Samoa V New Zealand July 8th 2015

[Larksea]

izzy had a nightmare game, if he was looking to make some sort of statement well he did that. But not in a good way, and his last mistake saw him get the shepherds crook at ~52min. When all the reviews are done and dusted Dagg will come out the biggest looser from this game.

Close behind him should be Andy Elis.

I thought the guys on debut handled it well, moala in particular. I can see him becoming a regular all black fairly soon. Laulala was also very good, weber too. Ngatai as well though he did not get long.

Dont want to read too much into the overall performance, first test, passionate and ultra physical samoan side, extreme heat, pitch that ploughed up like a corn field, small but ultra vocal croud.

One thing is for sure, Dan Carters presence has become absolutely critical again. Despite having more depth at 10 than ever I think we really need Dan this year, he and Aaron Smith are our MVP's IMO. With Cruden injured, Barrett struggling for kicking form after injury issues, we really want Dan to get through this year ok, he's worked through form and injury issues to a point where he is now seeing the game well and his goal kicking is superb. maybe just a bit down on range from his best.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

...bro if they (ie SA) play as bad as you spell then it will be easy money...lot of very worried Saffas on their forums after Vermulen ruled out, JDV hasn't played since god knows when...then there's the quotas which is also worrying them...not as cut and dried as you may think..

Well we'll see then. SA has strength in depth to cover injuries, a lot more than Samoa. Betting on sports is a mug's game anyway.

 

[Kiwi_]

Well we'll see then. SA has strength in depth to cover injuries, a lot more than Samoa. Betting on sports is a mug's game anyway.

How's betting on a few games a "mugs game"? What a stupid conservative statement. Is your Grandma Margret Thatcher or something?

 

[Maxwell]

After an error riddled first half we saw some more enterprise and composed play in the 2nd. I really expected the intensity to fade in the Samoan heat but this wasn't the case. The AB's were everything we expected and in spite of our effort got the win. Hope fully we can build now on this performance and make necessary improvements.


Zak Taulafo had a torrid time in the scrum but battled on gamely with ball in hand.

Ole Avei was largely inconspicuous

Census a late inclusion also toiled had

Filo Paulo was solid

Kane Thompson really isn't a lock and would be better served at 6 or 8

Alafoti Faosiliva made amazing runs including his wonderful try

Jack Lam competed well at breakdown

Ofisa Treviranus was injured and went off at HT. I honestly think the guy is a blown up #7 and gives away much size to opponents.

Kahn Fotualii was ever industrious but expected a few more runs

Tusi Pisi was a little shaky early nut his radar was on with his goalkicking

Alesana Tuilagi did what he does best and run hard. I honestly think his days are numbered and we need to look at fast options

Johnny Leota was solid in defence but no real threat in attack

Paul Perez ran hard and was a solid in attack but much more threatening on the wing

Alofa Alofa a shock selection wasn't very involved

Tim Nanai-Williams had a forgettable debut littered with errors, a bench player at best we have good options at 15

Anthony Perenise good to see him back

Manu L looked industrious around the park

Viliamu Afatia little game time

Iosefo Tekori is a colossus who must start

M Faasavalu was awesome and eliminated any doubts on his age

P Cowley looked sharp

K Pisi must start very solid


With some players missing like the All Blacks we can improve.

A XV to compete with SA IMO is:

Z Taulafo
T Paulo
L Mulipola
T Paulo
I Tekori
M Faasavalu
J Lam
T Tuifua
K Fotualii
P Perez
G Pisi
A Leuia
K Pisi
F Autagavia

Res.
C Johnston if available
A Perenise
M Leautuia
K Thompson
TJ Ioane
P Cowley
A Tuaala

 

[InsaneAsylum]

How's betting on a few games a "mugs game"? What a stupid conservative statement. Is your Grandma Margret Thatcher or something?

Although I've been guilty of placing a few cheeky bets on some Rugby matches, I agree betting is geared to take your money.

I have a mate who spends every weekend on the horses, only ever tells me what he "won" never tells me what he has put across the counter. I really want to slap some sense into him because he's a good mate, but it's no use - he's in too deep.

 

[Kiwi_]

Although I've been guilty of placing a few cheeky bets on some Rugby matches, I agree betting is geared to take your money.

I have a mate who spends every weekend on the horses, only ever tells me what he "won" never tells me what he has put across the counter. I really want to slap some sense into him because he's a good mate, but it's no use - he's in too deep.

That's just like saying "drinking alcohol is for idiots", then using alcoholics as an example. It's the abusers who are mugs, not the act itself.

Tim did had a bad game at FB, who's your best FB?

Rey Le Lo surely will make the team.

 

[Shaggy]

I'm not totally shocked by the result/margin, or the amount of mistakes that were made by both sides, considering the selection issues, recent game time, and squad training time that either or both teams had prior to the game.

It was a great occasion, but giveen the factors above, it might have been asking a bit much for more tries etc.

Im pretty much expecting a series of trial teams selected this year, given that Steve Hansen has indicated that all of his squad will get an opportunity.

It will be interesting to see how many opportunities some of the fringe players get with so few tests remaining before the RWC.

Dagg may miss out based on that performance, as I assume that B.Smith will be at fullback and will need game time there, and they will probably want to try Milner-Skudder there too. Perhaps they might run Barrett and Slade there, as they may only want one specialist fullback.

Moala made the most of his opportunity, but, given the glut of outside backs available/the other players that they want to look at from the bench, it might be his only opportunity; he could fill a Richard Kahui type roll in the RWC squad (who knows?)

Maybe Weber and Laulala could get another run, and Romano might get another go, but they'll want to give Broadhurst and Thrush their opportunity too.

 

[Maxwell]

That's just like saying "drinking alcohol is for idiots", then using alcoholics as an example. It's the abusers who are mugs, not the act itself.

Tim did had a bad game at FB, who's your best FB?

Rey Le Lo surely will make the team.

Ken Pisi played well at FB vs Italy, we have Faatoina Autagavia & of course theres Paul Williams & Ahsee Tuaala

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Pisi played wing vs Samoa,
Really think him and Sinoti are the best two options there for Samoa.

 

[smartcooky]

Im pretty much expecting a series of trial teams selected this year, given that Steve Hansen has indicated that all of his squad will get an opportunity.

It will be interesting to see how many opportunities some of the fringe players get with so few tests remaining before the RWC

Given that teams are allowed eight substitutes (that's more than half a team) there ought to be ample opportunities to give fringe players a run without changing the run on XV all that much.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

How's betting on a few games a "mugs game"? What a stupid conservative statement. Is your Grandma Margret Thatcher or something?

It's my opinion mate. As I respect your opinion that it's not. Live with it. What the hell has Margaret Thatcher got to do with it?

 

[Kiwi_]

And it's my opinion and that your opinion makes you sound like a 50 year old conservative women.

Real talk;

Dagg will be dropped and Jane has question marks.

Naholo to start vs Argentina?

 

[Mary7]

Hey be careful making comments about old conservative women!!

 

[jessta]

Its very frustrating to me that certain players probably wont be dropped because too much has been invested in them.

e.g. Sonny Bill

Either one of Crotty or Fekitoa will be dropped to make way for money bill wereas both deserve to be there in front of him. We dont need him, its so annoying hansen and co went above and beyond to get this bloke back to our shores when we have better local talent. OK fair enough in 2010- 2011 he actually deserved to be picked on warrant and was a valuable world cup squad member. Although he still complained about game time he received in the cup... mate you dont get to start above nonu because of your name.
Based on his form this year which isnt bad I may say, but not spectacular.. He wouldn't make my world cup squad and he certainly wouldn't make my 23 man team in a world cup final.
Although theres a 0% chance of him being dropped..

exhibit 2: Israel Dagg

The signs are so clear now. Hes not the current or the future. hes a waste of time. If he makes the squad I will be spewing and if he starts at fullback over Ben Smith I would say we deserve to loose the cup. (a bit far but just making a point). The man doesnt offer anything..

exhibit 3: Cory Jane

Still should be given a crack to show his worth and prove me wrong but plain and simply Naholo has the finese and finishing capabilities of Jane, more speed and more power. The only avenue he tips Naholo on is experience. Even Jane probably realises he cant compete.

My outside backs for the cup
Smith, Savea, Naholo, Piutau.

Skuddler will get his crack next year in place of Piutau. And before the anti Piutau parade come out the man offers more experience, versatility and just what you need in a world cup year

 

[William18]

Given that teams are allowed eight substitutes (that's more than half a team) there ought to be ample opportunities to give fringe players a run without changing the run on XV all that much.

Giving someone ten minutes off the bench isn't what I call giving them an opportunity. Sopoaga for instance is a player who needs to have the opportunity to start a test match.

 

[TobesHodges]

Its very frustrating to me that certain players probably wont be dropped because too much has been invested in them.

e.g. Sonny Bill

Either one of Crotty or Fekitoa will be dropped to make way for money bill wereas both deserve to be there in front of him. We dont need him, its so annoying hansen and co went above and beyond to get this bloke back to our shores when we have better local talent. OK fair enough in 2010- 2011 he actually deserved to be picked on warrant and was a valuable world cup squad member. Although he still complained about game time he received in the cup... mate you dont get to start above nonu because of your name.
Based on his form this year which isnt bad I may say, but not spectacular.. He wouldn't make my world cup squad and he certainly wouldn't make my 23 man team in a world cup final.
Although theres a 0% chance of him being dropped..

exhibit 2: Israel Dagg

The signs are so clear now. Hes not the current or the future. hes a waste of time. If he makes the squad I will be spewing and if he starts at fullback over Ben Smith I would say we deserve to loose the cup. (a bit far but just making a point). The man doesnt offer anything..

exhibit 3: Cory Jane

Still should be given a crack to show his worth and prove me wrong but plain and simply Naholo has the finese and finishing capabilities of Jane, more speed and more power. The only avenue he tips Naholo on is experience. Even Jane probably realises he cant compete.

My outside backs for the cup
Smith, Savea, Naholo, Piutau.

Skuddler will get his crack next year in place of Piutau. And before the anti Piutau parade come out the man offers more experience, versatility and just what you need in a world cup year

I fully agree with Dagg.. Sadly he has been surpassed.. Smith is the #1 full back in the world followed very closely by falou.

I understand what your saying about sonny bill, but I think he is a game changer.. If you guys are losing in a semi or a quarter and something's not clicking, I'd rather have sonny bill sitting on the bench that crotty.. Fekitoa will be in squad 100%.

Cory Jane I sort of "umm & Arr" at him, he certainly wasn't bad this season at all.. I think your totally right, it has to be Naholo and Savea starting wingers, easily 2 of the top 5 wingers in world rugby (I'd rate Savea #1).

I don't think the anti piutau parade will be out, I think the pro Milner shudder parade will be, I get EXPERIENCE etc. But seriously how can you leave this guy out the squad? How many games did the caines look iffy and then scudder did something amazing that brought the team back to life, he is an absolute game changer and a match winner.

On a side note I know this will never happen but I said it from week 3, Josh Hoeneck for the landers is the best defensive prop in the world this season, get that man on the plane!

 

[chikwa chibwe]

Lets put this in a little perspective guys.

That was an All Blacks team selected from the bottom three NZ Super rugby teams, most of whom haven't played any rugby for over three weeks (or two weeks in the case of Chiefs players), playing in Samoa, in the heat, and they still won!!!


I for one, am happy they have managed to win and shake out the rustiness in this match, rather than having to do that against Argentina in 9 days time.

Samoa really showed up and took it to them, but they will be disappointed not to have won; this was the weakest All Black team to take the field in an international in the last decade, and they were ripe for the plucking!!!

Carter MCCAW, Whitelock woodcock , franks Messam Kaino . Weak team. I don't think so. At least not from the selectors point of view.

 

[chikwa chibwe]

I fully agree with Dagg.. Sadly he has been surpassed.. Smith is the #1 full back in the world followed very closely by falou.

I understand what your saying about sonny bill, but I think he is a game changer.. If you guys are losing in a semi or a quarter and something's not clicking, I'd rather have sonny bill sitting on the bench that crotty.. Fekitoa will be in squad 100%.

Cory Jane I sort of "umm & Arr" at him, he certainly wasn't bad this season at all.. I think your totally right, it has to be Naholo and Savea starting wingers, easily 2 of the top 5 wingers in world rugby (I'd rate Savea #1).

I don't think the anti piutau parade will be out, I think the pro Milner shudder parade will be, I get EXPERIENCE etc. But seriously how can you leave this guy out the squad? How many games did the caines look iffy and then scudder did something amazing that brought the team back to life, he is an absolute game changer and a match winner.

On a side note I know this will never happen but I said it from week 3, Josh Hoeneck for the landers is the best defensive prop in the world this season, get that man on the plane!

Good analysis. They ll probably go with Jane & keep Dagg somewhere in the hunt . I d pick sonny bill before Ryan crotty. Jane & Dagg do not deserve to be in the squad.

 

[Kiwi_]

It will play out like this in the outside backs;

9.A.Smith. Bench. TJ. 3rd string. TKB 4. Weber
10.D.Carter Bench. Barrett 3rd string. Slade 4th Sopoanga
11.J.Savea Bench. Naholo 3rd string Jane 4th Moala
12.C.Smith Bench Fekitoa 3rd string Crotty
13.M.Nonu Bench SBW 3rd string Crotty
14.C.Piutau Bench Naholo 3rd string Jane 4th Moala
15.B.Smith Bench Dagg 3rd string Skudder.

Now if I had it my way, Dagg would be dropped for Skudder. Hansen might chance his arm and do it, but probably not. But Ben is nailed at 15.
Naholo if he plays well might take the wing spot from Piutau.

18/13 split in the 31 RWC squad.

13 backs will be;

1.A.Smith
2.TJ Peranara
3.D.Carter
4.B.Barrett
5.C.Slade
6.C.Smith
7.M.Nonu
8.M.Fekitoa
9.SBW
10.J.Savea
11.C.Piutau
12.W.Naholo
13.B.Smith

Piutau comfortable at FB/Wing if you're worried about FB depth same with Barrett and Slade.

 

[Larksea]

guys need to realize that there is only room for like 13-14 backs in a world cup squad, likely 13. It's tight as hell.

factor in that there will likely be 3 halfbacks and 3 10's (carter, Slade, Barrett) things are going to be very tight for the midfield and outside backs.

versatility is king and players like Slade, Barrett, Ben Smith are key. Other players will need to be able to cover, I expect SBW may get a run on the wing.

There is bugger all room for guys like Crotty, Fekitoa, Piutau, Skudder, Jane, Dagg, Naholo to fight over. Guys that should be there will miss out, and will be on injury standby outside the squad.

At this stage, with the impressive new talent we have it's looking more and more likely that Dagg & Jane's spots are under serious threat.

Seriously at this stage there is just no room for Crotty or Fekitoa, AB regulars over the last couple of years but unless there is an injury their chances are slim. People continue to under rate SBW, he is in a bit of a form dip but he will be there and he can up his game to another level when needed.

Shadow WC backs, if you want someone in you gotta drop someone out.
9, Smith, Perenara, TKB
10, Carter, Barrett, Slade
midfield: Nonu, Smith, SBW,
outsides: Smith, Savea, naholo, Skudder

versatility is key...
carter can play 10-12
barrett can play 10,wing & 15
slade can play 10, wing & 15
SBW can play 12 & wing, expect him to have a run on the wing at some stage.
Ben Smith can play anywhere 12-15
Skudder can play 14 & 15