[Six Nations 2018] Round 3: Ireland vs Wales (24/02/2018)

[Leinster Fan]

I heard Schmidt after the game blaming new partnerships for our defensive frailty but i'm not having it. Farrell did nothing wrong as a 13 in the game. He didn't make poor reads and he was connected to the defence on the inside at all times. Us defending too narrow is a systemic issue and stems from our new, aggressive line speed. We're coming up hard and freezing before making the tackle. The Welsh midfielders had ample time to pick us off.

Also, our lack of creativity in the midfield has nothing to do personnel either. Since when have our midfield ever carved up teams? Henshaw on the crash ball and Ringrose maybe sniffs a gap in broken field. Thats our lot. If Sextons not involved players won't be put into space off brilliant play. Also, I'd argue Farrell is the best midfield passer we have so.....

I'm sorry but this just isn't true. If you look at Evans' try the primary blame is with McFadden but there is an obvious lack of communicating between the centres and the wings as you'd expect from a bunch of players who've never played together before. This isn't blaming Farrell but it's an obvious fact that a new player in a position as exposed as 13 will struggle to perfectly communicate with wingers he's never played with before. New combos always struggle regardless of how good the players are. The Lions show this consistently every four years.

The lack of creativity in attack has everything to do with our centres. It's not about cutting the opposition up, we don't have BOD and D'Arcy anymore however much I wish we did. It's about having centres that feel comfortable attacking and coming onto the ball and passing it wide. It's no coincidence that all of the quality service Earls and Stockdale got today came directly from Murray and Sexton. Ringrose is that, Aki on the evidence of the 6N so far, isn't. If we think we can be serious competitors at Japan without centres who are capable of creating breaks and opportunities without relying on our halfbacks we're going to be in for a very rude awakening. Ringrose also brings an attacking spark that has been missing from our backline in recent times. I don't know where you're getting Farrell being our best midfield passer because for all his brilliance yesterday, none of that was through distribution or passing whatsoever.

I normally defend Kearney but there's no denying that he was poor today. We do need to try other players at fullback and I'd like to see Carbery and Conway get opportunities on the summer tour at the very very least. I also think Rory Best has been poor so far. We really need bring in Scannell as competition at the very least although Cronin should hold on to the 16 jersey.

For Scotland I'd like to see would be Conway, Earls, Ringrose, Farrell, (if he can, otherwise him at 13 with Aki here) Stockdale, Sexton, Murray, Healy, Best, Furlong (if fit, otherwise Porter), Henderson (if fit, otherwise Toner), Ryan, POM/Leavy/SOB, Stander. The bench really picks itself except for 23 which I'd give to whichever center we don't play.

I know this won't be the team but whatever.

 

[Lomu]

ireland are heavily reliant on the sexton murray axis, however the same could be said of scotland and england, wales prob have the best strength in depth in this dept however they are let down by underperforming backs especially north... he has underachieved since his lions tour, halfpenny finally got his finger out a few weeks ago but he also needed a kick up the backside, his goal kicking is impeccable but needs to add more, id also argue kearney is into his twilight and larmour should be thrown in again despite his defensive frailties due to an eagerness to impress in his debut, not enough line breaks from kearney for my liking

 

[Leinster Fan]

larmour should be thrown in again despite his defensive frailties due to an eagerness to impress in his debut, not enough line breaks from kearney for my liking

Andrew Conway and Joey Carbery can both attack and are defensively solid, Larmour isn't ready yet. I'd rather one or both of those two got a chance although Carbery is likely to be backup 10 for the foreseeable future.

 

[munstermuffin]

Andrew Conway and Joey Carbery can both attack and are defensively solid, Larmour isn't ready yet. I'd rather one or both of those two got a chance although Carbery is likely to be backup 10 for the foreseeable future.

This is the point. Larmour went backwards a bit last few weeks due to hype. He will be a top player but should be left to climb the ladder naturally. Conway has proven it at European level consistently. So has Carbery. So they've earned it naturally. Like rushing through Larmour may be damaging

 

[Leinster Fan]

This is the point. Larmour went backwards a bit last few weeks due to hype. He will be a top player but should be left to climb the ladder naturally. Conway has proven it at European level consistently. So has Carbery. So they've earned it naturally. Like rushing through Larmour may be damaging

Agree with this. Over the last few weeks Larmour has been trying a but to hard. It's like he feels he has make a 20m break every time he gets the ball. Too much pressure on him because of the hype. He's going to be a great player but more pressure is the last thing he needs at the moment.

 

[corny]

I'm sorry but this just isn't true. If you look at Evans' try the primary blame is with McFadden but there is an obvious lack of communicating between the centres and the wings as you'd expect from a bunch of players who've never played together before. This isn't blaming Farrell but it's an obvious fact that a new player in a position as exposed as 13 will struggle to perfectly communicate with wingers he's never played with before. New combos always struggle regardless of how good the players are. The Lions show this consistently every four years.

Farrell was on the far side of the field for Evans try. So he's irrelevant there. Using that example though, McFadden gambled he could make a ball and all tackle but he couldn't. It happens. The important thing you're missing is Scott Williams got the ball with Navidi and Evans outside him. Directly facing Williams was Aki with McFadden outside him. 3 V 2 and thats called an overlap. It happened throughout the second half and it was the fault of players much closer to the ruck. Watch Conan in that example. He comes up hard and leaves Aki and McFadden in no mans land. Again thats not down to familiarity or an inexperiecned midfield pairing. Its just Conan making a poor decision trying to execute Farrells blitz defence. We're all over the shop trying to come up hard. Experienced and inexperienced players alike.

 

[FrenchFan]

The BBC lads are always on about fitness and it irritates the **** out of me. Apparently France aren't fit. No one ever checks this against reality. The narrative says the Top 14 is played at a slower pace so they're not as fit. They push it in every broadcast. They even get the token Frenchman to recite doctrine. For the record i don't see France weakening any more than the other sides in the games so far.

So this is where it's coming from. The BBC self-appointed French rugby experts. What a creepshow.

How do they reconcile their twaddle with seven French teams qualifying for the European 1/4 finals. Nice rehearsed BS.

at a slower pace than what? the Premiership and Pro14? with only ONE English club qualifying in CCup 1/4 versus 4 French clubs - BWHAHAHAHA

 

[corny]

So this is where it's coming from. The BBC self-appointed French rugby experts. What a creepshow.

How do they reconcile their twaddle with seven French teams qualifying for the European 1/4 finals. Nice rehearsed BS.

at a slower pace than what? the Premiership and Pro14? with only ONE English club qualifying in CCup 1/4 versus 4 French clubs - BWHAHAHAHA

Its just lazy generalisations fuelling them. Gabby Logan hasn't a clue yet she asks leading questions all the time. Example "Can France hold onto this lead given their lower fitness level?" The pundits are there for a paycheck, don't really give a **** so they fall in line and share the delusion. I'm paraphrasing of course but thats generally how it goes. I find it especially galling because the one thing France has at international level is superb athletes. They can't play rugby very well but they're superb athletes!

 

[FrenchFan]

Its just lazy generalisations fuelling them. Gabby Logan hasn't a clue yet she asks leading questions all the time. Example "Can France hold onto this lead given their lower fitness level?" The pundits are there for a paycheck, don't really give a **** so they fall in line and share the delusion. I'm paraphrasing of course but thats generally how it goes. I find it especially galling because the one thing France has at international level is superb athletes. They can't play rugby very well but they're superb athletes!

oh yes they can play. We've got every player in the game. There's no shortage of individual talent.

Belleau had an excellent game at 10 for Toulon on Sunday and he's displaced FTD. Incidentally Toulon filled 2 all French HBs (Wisniesky Escande replaced by Belleau Tillous-Borde) in their win at La Rochelle. Why is Belleau not selected? Nobody knows. The recall of 33yo Beauxis who offers nothing is the oddest call I've heard in the last 10 yrs. No one knows what Brunel sees in Beauxis that we haven't seen before.

when was the last time the union settled on a consistent selection of HBs? Nobody can remember.

I can send you the team compos of the Clermont side that smashed Saracens with 11 French starters, Racing that beat Munster with 12 or 13 French players etc.

It's over for the union in this country. They are DONE. They're falling out of every opinion poll. Laporte is accused of corruption by the Sports minister. Fans were walking out of Stade de France last November. Le Figaro report the FFR couldn't fill the ground in Marseilles with 17 000 (!) unsold tickets last Friday. This is for a 6 Nation game! Writing on the wall etc.

The FFR are screwed. LNR are going to put them out of their misery very soon.

 

[MikeTheNative]

I really think Gatland's approach to this game was completely wrong. From the start it was obvious that they were going to play a attacking kicking game, it had a little success and why would you target Kearney who has a few faults but fielding high balls definitely isn't one of them. The best example of this misdirection of attack plan is when Biggar targeted Stockdale with a crossfield kick, a man who is as tall as a giraffe. Defensively Wales also got it wrong. They decided to not compete are the breakdown and fan out as though they were playing a team with a wide expansive game. Ireland don't have this and this allowed them quick ball to get their big ball carriers over the gain line. Wales were extremely poor in the first half due to their poor ball retention and previously mention misguided tactics. However partly due to the one of the worst goal kicking performances I've seen from a pro player and Ireland's refusal to let the centres pass the ball Wales stayed within touching distance, I also don't know how Wales didn't get a warning for a yellow card in the first half either. The 2nd half Wales seemed to remember that they can actually play rugby and started targeting the narrow outside defence of Ireland. Perhaps it they looked at the defensive line in the 1st half and not immediately kicked from ball in hand Wales might have had much better chance of winning.
What did we learn from the game? In the same way one game doesn't make a good team bad, the Scotland game doesn't mean Wales are any good. Again it was poor Welsh tactics that put them on the back foot from the off, tactical decisions a crap casual observer like me could tell you were wrong. In a turn of events that shocked no one Biggar can't play a wide expansive game but I understand why he was selected since Wales just wanted to kick instead of pass in the first half. I thought Parkes had a very good game again. However it seems Williams is struggling at 13, interestingly for Scarlets Williams plays 12 and Parkes plays 13 which I think we might see in the last two games. For all the talk about Ireland, I haven't been that impressed with them to be honest. They have a real issue with creativity in the backs, I don't know whether the centres can't pass or Schmidt doesn't trust them too but you need to vary the centres a bit more than big man run straight or loop with Sexton. I think Ireland will win the championship but I don't see them going to Twickenham and winning.

 

[Thingimubob]

Well... hell of a game that. Gutted it ended that way for us as a better pass to Tips would've created a 3 on 1 to potentially win the game...

However that shouldn't paper over the fact that Ireland dominated us for the majority of the match and more than deserved the win! Was shocked we were still in contention by the end!

One massive positive to take out of this as a Welsh fan is the fact that we scored 3 superb tries and were in with a shot at winning the game despite living on scraps for the most of the game. I just wish we could be that clinical when we are actually able to hold onto the ball for large periods of a match

Hats off to Ireland anyway, fully deserved and I'll be backing you lads for the slam Only worry being that you have to go to Twickenham, and I have a feeling the trend of whichever Home Nation is at home winning might continue.

 

[ThebigARena]

I think you can sing about the tactics all day but the fact we lost this match was down to possession , gave Ireland far too much possession in that first half , thing is we pride ourself on our defence turn teams over and hit them on the break that was the obvious tactic but the fact we weren't getting any turnovers , Ireland dominated proceedings at the ruck and it was so easy for them to maintain possession , hindsight we should of done more to disrupt Irish ball as good as our back row are in attack they are a bit lightweight against a powerful pack . Ireland just bullied there way over because they knew they had the edge in strength , there were times when earls was screaming for the ball but they were so confident of their superior power they knew they could move it through the forwards , it's very tough to get any posssesion when sexton and Murray are getting secure ball like that .
If we were to play that game again I would of swapped moriarty out for falatau , Williams @15 thought biggar had a solid game can't blame the fly half for this one wouldn't of made a difference who was starting. North looked sharp when he came on and his presence just makes the opposition worry, looks like he's getting back to his old self, he should of started imo

 

[MikeTheNative]

Ireland had all the possession because Wales stood off in defence and didn't compete at all in the breakdown. Then when Wales did get the ball they kicked and i don't just mean when in their own 22. There was a number of kicks around the half way line.

 

[mosfeldt]

For all the talk about Ireland, I haven't been that impressed with them to be honest. I think Ireland will win the championship but I don't see them going to Twickenham and winning.

I enjoyed your analysis of the Welsh side of things but can't help but feel you're begrudging us a little bit. Only away win in the tournament so far, only unbeaten team, have just put 5 tries 37 points on ye which is among the most scored against the Welsh in the 6N... Yeah pretty unimpressed, it's a shame Ireland have a good chance to unimpressively win the Championship.

For the record I think this was a hugely positive performance for Wales. A loss yes but away victories are as rare as hen's teeth in the 6N these days, nevermind against the 2nd and 3rd ranked teams in the world. I think the future looks very bright for Wales and with a few tweaks + more of their big boys like Warbs and J. Davies returning, Wales will be very formidable. Coupled with the advantageous home/away fixtures next year the future is bright, IMO. Wales were in it until the last second, with 1/3 of the possession, and were it not for a botched pass and a ballsy intercept they very, very well could've broken our hearts yet again. I would be proud were I Welsh.

 

[MikeTheNative]

I enjoyed your analysis of the Welsh side of things but can't help but feel you're begrudging us a little bit. Only away win in the tournament so far, only unbeaten team, have just put 5 tries 37 points on ye which is among the most scored against the Welsh in the 6N... Yeah pretty unimpressed, it's a shame Ireland have a good chance to unimpressively win the Championship.

For the record I think this was a hugely positive performance for Wales. A loss yes but away victories are as rare as hen's teeth in the 6N these days, nevermind against the 2nd and 3rd ranked teams in the world. I think the future looks very bright for Wales and with a few tweaks + more of their big boys like Warbs and J. Davies returning, Wales will be very formidable. Coupled with the advantageous home/away fixtures next year the future is bright, IMO. Wales were in it until the last second, with 1/3 of the possession, and were it not for a botched pass and a ballsy intercept they very, very well could've broken our hearts yet again. I would be proud were I Welsh.

Perhaps I've been a bit harsh on the Irish and the wrong choice of words, my views might be different if Sexton knocked the points over and were out of sight. They are a well organised side with a powerful pack and strong ball carriers in the backs. However they had a number of chances to put the game to bed and smashed the Welsh in the 1st half but the ball didn't go out wide, I'm surprised Earls didn't lose his voice with all that calling for it on the wing while free! I think Ireland have the potential to play a lot better than they did on Saturday but the restrictive nature of their centre/back play is holding them back. Other than that though, they have world class across the forwards and backs even with injuries. I'd give them a chance to beat anybody home or away, still think England will win at an undefeated Twickenham though

 

[Thingimubob]

I enjoyed your analysis of the Welsh side of things but can't help but feel you're begrudging us a little bit. Only away win in the tournament so far, only unbeaten team, have just put 5 tries 37 points on ye which is among the most scored against the Welsh in the 6N... Yeah pretty unimpressed, it's a shame Ireland have a good chance to unimpressively win the Championship.

For the record I think this was a hugely positive performance for Wales. A loss yes but away victories are as rare as hen's teeth in the 6N these days, nevermind against the 2nd and 3rd ranked teams in the world. I think the future looks very bright for Wales and with a few tweaks + more of their big boys like Warbs and J. Davies returning, Wales will be very formidable. Coupled with the advantageous home/away fixtures next year the future is bright, IMO. Wales were in it until the last second, with 1/3 of the possession, and were it not for a botched pass and a ballsy intercept they very, very well could've broken our hearts yet again. I would be proud were I Welsh.

Completely agree with this - positives there for Wales, but Ireland were fantastic at the keeping the ball and muscling Wales out of the game. I thought they varied their attacking game well too as the chip kicks and inside balls were causing Wales all sorts off issues

Main worry from an Irish perspective would be shipping another 3 tries, especially with Sexton having a bit of an off day with the boot, as missing those 8 or so points at goal could've come back to bite Ireland had that last pass found Welsh hands and not Stockdale's. Naturally that's not too regular an occurrence for Sexton and him not quite being 100% fit might have factored in too.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

I can imagine Sexton's lower back was where he was hurt, probably with an imbalance on the right side because of the way he was leaking his kicks right every time. Overall I'm pretty happy with the game, I won't say performance because a lot was left out there between missed kicks, bad defence and another couple of examples of inaccuracy in the 22. (although my dad in the stadium said Jackson was directly in the passing lane between Murray and Aki for that knock-on which is amateurish)

Positives were definitely the attack, we have a back three who are better cutting through defences rather than going around them and are utilising that well, we have strength in depth in positions we thought we were thread bare in 6 months ago in midfield, tight head and lock but better third choice options for the first two will be needed because the bench was weak and let Wales into it late on.

Leavy and Earls are heroes and I thought they were our top performers, Farrell has proven to be far better than I gave him credit for, once Stockdale is as good without the ball as he is with it he'll be one of the best around, Porter shouldn't be legal.

For Scotland I'd parachute Ringrose and Conway in for Farrell and Kearney and have Farrell on the bench with Ringrose covering wing from the pitch as well as bring the injuries back where you'd expect them. Harsh on Farrell but this is international rugby and we need to get our best players on the pitch once we have proven back ups. Conway comes in with a chance to take the 15 jersey for Twickenham but with it no way guaranteed.

 

[MikeTheNative]

Ringrose back will defintely add an extra dimension in attack, something they haven't had in the backs so far.

 

[bushytop]

Ireland had all the possession because Wales stood off in defence and didn't compete at all in the breakdown. Then when Wales did get the ball they kicked and i don't just mean when in their own 22. There was a number of kicks around the half way line.

Jackson willingness to penalise us early with quick whistles meant that we were left bereft of ideas when at the breakdown thereafter. This in turn resulted in us getting little to no ball. With the way our back row had competed in this area in the first two games (against worse back rows in comparison to the Irish imo), they went in confident of competing successfully in this area and put little priority on producing 'fixes' in this area during the week. Therefore when it went wrong, we had no answer.

It's an especially difficult problem when thinking about how to solve the problem through a change of personnel, with Shingler and Navidi eventually showing some class in attack in particular (as well as their previous performances). I think Faletau definitely comes back in if fit but would persevere with the 6 and 7 for the next game. I would also bring Patchell back in, France and Italy are probably better opposition for a fly half at his stage of development than England were or Ireland would've been, if he had been selected.

I'd also start with the alternate front row to see how they go from the start. I'm big fans of the Scarlet front three but again, I feel Italy and France are teams who while competitive, exert less pressure than our first few games.

From an Irish perspective I would feel very satisfied if I were them. A lot of key injury problems going in and some work ons coming out but a convincing win with some great individual performances.

 

[Thingimubob]

Jackson willingness to penalise us early with quick whistles meant that we were left bereft of ideas when at the breakdown thereafter. This in turn resulted in us getting little to no ball. With the way our back row had competed in this area in the first two games (against worse back rows in comparison to the Irish imo), they went in confident of competing successfully in this area and put little priority on producing 'fixes' in this area during the week. Therefore when it went wrong, we had no answer.

It's an especially difficult problem when thinking about how to solve the problem through a change of personnel, with Shingler and Navidi eventually showing some class in attack in particular (as well as their previous performances). I think Faletau definitely comes back in if fit but would persevere with the 6 and 7 for the next game. I would also bring Patchell back in, France and Italy are probably better opposition for a fly half at his stage of development than England were or Ireland would've been, if he had been selected.

I'd also start with the alternate front row to see how they go from the start. I'm big fans of the Scarlet front three but again, I feel Italy and France are teams who while competitive, exert less pressure than our first few games.

From an Irish perspective I would feel very satisfied if I were them. A lot of key injury problems going in and some work ons coming out but a convincing win with some great individual performances.

Yeah honestly can't say I was enthusiastic with Jackson's breakdown interpretation, but that's just something you have to adapt to as a team, which I thought Ireland did and we didn't.

Not sure if you can single anyone out for blame, though I have to say for the 3rd match in a row I barely noticed Moriarty being on the pitch. I personally probably put that down to him getting back to fitness, but I feel we probably would've done better with Faletau's workrate at the breakdown.