Saturday, 6 August: Springboks v New Zealand

[mania]

bugger off, ive supported the AB's through highs and lows for a long time, the difference is in the past when we lose the coaches and players actually seemed to care...ardie didn;t even know this was the first test loss to ireland in Nz and first Series Loss in NZ....he's literally played in EVERY loss to ireland....to be that oblivious shows a lack of care to me...and almost everyone else ive talked too

and i dont actually think he was that good..yes...he might get meters...but he is constantly isolating himself, no ones seems to know what hes about to do, he may be a great singular player but he just doesn't play well with the others

finally, the comment was a reply to the idea of intensity...how we can claim we're going to bring intensity when we conceded first in all three games to ireland...its seems to take this squad 20m to remember their playing game

oh yeah and ardie getting isolated isnt ardies problem. I tell my halfback son to run it when he has the advantage and he said "but my team mates wont keep up". I replied "thats up to them to understand how you play and they have to learn to keep up".
ardie cannot afford to not take the gap just because he thinks his team mates wont keep up. thats his teams problem. ardies hitting the gaps and trying to score tries

 

[mania]

this pack is small and light. they'll need to offload heaps and avoid rucks. not sure they have what it takes to endure the Boks defense whilst still staying mobile. gonna be epic

 

[Kiwiwomble]

oh yeah and ardie getting isolated isnt ardies problem. I tell my halfback son to run it when he has the advantage and he said "but my team mates wont keep up". I replied "thats up to them to understand how you play and they have to learn to keep up".
ardie cannot afford to not take the gap just because he thinks his team mates wont keep up. thats his teams problem. ardies hitting the gaps and trying to score tries

and that's the individuality thats screwing the AB's, and not just him, but "a champion team will always beat a team of champions" is a very famous saying for a reason

 

[GoTheNaki]

I am weary of an NZ backlash but also feel regardless we should ideally always beat the All Blacks at home. Away victories are special but you have to make sure you don't lose at home. For this reason I back a SA win, previous form does not matter much, both teams aren't lighting up the world but they both will build nicely towards WC.

I would love a rugby championship ***le, and what better way than to do that by hosting your biggest rival for both your RC fixtures at home. No doubt next year in NZ it will be operation doomsday, as NZ will be heavy favourites with two of their own home fixtures.

How good is the NZ tackle break at the moment? Are they at least pushy in their midfield attack? With some slippery players on form breaking tackles or evading tackles that they shouldn't? If NZ can play to their strengths it will really put our rush defence under pressure, if not then I am pretty sure we will calmly win the forward battle, with emphasis on short forward gains, set pieces, breakdown attacks, and rush defence to make opponent lose meters. It's a Very aggressive strategy

Oh christ, we haven't had a dangerous midfield since 2015. We had the potential once in having Ngani Laumape as a dangerous runner at the last World Cup, but they decided not to... uh... take him to the WC. But my christ are we utterly lost right now in midfield. We have Rieko Ioane who will get TERRIBLE ball, terrible lines, and terrible game plan from the coach/Beauden Barrett as per usual, and David Havili...... who... is... just not scary... At all. Especially at international level.

 

[Umaga's Witness]

maybe from one side....i just get the feeling from this AB's team they just dont give a ****, like ardie really only seemed to care about losing to ireland...AFTER it had happened...too bloody late mate

Honestly, To question ardies intensity is ridiculous . He is the one player that gives it everything every game. He plays way beyond his fitness too. Every game he plays at every level he is blowing hard. You don't see any other player around in the world that is consistently putting in that much effort. There are loads of players who have a higher work rate because they are fitter (no doubt better genetics for rugby fitness - the van der fliers and the likes) but no one has a higher work rate to fitness ratio

I can see arguments against ardie being in the side (especially at 8 against the boks), but
Putting blame on ardie for losses to Ireland is going a bit far. I watched the 2018 loss a second time to rate the players, just the starting fifteens and ardie was the best player on the field. The next 14 best were Irish (the whole team except Rory). Based on that we should have got completely demolished. But nope, ardie was that good he kept us in it on his own.

Scott barrett, Liam squire, George moala were all terrible in Chicago and also should never have been in the team. I blame Hansen for Risking our record against ireland in the name of World Cup preparation by picking a few players for development purposes.

 

[Umaga's Witness]

If Fozzie is sacked, does NZRU go Razor or Joe Schmidt? Because I could easily see them place an interim tag on Schmidt through the World Cup.

Schmidt repeatedly says he is not interested in full time work, he considers himself retired

 

[Kiwiwomble]

Honestly, To question ardies intensity is ridiculous . He is the one player that gives it everything every game. He plays way beyond his fitness too. Every game he plays at every level he is blowing hard. You don't see any other player around in the world that is consistently putting in that much effort. There are loads of players who have a higher work rate because they are fitter (no doubt better genetics for rugby fitness - the van der fliers and the likes) but no one has a higher work rate to fitness ratio

I can see arguments against ardie being in the side (especially at 8 against the boks), but
Putting blame on ardie for losses to Ireland is going a bit far. I watched the 2018 loss a second time to rate the players, just the starting fifteens and ardie was the best player on the field. The next 14 best were Irish (the whole team except Rory). Based on that we should have got completely demolished. But nope, ardie was that good he kept us in it on his own.

Scott barrett, Liam squire, George moala were all terrible in Chicago and also should never have been in the team. I blame Hansen for Risking our record against ireland in the name of World Cup preparation by picking a few players for development purposes.

not solely blaming ardie, hes just an obvious example of what i feel is going wrong with the team, several "world class" players going out and just doing their own thing...regardless of how that works with everyone else, and the obliviousness re the irish games really bugged me, really came across like he only realised it was important after the game when someone told him

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

That's what I was thinking too

The ABs of old you'd expect a big backlash after the performances vs Ireland but not so sure about this one,
Boks side looks insane on paper but haven't necessarily been living up to it on the pitch (though still getting the results - could just be a case of not needing to hit top gear rather than not being able to hit top gear)

The thing is I expected an AB backlash after losing the 2nd test to Ireland. And then nothing.

Still not writing them off at all. Everywhere on media I see predictions of "Boks to be too strong" but we've seen countless times how we lose games despite obvious forward dominance. All it needs is a combination of any of these very likely situations:

- a ref that doesn't award us a raft of 3 pointers at the scrum
- Pollard having an off day at the goal posts
- any sort of lapse in defense as you know the likes of Barrett, Jordan, Savea et al will pounce
- us not scoring tries/ converting opportunities- as we know you don't beat the All Blacks without scoring a few 7 pointers yourself

 

[Hammerhead]

this pack is small and light. they'll need to offload heaps and avoid rucks. not sure they have what it takes to endure the Boks defense whilst still staying mobile. gonna be epic

The NZ pack is not small and light. Odds on the NZ pack weighing more than the Bok pack come game time? This notion of the Boks being bigger and heavier is ridiculous. Where can I find the tale of the tape for Saturday's game?

 

[Umaga's Witness]

Oh christ, we haven't had a dangerous midfield since 2015. We had the potential once in having Ngani Laumape as a dangerous runner at the last World Cup, but they decided not to... uh... take him to the WC. But my christ are we utterly lost right now in midfield. We have Rieko Ioane who will get TERRIBLE ball, terrible lines, and terrible game plan from the coach/Beauden Barrett as per usual, and David Havili...... who... is... just not scary... At all. Especially at international level.

I'm a canes fan, so I like laumape, but he really didn't deliver too well for the all blacks . And even though we are struggling right now and could do with some go forward in the midfield, I still wouldn't have picked him for this test. As a combo with ione we would really be lacking ball skills. With goodhue or alb could work, but both are currently injured. If havili had experience at 13, that could work too. Man, it makes you realise how lucky we were with injuries when nonu and Conrad were in the midfield. (Remember when Conrad got injured and they shifted Ben smith to centre? Despite how great Ben smith is that didn't really work too well.)

Speaking of havili, I agree he has had some issues at international level, and for sure not scary. Great player though in my opinion - has all the traits you want in an all black - the smarts, the skills, the cool head. But i can't see any 13 in NZ he would make a great international level combo with; he'd make a good but not great combo with an umaga jensen. With Someone like many tuilagi people would be singing his praises.

 

[Umaga's Witness]

The NZ pack is not small and light. Odds on the NZ pack weighing more than the Bok pack come game time? This notion of the Boks being bigger and heavier is ridiculous. Where can I find the tale of the tape for Saturday's game?

All blacks 890 vs 937 springboks for the starting pack according to my summing of individual player weights On Google.

 

[JohnKA]

I am shocked at how the South Africa media is saying the boks will trash the all blacks. I won't even be suprised if they beat us. Yeah they lost to the Irish who cares. The all blacks is and will always be a powerhouse and I don't care if they lose to how many of these average rugby nations they will always be a massive threat.

 

[unrated]

This is a good read for some perspective on tomorrows game.
He is not baiting anyone, good column

Nick Mallett - Desperate All Blacks under huge pressure, but so are Nienaber and the Springboks https://www.news24.com/sport/column...t-so-are-nienaber-and-the-springboks-20220805

 

[unrated]

I am shocked at how the South Africa media is saying the boks will trash the all blacks. I won't even be suprised if they beat us. Yeah they lost to the Irish who cares. The all blacks is and will always be a powerhouse and I don't care if they lose to how many of these average rugby nations they will always be a massive threat.

Link us to atleast one media source that says we are going to trash them. I know News 24 has been conservative.

SA Rugby is shambles, honestly they are becoming very click baity, and I have lost faith in them.

If you tell me IOl and some of the other media houses has been writing about trashing the All Blacks then I will be really suprised.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I don't care if they lose to how many of these average rugby nations

@Le Frére Alpha :

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

@Le Frére Alpha :

I actually can't read after three straight weeks of doing this:

 

[JohnKA]

Link us to atleast one media source that says we are going to trash them. I know News 24 has been conservative.

SA Rugby is shambles, honestly they are becoming very click baity, and I have lost faith in them.

If you tell me IOl and some of the other media houses has been writing about trashing the All Blacks then I will be really suprised.

Our friends there at sa rugby magazine. Guess I need not say more.

 

[JohnKA]

I actually can't read after three straight weeks of doing this:

View attachment 14341

Did not mean the Irish they have won plenty of world cups been in almost all the finals and have never missed a semi final !

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Did not mean the Irish they have won plenty of world cups been in almost all the finals and have never missed a semi final !

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

I expect low scoring. Possibly neither side scoring more than 20. I either want the ABs to burst into scintillating life or die convincingly to pressure the NZ union.

Boks by 7