Should drugs be legalised?

[dullonien]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nidhogg @ Jan 23 2009, 05:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

I don't get it. Every study available indicates that there are less drug users in the Netherlands in every category, from soft to hard drugs, compared to countries that have complete prohibition (except for the crazy Scandinavians, then again they drink insane amounts of hard alcohol and live in snow country). How can you say that you feel drugs ruin too many lives, and then go around to support the system that results in the most drug users?[/b]

I think that's because people are well educated about drugs. Maybe part of the reason for that is because it isn't such a taboo, cannabis can be smoked legally (in designated areas). It's similar to the way that the French are much more sensible about alcohol. Children grow up where they are allowed to have a bit of wine every now and then, it's not a big deal. Wheras is Britain the majority of parents refuse any alcohol, then at the age of 18 these grown up children go nuts!

Disclaimer: I am in no way saying children should be given drugs. Just that if you can take the taboo away from these substances, including tobbacco and alcohol, young adults will be less likely to feel the need to try them. Not sure if any of that makes any sense lol.

 

[St Helens RLFC]

The black market in the UK being arguably as bad as anywhere in Europe due to the tax on much recreation, as Mite has already said.

 

[dullonien]

But the price of cannabis would drop due to the legal means of it's production and transportation. An 1/8 of an ounce of 'skunk' costs, what? between £15-25. That cost would fall by a huge margin, then the government can slap a nice 50%+ tax on it, raising it back up to what it was before. In the end, most people would get it through legal means (like the majority of people buy cigarettes/alcohol from the shop). So those arguments do hold some water.

Not sure if the Netherlands model could work in the UK. There's no-where on earth with the same rediculous problems we have with binge drinking (not to the same extent), the same would almost certainly happen with MaryJ.

 

[St Helens RLFC]

I wouldn't trust your average cannabis smoking bonehead to do it in public, and as much as they wanted to in a cafe. No way. Especially not in this country, there are just way too many dangerous ballachers. Irresponsible, we can be.

 

[dullonien]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (St Helens RLFC @ Jan 23 2009, 05:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

I wouldn't trust your average cannabis smoking bonehead to do it in public, and as much as they wanted to in a cafe. No way. Especially not in this country, there are just way too many dangerous ballachers. Irresponsible, we can be.[/b]

Edited my post already to take that into account. I agree completely. Though there are waaaay more alcohol drinking boneheads who just want a fight than there are cannabis smoking boneheads who just wanna sleep lol. But both are wrong.

 

[gingergenius]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (dullonien @ Jan 23 2009, 05:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (St Helens RLFC @ Jan 23 2009, 05:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I wouldn't trust your average cannabis smoking bonehead to do it in public, and as much as they wanted to in a cafe. No way. Especially not in this country, there are just way too many dangerous ballachers. Irresponsible, we can be.[/b]

Edited my post already to take that into account. I agree completely. Though there are waaaay more alcohol drinking boneheads who just want a fight than there are cannabis smoking boneheads who just wanna sleep lol. But both are wrong.
[/b][/quote]

i'm sure you've all heard this, but he makes a point:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bCbDF-OPDX4

 

[Laetca]

Nidhogg, true you never said 'try it', but by trying to make drugs sound as something completely acceptable, it's as if you are promoting them (I realise this is probably not your intention, that's just how it can come across.)

dullonien, in Spain parents also have the habit of having their children have a sip of beer every now and then, perhaps because in summer they have the habit of drinking a bit of red wine with a lot of gaseosa (similar to sprite, but without the sugar) so it hardly contains any alcohol. Still each year it's the same problem in Spain, teens going to the beach drinking the most horrible alcoholic mixes to get absolutely drunk and end up in hospital. I think it depends on overall upbringing, perhaps parents pay more attention to their offspring in France.

I don't trust anyone using drugs in public, the amount of drunks wandering around university (most of them students) and the puddles of vomit on the streets each monday are enough to make one wonder why alcohol is legal.

 

[dullonien]

That steets song does portray things very well. For those of you who haven't smoked weed, that it exacly how it's done. You'll often sit around discussing anything from politics to physics, play some play station, order a piza then go to sleep, waking up with no real ill effects. It's all good fun, with no harm being made to anyone. But I still grew out of it, in the same way I've grown out of getting ****** every weekend. I'll probably take up smoking weed again when I'm retired with nothing better to do lol.

 

[St Helens RLFC]

I was going to click on that link. Thanks dullonien. You just protected me from the pain of listening to the least talented musicians of the decade.

 

[Bullitt]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div>

For those of you who haven't smoked weed, that it exacly how it's done. You'll often sit around discussing anything from politics to physics, play some play station, order a piza then go to sleep, waking up with no real ill effects. It's all good fun, with no harm being made to anyone.[/b]

Or... You throw a whitey, go on a mission, trip up a staircase, smack your head against a radiator, get a massive concussion and suffer bad trips for the following 3 weeks....

There's a good reason I've not touched weed for many years.

 

[dullonien]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teh Mite @ Jan 23 2009, 05:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Or... You throw a whitey, go on a mission, trip up a staircase, smack your head against a radiator, get a massive concussion and suffer bad trips for the following 3 weeks....[/b]

?? Cannabis and the word mission don't come together easily! whitey's are a very uncommon thing, and trips don't apply to weed.

Ah right, fair enough Mite, sure it wasn't laced with something? I've known ******* dealers to lace some with coke, so they can get you addicted to something more 'profitable'

 

[Bullitt]

Hundred quid says otherwise.

 

[gingergenius]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (dullonien @ Jan 23 2009, 06:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teh Mite @ Jan 23 2009, 05:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Or... You throw a whitey, go on a mission, trip up a staircase, smack your head against a radiator, get a massive concussion and suffer bad trips for the following 3 weeks....[/b]

?? Cannabis and the word mission don't come together easily! whitey's are a very uncommon thing, and trips don't apply to weed.

Ah right, fair enough Mite, sure it wasn't laced with something? I've known ******* dealers to lace some with coke, so they can get you addicted to something more 'profitable'
[/b][/quote]

i whiteyed quite a few times when i was 15/16 and mixed it with beer. for some reason the two really didn't work for me.

Otherwise though, i hardly smoke at all anymore... don't think since before last summer anyway. You do grow out of it. I haven't done ecstasy for a while either; I still have had fantastic times on both drugs, and i've never had anything bad while on E.. but things change, people change and you stop doing things for no apparent reason...

 

[Charles]

Seeing the bad effect alcohol has on society, I don't get why it is legal and weed isn't. Care to give a reason guys ?

 

[Steve-o]

It's easier to tax

 

[dullonien]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Charles @ Jan 24 2009, 02:33 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Seeing the bad effect alcohol has on society, I don't get why it is legal and weed isn't. Care to give a reason guys ?[/b]

Well goverments say the reason is the harm it can do to your brain, depression etc. With my experiences, I'd tent to agree, but it's a tight call. I id get depressed when I was smoking alot in uni, but then the depression started after getting mugged at mid-day minutes from my halls. Though, to most this isn't a really bad thing (after all, plenty of people get mugged without getting depressed), but it played on my mind alot. I preferred not to go out on my own (this wouldn't be so bad if it had happened at night) and tied to avoid the area it happened (my walking route to uni).

This meant I stopped going to uni, missed more and more lectures and got further and further behind in work. These were the main reasons I got more and more depressed, weed was just a way of passing the day, it didn't play on my mind as much when I was stoned! Obviously the more time passed, the more nervous I got about going back to uni and confronting my lecturers (so even though the mugging didn't effect me much anymore, uni was).

Finally, one day I realised there was no point me being there anymore, feeling miserable. So I told uni I was quitting and went home. Things improved almost instantly, within a couple of weeks, I'd got a job at an architects practice, I was back in a town I knew and felt comfertouble in (unlike Leicester), and I had my school friends back around me. Even though I carried on smoking cannabis for a few years (not as heavily), it no longer had any effect on me.

That's where my reservations regarding the governments attitudes of 'cannabis causes depression' comes from. It facilitates depression, people use it to try and get away from their shitty lives. But then, alcohol can be used in the exact same way, both cause you to forget your troubles, but increase them at the same time (getting into debt etc.)
But at the end of the day, it's other things that are causing the depression in the first place, and I think that was proven to me by how instant the transformation was after returning home from uni, within days I was sleeping better, eating properly again, getting out of the house and generally feelign great.

/end of rant lol

 

[dundeesmiffy]

1) You can trip from weed, it is a psychoactive chemical, you won't see anything, but everything short of that is possible. THC is a type of "acid", that occurs naturally in the plant, especially in indicas (there are two types of weed, indica and sativa)

2) I often feel unwell and sometimes am sick as a result of smoking and drinking at the same time...it's just going to happen...it's also pretty irresponsible. I rarely even smoke tobacco, because of all the inherent risks of smoking it...which in my opinion are considerably more than it's green counterpart.

3) Dull...your post above makes a good point, but it's only your experience with it, but would you go so far to say you were abusing it? What about the millions of people around the world that smoke/have smoked recreationally for a long time. I'm obviously sad to see cannabis was a key component in what was obviously a pretty lousy period in your life.

In short, if you're going to smoke weed, be safe about it, don't smoke joints with extra tobacco in them all the time, sure it's a way to smoke...but it's not the only way, good pipes go for around £5 and bongs for around £20, don't smoke more tobacco than you need to. Don't smoke weed and drink at the same time unless you know you can handle it, some people just can't handle it.

And don't smoke it every day/all the time, it's not good for you if you do it every day, just like alcohol, tobacco and a wealth of other things we shouldn't do because they have the potential to have some negative effetcts on our bodies if we chose to abuse them.

Sometimes I get the feeling if they had banned alcohol instead of cannabis we'd be having the exact same conversation....except I'd still be defending cannabis...because in my opinion, there is nothing wrong with it if you are smart about it...like most things of that nature.

This is just how I feel about it, I'm not saying it's what you should think so feel free contest it...just know that I've probably heard it before.

 

[Canadian_Rugger]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (dundeesmiffy @ Jan 25 2009, 02:30 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

1) You can trip from weed, it is a psychoactive chemical, you won't see anything, but everything short of that is possible. THC is a type of "acid", that occurs naturally in the plant, especially in indicas (there are two types of weed, indica and sativa)

2) I often feel unwell and sometimes am sick as a result of smoking and drinking at the same time...it's just going to happen...it's also pretty irresponsible. I rarely even smoke tobacco, because of all the inherent risks of smoking it...which in my opinion are considerably more than it's green counterpart.

3) Dull...your post above makes a good point, but it's only your experience with it, but would you go so far to say you were abusing it? What about the millions of people around the world that smoke/have smoked recreationally for a long time. I'm obviously sad to see cannabis was a key component in what was obviously a pretty lousy period in your life.

In short, if you're going to smoke weed, be safe about it, don't smoke joints with extra tobacco in them all the time, sure it's a way to smoke...but it's not the only way, good pipes go for around £5 and bongs for around £20, don't smoke more tobacco than you need to. Don't smoke weed and drink at the same time unless you know you can handle it, some people just can't handle it.

And don't smoke it every day/all the time, it's not good for you if you do it every day, just like alcohol, tobacco and a wealth of other things we shouldn't do because they have the potential to have some negative effetcts on our bodies if we chose to abuse them.

Sometimes I get the feeling if they had banned alcohol instead of cannabis we'd be having the exact same conversation....except I'd still be defending cannabis...because in my opinion, there is nothing wrong with it if you are smart about it...like most things of that nature.

This is just how I feel about it, I'm not saying it's what you should think so feel free contest it...just know that I've probably heard it before.[/b]

your absolutely right.... the last time I smoked was a while back... let me tell you it was the most f***ed up I'd ever been in my life... I had been drinking heavily the night before big huge party.. went to bed at 4am woke up 4 hours later. I had to drive 1200km that day as my vacation was starting. I will openly admit that I used to have a huge drinking problem... all the boneheads who we talk aboutg etting ****** off their ass and starting fights yah I was one of them... I have had a good tussle more times then I can count. I was in the army at this point as well and was very depressed... hated what I was doing so I started using drugs and alcohol to cope.... so that day that I went to drive home I was f***ing hungover.... headache and all so I chugged over the period of the day a whole bottle of dayquil... which is a mix of ephedrine, codeine, and acetaminophen.... so I was pretty buzzed as you can imagine... I got to my buddies house 12 hours later we immediately started drinking... one of my buddies had a few joints and we were like hell yah lets go smoke this ****... so we went outside and got high as kites.... I was so messed I couldn't even talk... it was f***ed mix of codeine, ephedrine, acetaminophen, marijuana, and booze.... I pretty much refer to ti as the heath ledger special..

I think the only reason my body could handle it all was the high level of physical fitness I was in.... at this point I was playing high calibre rugby... the team I was on is one of the top funded in Canada for university. We practice 3 hours a day 5 times a week and its pretty much a semi-professional level. I was so depressed at this point in my life that I would often be hungover at practice... looking back on it I was so stupid but I had let the problem which I had at that point lead me to substance abuse... It was so bad that I almost got kicked out of the forces... Luckily I hit rock bottom and was able to pull myself out of that situation... I won't blame the drinking or the pot smoking for my problems because I know they were not the main cause but what they did do was exacerbate the problem immensely.

I have stopped everything ... I drink occasionally but usually only one to two drinks a week or a glass of wine with my girlfriend. I believe she has helped me a lot. I was in a real rough time... my mom was sick with cancer, my dad was real sick, I ahted my job... and she really helped pull me through that... infact I think she saved me... Then the rape happened to her and that changed everything between us even more.

I went from hating what I did to loving it too... My job is back on track and I topped my last army course I was on. I know that drugs and alcohol weren't the only contributing factors to my demise but they didn't help and they only made my problems worse...

 

[gingergenius]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (dundeesmiffy @ Jan 24 2009, 02:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

1) You can trip from weed, it is a psychoactive chemical, you won't see anything, but everything short of that is possible. THC is a type of "acid", that occurs naturally in the plant, especially in indicas (there are two types of weed, indica and sativa)

2) I often feel unwell and sometimes am sick as a result of smoking and drinking at the same time...it's just going to happen...it's also pretty irresponsible. I rarely even smoke tobacco, because of all the inherent risks of smoking it...which in my opinion are considerably more than it's green counterpart.

3) Dull...your post above makes a good point, but it's only your experience with it, but would you go so far to say you were abusing it? What about the millions of people around the world that smoke/have smoked recreationally for a long time. I'm obviously sad to see cannabis was a key component in what was obviously a pretty lousy period in your life.

In short, if you're going to smoke weed, be safe about it, don't smoke joints with extra tobacco in them all the time, sure it's a way to smoke...but it's not the only way, good pipes go for around £5 and bongs for around £20, don't smoke more tobacco than you need to. Don't smoke weed and drink at the same time unless you know you can handle it, some people just can't handle it.

And don't smoke it every day/all the time, it's not good for you if you do it every day, just like alcohol, tobacco and a wealth of other things we shouldn't do because they have the potential to have some negative effetcts on our bodies if we chose to abuse them.

Sometimes I get the feeling if they had banned alcohol instead of cannabis we'd be having the exact same conversation....except I'd still be defending cannabis...because in my opinion, there is nothing wrong with it if you are smart about it...like most things of that nature.

This is just how I feel about it, I'm not saying it's what you should think so feel free contest it...just know that I've probably heard it before.[/b]

I'm one of those people. Even if it's only been 1 zoot after just 1 pint. Having alcohol and THC in my body makes my head start spinning; I feel really sleepy and need to lie down; then I'm sick and I cannot move.

People who smoke everyday in my oponion are idiots. I personally don't like the smell of weed, nor the taste of it. I only ever liked doing it when you've got time to sit back and chill out and feel the effects; like in a park or by the river or someplace like that. Because if you're relaxed then you don't feel paranoid. And I can't think how people can have enough time to do that EVERY day. I reckon that's the way to go; I never smoked more than once a week. Same with cigarettes; smoking 1 or 2 per day won't harm you much at all.

KIDS: Do things in moderation, and use your brains.

 

[Fred187]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (St Helens RLFC @ Jan 24 2009, 06:08 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

By backing up a Saints fan, you do realise that you've just opened up a hole in the time space continuum over Billinge, don't you? [/b]

I think, in this case, those paradoxical consequences are something we're just going to have to face! :lol:

Anyway, my two cents on the issue as a whole (based on my own experiences): drugs aren't the problem as such, but they are an effect of various other problems. The times I have delved into serious drug use were when I was unhappy with other aspects of my life. When I recovered from those, the drug use stopped. This might not apply to all cases, but I don't belive there are very many emotionally balanced, happy people who use recreational drugs.