The Leinster thread

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

I don't think you've fully understood what I've said.

I fully understand I just have a difference point of view! Leinster still have 8 props before adding Sean McCarthy. Moore had next to no senior experience until this season (5 sub appearances to be exact). He benched in last years B&I Cup final. He's now an international. Furlong had no senior experience until this season and he's stood up well.

While I don't subscribe to the theory that giving any developing prop game time automatically helps them improve, I do believe it's okay to give a shot to somebody who has shown a large amount of talent coming up the ranks. Byrne and Dooley have shown that talent. If they can't be trusted as subs in 6 or 7 Pro 12 games while the internationals are on duty, when can they be trusted? If they have to step up and start, so be it.

Just to repeat, I've absolutely nothing against Sean McCarthy and really wish him well in his move. It's a great opportunity for him and I hope he seizes it. However I firmly believe that at a time when Leinster have to be smart with their money due to ever increasing financial clout of English and French clubs, the money could have been better spent elsewhere.

 

[big ginger 8]

I fully understand I just have a difference point of view! Leinster still have 8 props before adding Sean McCarthy. Moore had next to no senior experience until this season (5 sub appearances to be exact). He benched in last years B&I Cup final. He's now an international. Furlong had no senior experience until this season and he's stood up well.

While I don't subscribe to the theory that giving any developing prop game time automatically helps them improve, I do believe it's okay to give a shot to somebody who has shown a large amount of talent coming up the ranks. Byrne and Dooley have shown that talent. If they can't be trusted as subs in 6 or 7 Pro 12 games while the internationals are on duty, when can they be trusted? If they have to step up and start, so be it.

Just to repeat, I've absolutely nothing against Sean McCarthy and really wish him well in his move. It's a great opportunity for him and I hope he seizes it. However I firmly believe that at a time when Leinster have to be smart with their money due to ever increasing financial clout of English and French clubs, the money could have been better spent elsewhere.

But you're ignoring my main point. Leinster barely got away with 8 props this year Furlong got injured basically the second the internationals returned. I'm not saying he should be ahead of anyone! One injury to a prop in the 6N and we have to forfeit because of the whole needing 4 props thing. This year we had two looseheads on the bench for at least two games counting on switching Bent mid match which is a really precarious position. He's IQ and I doubt on big money at all so far someone so far down the pecking order he's a decent signing and an important one in terms of logistics.

8 props is grand for most teams but as we lose half of them for the 6N and probably stricter protocols with the WC coming up we need 9 props is my basic point.

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

Once again, I fully understand your point but I have a different point of view! I think 8 props is enough, you don't. Who is to say Leinster will have 4 props in every international squad? 12 months ago nobody would have thought Jack McGrath and Martin Moore would be there. I never said you thought McCarthy should be ahead of anyone. It's my belief that they aren't bringing in a 23 year old prop from outside the province to sit behind a couple of academy players.

Leinster wouldn't run short of props at any point with 8 of them in the squad. They're unbelievably well stocked. If there was a freak crisis, they'd do what they did in 2010/11 and go to the AIL or abroad for an emergency signing (Simon Shawe, Ben Prescott, Clint Newland). There'd be no forfeiting games.

 

[Feicarsinn]

It does seem to be a peculiar signing. O'Connell left because he wasn't getting any game time. If he's not getting on the field enough then surely there's no need to replace him.

 

[Peat]

If Leinster aren't planning around the possibility of providing two full front rows to every international, then they are being absolutely idiotic. Based on the previous year, they are one injury to Rory Best away from it happening. Deccie Fitzpatrick's heart palpitations narrow the competition for the tighthead slots down to Stephen Archer, so barring an incredible turnaround that one is a given. Big improvements from Mike Sherry and Rob Herring could see them advanced up the international pecking order but you wouldn't place money on it. Loosehead is a bit more of a contest, Munster have two good 'uns, but its established they've got to improve to overtake. All four Leinster frontline props being unavailable for international periods isn't possible, its probable.

 

[munstermuffin]

My views would be like Snoop. If internationals are on duty then that's when academy should be used as majority of time it's against opposition in a similar situation. It's safe to say at at max they'll have 6 front row BUT it's very realistic that they may only have 4 too as 1 slot at LH prop and 1 slot at Hooker are wide open. Now in the rare chance all 6 are gone that is when you test academy.
Recent examples at Munster in similar scenarios (mixed with injuries). Mick Sherry, Duncan Casey, James Cronin and John Ryan. The first 3 would certainly be good enough to go to an international camp and not look out of place. That's how you find guys. Get Sla for Munster is an AIL player. Has came on this year scored tries but looks perfect, same with Gerry Holland at 9. That should be the way it runs and been honest it's a waste of their salary allowance when in the case of emergency you could've dipped in to AIL for virtually nothing.

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

FORMER AUSTRALIA INTERNATIONAL Marco Caputo looks set to join Leinster in the role of scrum coach.........

More at this link:
http://thescore.thejournal.ie/marco-caputo-leinster-scrum-coach-1458273-May2014/

 

[Feicarsinn]

Big shoes to fill. Feek turned the Leinster scrum into a real weapon. I know nothing of yer man Caputo, but given our current front row resources things should be fine as long as he's not utterly incompetent.

 

[big ginger 8]

Been a bit overshadowed by the other fella but Leo was a true Leinster legend. He's been poor this season but was an incredibly underrated player. That he has only 32 caps and most of them off the bench for short cameos (including the infamous 6 second cap) is a travesty. Of course we was blocked by some talented players but at times it was the usual stick with who we have and playing in England didn't help. He was never overly athletic (even if he did start off at 8) but his intelligence more than made up for it. Him and Hines in the row together must have been hell for the opposition. The amount of cheating they got up to. His running of a lineout was often exemplary and his hands were surprisingly good. However I'd say his leadership was his best attribute. There was no better man to replace BO'D as Leinster captain. Looking at his record coming up he was always a captain. From everything I've heard from players speaking or writing about him and the way he conducted himself off the pitch he was truly incredible in this aspect. To me the way he always lifted the trophy with someone else was really showing it. His honour roll is ridiculous:

Heineken Cup winner 2009, 2011, 2012, runner-up 2007
Amlin Challenge Cup winner 2013
Celtic League winner 2002, 2008, 2013, runner-up 2010, 2011, 2012
Premiership winner 2007, runner-up 2006
Anglo-Welsh Cup winner 2007


On a sidenote I saw that Heaslip has not been subbed once this season and has over 2000 minutes. That is simply ridiculous and testament to his professionalism.

 

[munstermuffin]

Been a bit overshadowed by the other fella but Leo was a true Leinster legend. He's been poor this season but was an incredibly underrated player. That he has only 32 caps and most of them off the bench for short cameos (including the infamous 6 second cap) is a travesty. Of course we was blocked by some talented players but at times it was the usual stick with who we have and playing in England didn't help. He was never overly athletic (even if he did start off at 8) but his intelligence more than made up for it. Him and Hines in the row together must have been hell for the opposition. The amount of cheating they got up to. His running of a lineout was often exemplary and his hands were surprisingly good. However I'd say his leadership was his best attribute. There was no better man to replace BO'D as Leinster captain. Looking at his record coming up he was always a captain. From everything I've heard from players speaking or writing about him and the way he conducted himself off the pitch he was truly incredible in this aspect. To me the way he always lifted the trophy with someone else was really showing it. His honour roll is ridiculous:

Heineken Cup winner 2009, 2011, 2012, runner-up 2007
Amlin Challenge Cup winner 2013
Celtic League winner 2002, 2008, 2013, runner-up 2010, 2011, 2012
Premiership winner 2007, runner-up 2006
Anglo-Welsh Cup winner 2007


On a sidenote I saw that Heaslip has not been subbed once this season and has over 2000 minutes. That is simply ridiculous and testament to his professionalism.

Calling it straight and fair he's probably stayed on a season too long. But he's been a pure prick in a good sense of rugby. Excellent in the dark arts and well while I credit Leinster with a lot of that Leicester deserve great credit too. Will be interesting to see how his new gig as coach goes but certainly a fine member who was a lot of times an unsung hero due to the bigger names but always a thorn in side doing dirty work that made the way for headliners get the headlines

 

[big ginger 8]

So with the JWRC over the academy should be announced soon. The names I've heard are Timmins, McCarthy, Ringrose, Kelleher and Brewer definitely as well as possibly Heffernan and strangely Fitzpatrick. I also know Trenier had an offer from Leinster but he also had one from Ulster so we'll see there.

In terms of players straight from school I haven't heard any names for definite but I'd be guessing Loughman, O'Donoghue and Power are the most likely.

 

[munstermuffin]

So with the JWRC over the academy should be announced soon. The names I've heard are Timmins, McCarthy, Ringrose, Kelleher and Brewer definitely as well as possibly Heffernan and strangely Fitzpatrick. I also know Trenier had an offer from Leinster but he also had one from Ulster so we'll see there.

In terms of players straight from school I haven't heard any names for definite but I'd be guessing Loughman, O'Donoghue and Power are the most likely.

How many will go in at year 1. No more than 7/8 I'd guess.

 

[big ginger 8]

Ladies and Gentleman your Leinster team:

[video=youtube_share;o1tj2zJ2Wvg]http://youtu.be/o1tj2zJ2Wvg[/video]




Interesting team with essentially a backrow of 7's. For anyone who hasn't seen the Northampton team we're very much up against it. It turned out ok last year but this could get ugly.

 

[Feicarsinn]

Yeah, we're ****ed. That bench is amateur.

Hope SCM plays well. I'm hoping he's going to have a big season. Would also like to see Billy Dardis have a good game. It might be a year too early for him, but you never know with backs and we're not exactly flushed with options in the back three.

Shame Boss is still inexplicably preferred to McGrath.

 

[Peat]

That there is a Leinster A team...

 

[Feicarsinn]

If anyone is wonder where Cian Healy is in that team, well he's a little preoccupied with the pop career at the moment.

 

[munstermuffin]

Yeah, we're ****ed. That bench is amateur.

Hope SCM plays well. I'm hoping he's going to have a big season. Would also like to see Billy Dardis have a good game. It might be a year too early for him, but you never know with backs and we're not exactly flushed with options in the back three.

Shame Boss is still inexplicably preferred to McGrath.

Agree with all this. I'm huge fan of Dardis and he's the makings of a future international. Is SCM a wing or centre or what they doing with him.
As for Boss I'm annoyed as I think McGrath would be starter for Leinster in next year if his progress wasn't being held up. We were mad for him down here to be backing up Murray and being main half back when internationals were away.

Ye are like us vs Glaws tomorrow but simply put I know some young guys will prove a point and another option or 2 be discovered.

 

[Feicarsinn]

SCM is a winger.

 

[Draggs]

That Leinster 19:

 

[munstermuffin]

SCM is a winger.

But weren't they moving him around a few games last year in A he played at 12 I think it was or certainly moved in there early