Neutrals who are you supporting?

[Jaguares]

I've also read that the government directly subsidises the All Blacks, something why doesn't happen for the Wallabies.

The Australian government should subsidise the Rugby Union too. Australia spends a lot of money in AFL and NRL, but aren't international sports.

The Australian national cricket team and the Australian rugby union team are the most recognized teams in the sports world for Australia.

The audience that will see the Wallabies in this RWC final is much larger than the 4 million viewers of AFL. Rugby World Cup is one of the most successful sports event in the world, with a total audience of 4 billion. Only behind the Olympics Games (5 billion) and the FIFA World Cup (26 billion). Aussie Rules and Rugby League will never have these numbers in the world.

 

[RoosTah]

^ That's obviously true, but soccer fans argue the same thing and yet no one wants to pay top dollar for the A-League because not enough people in Australia care about it and its ratings are now falling.

The international appeal of something is ultimately irrelevant from the perspective of an Australian broadcaster, because they have to sell the TV time to companies looking at our market.

For the record, the government does provide some funding for Union, but I meant specifically the national sides; the Wallabies don't get government funding here, but I've heard the ABs are directly subsidized in NZ by government

 

[Jaguares]

Aussies should look more outward in this globalized world. And don't be like the Americans who live in their own world.

Australia share time zone with Japan, a sleeping rugby giant. If the Japanese can grow as Argentina has done in 20 years of steady growth, a lot of money will come from Japan.

 

[RoosTah]

Aussies should look more outward in this globalized world. And don't be like the Americans who live in their own world.

Australia share time zone with Japan, a sleeping rugby giant. If the Japanese can grow as Argentina has done in 20 years of steady growth, a lot of money will come from Japan.

I love rugby, but I don't but that "you need to be more internationalised" argument for sport. If anything I think other countries have much less individual character in sporting terms precisely because they have nothing unique in footballing terms and just have soccer. As much as people like to bag the US, American Football is far more intrinsically American than soccer can ever be Brazilian. Taking the analogy of languages, the former is its own language altogether, whilst the latter is little more than a local dialect.

 

[Jaguares]

I love rugby, but I don't but that "you need to be more internationalised" argument for sport. If anything I think other countries have much less individual character in sporting terms precisely because they have nothing unique in footballing terms and just have soccer. As much as people like to bag the US, American Football is far more intrinsically American than soccer can ever be Brazilian. Taking the analogy of languages, the former is its own language altogether, whilst the latter is little more than a local dialect.

American Football is an evolution of rugby which came from Canada. Sport can bridge cultures and is a good advertisement for a country.

I didn't know nothing about Australia, until I saw your national rugby team in the 90's and sparked my interest in the country

I had not been interested in a small continent like Oceania, thousands of kilometers away were it not for rugby

 

[RoosTah]

American Football is an evolution of rugby which came from Canada. Sport can bridge cultures and is a good advertisement for a country.

I didn't know nothing about Australia, until I saw your national rugby team in the 90's and sparked my interest in the country

I had not been interested in a small continent like Oceania, thousands of kilometers away were it not for rugby

American Football evolved out of Rugby, but it's the perfect sporting example of the Galapagos effect all the same; it's become something truly unique.
I'll grant you that sport can teach us about other countries, but it can just as easily tear countries apart; the bodyline Ashes series in Australia led to Australians and British people boycotting each others products and strained diplomatic ties until WWII broke out.

In any case, my point was more that its a poor argument to suggest that a country should focus its attention more on "international" sports because they're some how good for diplomacy. The English love their soccer more than anyone, but I met more multilingual Americans when I visited New York a few years back than I ever met multilingual English people when I went to London, and they're right on Europe's doorstep. Supporting a football team of any code is ultimately about attachment and tribalism, and the size of a game's international footprint is not a necessary ingredient for that to occur and generally local rivalries are more effective at fostering it.

Back to my original point though, Australia has four football codes all played at a professional level, but Rugby is very much a poor relation at the moment.

 

[ENZED-88]

Straya

4 Because players like Richie McCaw, Nonu, Conrad Smith, Mealamu, Woodcock have won a WC and too many Bledisloe Cups and players like Stephen Moore, Adam Ashley-Cooper, Matt Giteau, David Pocock, Drew Mitchell, Kepu and others deserve win a WC.

How do these players deserve to win a World Cup if they haven't won one let alone played in one before?

 

[InsaneAsylum]

How do these players deserve to win a World Cup if they haven't won one let alone played in one before?

That's the whole point, the retiring All Blacks have already tasted World Cup success 4 years ago, and many Bledisloe cups between now and 2004. I wouldn't say we deserve it more though.

Plus Australia winning a world cup would be massive for us Wallabies fans, we've been starved of success for a long time. If the Wallabies won, you would hear any gloating or arrogance from me, more relief/disbelief. It would be a humbling experience as I was 20 years old when we won the last one and I can't remember that feeling.

 

[Bazzy]

Hah! You make it sound like Aussies are some sort of long suffering sports fans. :lol:

You guys win like 90% of various world cups that are played!

 

[Shaggy]

This isn't really accurate... in fact it's not even close.
- First up, Australia has a population of 20 million, but only NSW and Qld have any genuine rugby footprint from a developmental standpoint (Melbourne and the Force are populated by NSW/Qld players, plus a few foreigners). That gives Rugby a population base closer to 10 million in Australia.
- Secondly is the fact that Rugby is minuscule compared to Rugby League and AFL here. From a developmental standpoint NZ and Australia have roughly the same number of adults playing the game. Meanwhile, Super Rugby is only available on pay TV, which has a penetration rate below 30% and frankly most people even in NSW and Qld just know very little about the competition. As a point of refrence, when the Waratahs won the Super Rugby ***le last year, the epic home final at Olympic park only got 3/4 full and its ratings peaked at 600k (compared with the 4 million+ that watched the NRL and AFL GF's each year). These stats are important, as it leads to my final point: money.
- Third, the ARU are basically broke. The TV contracts they get for tests and Super Rugby are quite literally one tenth of what the AFL and NRL earn respectively (current deals). In fact the game got so poor last year that they instead of pouring money into clubs and development, they started asking for money BACK.

So from a resources standpoint NZ is arguably better off - Rugby is the national game, has a very strong and long standing two-tiered national competition that feeds into Super Rugby and its is prominent in the school system. In addition, the All Blacks are a global brand with massive recognition, meaning their promotion rights go for quite a lot more. Moreover, I've also read that the government directly subsidises the All Blacks, something why doesn't happen for the Wallabies.

I'd be very surprised if this were the case, because Rugby is one of a handful of sports here that can sustain itself financially; I'd be genuinely interested if you can provide a link or point me in the direction of where you read it ... your other points are fine by the way, there's no doubt that Rugby in Australia faces more issues than it does in NZ in terms of competition with other sports etc.

People have nothing but respect for NZ where I live, doesn't mean they have to cheer them on as fans in every game they play (even though I personally would like to see them win).

Exactly, my experiences overseas is that the majority of people respect the All Blacks but most don't mind if they lose, which is why I'm not surprised by the poll results to date.

Being a New Zealander, and expecting everyone (non-New Zealanders) to love your team, is a little like going through life expecting everyone to like you as a person ... it's just not going to happen.

That's the whole point, the retiring All Blacks have already tasted World Cup success 4 years ago, and many Bledisloe cups between now and 2004. I wouldn't say we deserve it more though.

Plus Australia winning a world cup would be massive for us Wallabies fans, we've been starved of success for a long time. If the Wallabies won, you would hear any gloating or arrogance from me, more relief/disbelief. It would be a humbling experience as I was 20 years old when we won the last one and I can't remember that feeling.

I can certainly relate to that, I wasn't much older when we won the first RWC, and had to wait 24 years for the next one; genuine question, but you guys should get some benefit already, in terms of an increased fan base/increased revenue, from your success in this RWC, regardless of the result though, shouldn't you?

 

[RoosTah]

Hah! You make it sound like Aussies are some sort of long suffering sports fans. :lol:

You guys win like 90% of various world cups that are played!

This is true. But us Aussie rugby fans would really really like it if we could win this too [emoji1]

 

[james5000]

The Australian government should subsidise the Rugby Union too. Australia spends a lot of money in AFL and NRL, but aren't international sports.

The Australian national cricket team and the Australian rugby union team are the most recognized teams in the sports world for Australia.

The audience that will see the Wallabies in this RWC final is much larger than the 4 million viewers of AFL. Rugby World Cup is one of the most successful sports event in the world, with a total audience of 4 billion. Only behind the Olympics Games (5 billion) and the FIFA World Cup (26 billion). Aussie Rules and Rugby League will never have these numbers in the world.

I am pretty sure that the Cricket World Cup audience outstrips the Rugby World Cup by a big big margin. India's games alone would probably beat the Rugby World Cup tbf.

 

[InsaneAsylum]

Hah! You make it sound like Aussies are some sort of long suffering sports fans. :lol:

You guys win like 90% of various world cups that are played!

The only sport I follow is Rugby Union, it means everything to me, so to be bent over repeatedly by NZ for 13 years gets extremely frustrating but lets face it, the Wallabies have been poor during this time and we have had our fair share of internal troubles. At least we seem to be getting on the right track now.

 

[james5000]

This isn't really accurate... in fact it's not even close.
- First up, Australia has a population of 20 million, but only NSW and Qld have any genuine rugby footprint from a developmental standpoint (Melbourne and the Force are populated by NSW/Qld players, plus a few foreigners). That gives Rugby a population base closer to 10 million in Australia.
- Secondly is the fact that Rugby is minuscule compared to Rugby League and AFL here. From a developmental standpoint NZ and Australia have roughly the same number of adults playing the game. Meanwhile, Super Rugby is only available on pay TV, which has a penetration rate below 30% and frankly most people even in NSW and Qld just know very little about the competition. As a point of refrence, when the Waratahs won the Super Rugby ***le last year, the epic home final at Olympic park only got 3/4 full and its ratings peaked at 600k (compared with the 4 million+ that watched the NRL and AFL GF's each year). These stats are important, as it leads to my final point: money.
- Third, the ARU are basically broke. The TV contracts they get for tests and Super Rugby are quite literally one tenth of what the AFL and NRL earn respectively (current deals). In fact the game got so poor last year that they instead of pouring money into clubs and development, they started asking for money BACK.

So from a resources standpoint NZ is arguably better off - Rugby is the national game, has a very strong and long standing two-tiered national competition that feeds into Super Rugby and its is prominent in the school system. In addition, the All Blacks are a global brand with massive recognition, meaning their promotion rights go for quite a lot more. Moreover, I've also read that the government directly subsidises the All Blacks, something why doesn't happen for the Wallabies.

I don't know what a 30% penetration rate is tbh, but NZ's population is less than 30% of aussies. Closer to 20% actually.

I'd be genuinely surprised if a super rugby final had that much of a larger audience in NZ then a NRL grand final myself actually

Yeah i've never known the government to fund rugby in our country any substantial amount

 

[ENZED-88]

That's the whole point, the retiring All Blacks have already tasted World Cup success 4 years ago, and many Bledisloe cups between now and 2004. I wouldn't say we deserve it more though.

Plus Australia winning a world cup would be massive for us Wallabies fans, we've been starved of success for a long time. If the Wallabies won, you would hear any gloating or arrogance from me, more relief/disbelief. It would be a humbling experience as I was 20 years old when we won the last one and I can't remember that feeling.

Yea he made it sound like they deserved the cup before the final has been played. It's a sport not a Disney movie.
Should the wobs WIN THIS FINAL I would say, this would be the greatest achievement at any RWC to date. They have travelled the hardest path and have one more hurdle, clear that and then you can say these players deserve a WC.

 

[RoosTah]

I don't know what a 30% penetration rate is tbh, but NZ's population is less than 30% of aussies. Closer to 20% actually.

I'd be genuinely surprised if a super rugby final had that much of a larger audience in NZ then a NRL grand final myself actually

Yeah i've never known the government to fund rugby in our country any substantial amount

Well it's 30% of all Australia, so with rugby really only having a footprint across half the country that equates to about 3 million people, and most of the people who have fox actually get it for the extra NRL games.

 

[ENZED-88]

The only sport I follow is Rugby Union, it means everything to me,

Best of luck to your team I'll be genuinely happy for the true blue wallabies supporters like you if you guys get up this weekend ( those who wake up early hours of the morning an stick with their team through all the downs)

 

[Bo Jandals]

I voted for Australia just to annoy Kiwi_

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

The ABs are ruthlessly efficient, but in full flight the Aussies are more inventive and better to watch. It also seems to matter too much to NZ, so for those reasons I'm with the Wallabies.

And if they win the whole damned shooting match it will make me feel just a little bit better about our defeat to them.

 

[ENZED-88]

:

I voted for Australia just to annoy Kiwi_

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