toulon and had nothing to say about our (financial) management."
Jerome Riondet believes Toulon's business model, which is based on a wide network of sponsors and commercial partners, is the most stable of all Top 14 clubs. That's not what many wish to hear, those who regard Toulon as rugby's bête noire. But doesn't success often breed envy?


<footer></footer> </article>
<aside class="secondary col-xs-12 col-md-4 col-lg-6"> <section id="ipc-advert-id-4" class="widget ipc-advert-class"></section><section id="keystone_outbrain_widget-1" class="widget keystone_outbrain_widget-class"> </section><section id="keystone-query-widget-id-7" class="palette-a widget keystone-query-widget">Latest Issue

<article class="post-44451 issue type-issue status-publish has-post-thumbnail hentry loop featured-image" role="article"> <header class="entry-header"> May 2015

</header> image: http://keyassets.timeincuk.net/inspirewp/live/wp-content/uploads/sites/7/2015/04/CoverGifFmay151.gif
CoverGifFmay151.gif

Find out what's inside the May 2015 issue of Rugby World

<footer> </footer> </article>

</section>

</aside>
Read more at http://www.rugbyworld.com/countries...ngly-policed-france-42028#V7XMG0rVPZs76wyM.99
I don't think anyone's going ape. Just stating financial facts and discussing the likelihood of more Irish guys going abroad young to make money.
 
Apparently looking to qualify for Scotland.
Well with some off the big centre's in Scotland like Alex Dunbar, Matt Scott and Mark Bennett all in risk off missing the world cup he could be useful but is he any good ? never actually watched him.

But it does sound like another good Edinburgh Signing hopefully Glasgow can make some good signing's too. If what you said was true how does he qualify ?, was he born in Scotland or Scottish parents ?
 
http://www.sportsjoe.ie/rugby/toulons-leinster-champions-cup-wages/21019
This claims Leinster's wage bill is over €10 million, is it not accurate then?

I can guarantee now Leinster are not spending €10m. It's no secret they don't have major funds (like the rest of us) and that's part of reason Kirchner was resigned as he is a cheap option. Nacewa is a superb player but again is signed cheaply and out of a 2 year retirement. @Groundhog. Pau are certainly on more and as I said earlier the deal Coughlan is on there is much more than he was ever on in Munster. As I said though people have to fully realise the way it works here with central contract and now "backers" can come in if IRFU allow. Sexton is on a huge contract and some of it is paid through private funding.

- - - Updated - - -

That €10million is only "paper talk" as there is absolutely no way of backing up who's payed what via central contract or provincial. But I can guarantee media add on a bit and well if you factor in this. The average provincial player here is on anywhere between €40-60k per year. The same type of player in England is on anything north of £90k in UK and higher in France.
 
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Fair enough, I understand it gets murky with central contracts and boards helping with individual players. I was basing my comments on Leinster spending that amount as I found that source on an Irish site. I honestly see a lot of boards doing what the Aussies have done recently soon though. That or boards are going to need to find additional revenues because whilst the top tier superstars are going to be looked after there comes a point where players are going to feel massively undervalued if the board is sweetening their teammates deal and not theirs.

- - - Updated - - -

Well with some off the big centre's in Scotland like Alex Dunbar, Matt Scott and Mark Bennett all in risk off missing the world cup he could be useful but is he any good ? never actually watched him.

But it does sound like another good Edinburgh Signing hopefully Glasgow can make some good signing's too. If what you said was true how does he qualify ?, was he born in Scotland or Scottish parents ?

Be a shame for Scotland to lose Dunbar and particularly Bennett. Genuine bright spots I thought during 6NS. Would also question whether they have depth to replace many injuries.
 
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