Martin Johnson Era has Begun.

[Sir Speedy]

The problem with Wilko is that he needs a strong willed pair of guys at center to take the pressure off of him. If there are others doing the thinking for him, he is very good when left to his own devices. However, if all the pressure is on him to do something and direct the team, he just self-destructs. I think the Six Nations this year was a perfect illustration of that....

...especially with that crazy 'pass' to Cipriani in the Wales game..ugh...I can't unsee what I saw during those crazy, crazy 40 minutes...
[/b]

Yeh, because England lost it, not Wales won it.
It's interesting that Flutey has been picked, because while many think he should start at 12, I can see MJ putting Wilko at 12 and Flood at 10. Or vice-versa. <_< It's really ironic for you guys that as soon as you find a fly-half who seems certain to overtake Wilko at 10 (despite him not deserving the shirt anyway), the dude (Cippers) breaks his ankle. -.-

 

[Prestwick]

Yeh, because England lost it, not Wales won it. [/b]

Well, Wales did win it if Mr Edwards was controling Wilko's arm actions via radio-control if thats what you're saying...

 

[nick_w]

Looks like Johnson is trying to make his mark early with this squad. A lot of brave decisions, especially bringing wilko in as the only specialist 10. Prestwick is right, he was a solid FH before the end of 2003 because Greenwood and Tinds were making a lot of the calls. My worry is whether the same chemistry will be produced again. Wilko is under performing in every aspect, therefore he will have very little game time for England (if any) resulting in him no longer being picked (which is pretty much what everyone has said already, sorry!)

Anyway, back to business, I can understand why Johnno has dropped Ojo, Strettle and Brown, but could someone explain to me why he has kept Care in the team if he is meant to have been involved in this "Auckland Four" debacle, because I don't see how Varndell> Ojo and Strettle. Perhaps different levels of involvement.

my XV
Sheridan
Hartley
Stevens
Shaw
Kennedy KENNEDY!
Crane
Rees
Haskell
Care (despite above comments)
Flood (keeping 10 shirt warm for Cipriani)
JSD
Flutey
Hipkiss
Lewsey
Tait

 

[Sir Speedy]

<div class='quotemain'>
Yeh, because England lost it, not Wales won it. [/b]

Well, Wales did win it if Mr Edwards was controling Wilko's arm actions via radio-control if thats what you're saying...
[/b][/quote]
Na, we won it after Edwards gave Wales his famous, "I'll pulverise you, your families and your gravestones if you don't start f**king playing", look at half-time.

 

[gingergenius]

THERE'S A SARACENS GUY IN THE SQUAD.

On other notes, I'm quite happy with that squad.

Surprised Varndell's ahead of the other wingers (Strettle seems to have fallen right off).

+

Worsley, Tindall and Kay have been got rid of.

Flutey

-

Jamie Noon has managed to stay around.

----------------------

I can understand the other selections. Lewsey, yeah he's too old but Tait has to play somewhere and if it's not 15 then there's no one else remotely good enough to play fullback, other than Lewsey.

Vickery, while I think he's past it and should no way be captain, is still a good player, and though this is heinous for an Englishman to admit, we're short on tried and tested props.

I just hope people realise that however much they moan about squad selections, having someone else in there really won't make us into a world class team. This is done by good coaching, organisation and team cohesion. All the players in that England squad are capable of playing well and beating other teams. They just need to be pushed and prodded the right way.

 

[Prestwick]

Looks like Johnson is trying to make his mark early with this squad. A lot of brave decisions, especially bringing wilko in as the only specialist 10. Prestwick is right, he was a solid FH before the end of 2003 because Greenwood and Tinds were making a lot of the calls. My worry is whether the same chemistry will be produced again. Wilko is under performing in every aspect, therefore he will have very little game time for England (if any) resulting in him no longer being picked (which is pretty much what everyone has said already, sorry!)
[/b]

I think in the poor situation in which Wilko does get picked, I would go for a Flutey/Geraghty and Hipkiss partnership to

THERE'S A SARACENS GUY IN THE SQUAD.[/b]

HOLY CRAP GET RID OF HIM!

Seriously, thats a death sentence for Borthwick. I'd bet you anything that if (pre-ankle) Danny Cipriani joined Saracens, he'd never get an England call up.

 

[dundeesmiffy]

Wigglesworth?
Admittedly I didn't catch either of the NZ test because I was out of town both weekends, just caught the highlights mid-week. Did he have a bad time in the first test?

I was sad to see Lipman omitted also, I think he's had a pretty awesome season...maybe a little young though.

I think the NZ scandal has played a big role in the selection, certain notable players who've been on form...you know...scoring two tries, not getting selected.

The team I'd pick out of the elite is;

1. Stevens
2. Hartley
3. Sheridan
4. Borthwick
5. Simon Shaw
6. Haskell
7. Rees
8. Crane
9. Care
10. Barkley (Keeping it warm for Cipriani)
11. Simpson-Daniel
12. Flutey*
13. Tait
14. Sackey
15. Lewsey

16. Chuter
17. Vickery
18. Palmer
19. Moody
20. Richards (Lesser of two evils)
21. Flood
22. Varndell

This is 'an' England squad I'd like to see, I've kept the team fairly young with some old guns on the bench. I think it'd be wise however to have an experience second row to give some tutelage in the scrum and line-out but I'm all for giving the young guys a run out in full England colors. When Cipriani is back from injury (assuming he's resume the same outstanding form) I'd move Barkley to inside center and see below for what I'd for with Flutey.

*I'm not entirely happy with Flutey being elligable for full England duties. Fair enough he's lived in England for long enough but he's represented the NZ Maori team and I (in my opinion) think that should disallow him from representing England. Nothing against Kiwi's or Maori's I just don't like the idea of people having had represented other countries at any level and then going on to represent another.
I however, and not that bothered about it, seeing as I'm Scottish, haha. I sincerely hope he isn't any part of the British and Irish Lions tour, on the same principal...even if I don't consider myself British.
I'm not denying his form, or his ability...he's one of the most consistent players I've seen in a long time, he compliments Cipriani so well and I think it's a big part of all the accolades lil' Cips has been receiving, but the whole premise of what some people in the media are calling 'imports' doesn't sit with me.

Not that I'm saying every other country is totally innocent of it...I recently heard Nathan Hines talk and I totally forgot he was an Aussie.

 

[Ripper]

We don't want him, the last time he was playing down here he was busy making looking Tasea Lavea look like Daniel Carter, if you lot want to trot him out for your national teams you won't here any complaints from us.

 

[peppers07]

<div class='quotemain'>
Wilkinson is past it and shouldny shouldnt have been been picked I think lamb or Geraghty would have been better until Cipriani is fit again. I havnt seen a lot of the Guiness premiership this season only about five matchs but from what ive seen of Ben Foden he should be in the senior sqaud. Is he bad at defence or something?
[/b]

Nope, it's just he can be suicidal at times. While he does many magnificent things, he does some downright dreadful things aswell - Wasps interception try against Sale in Adams Park this year; we could have had a vital losing bp if he didn't do that. (Then again, we could have had bonus points many-a-time this year.) <_<
[/b][/quote]

I see

*I'm not entirely happy with Flutey being elligable for full England duties. Fair enough he's lived in England for long enough but he's represented the NZ Maori team and I (in my opinion) think that should disallow him from representing England. Nothing against Kiwi's or Maori's I just don't like the idea of people having had represented other countries at any level and then going on to represent another.[/b]

That means Mafi and Tipoki could play for Ireland that would be savage

 

[gingergenius]

We don't want him, the last time he was playing down here he was busy making looking Tasea Lavea look like Daniel Carter, if you lot want to trot him out for your national teams you won't here any complaints from us.
[/b]

yes, he's a good player but I find the fact we are picking someone who is essentially a NZ reject a little demeaning... considering we want to compete with them.

Would he be the first Maori ever to play for England?

 

[MunsterMan]

That means Mafi and Tipoki could play for Ireland that would be savage
[/b]

Tipoki in theory coulde in a few years but that won't happen. Mafi played 7's for NZ so can't play for Ireland/Tonga.

 

[steynboi]

I really don't think Martin Johnson will be a good coach, dont get me wrong he was a great forward but i just see him as one of these coaches for 2 years that don't get achievements and are eventually fired.

 

[EnglandWillWin2011]

Maori isn't a country so it doesn't matter if Flutey has played for them.

1. Stevens
2. Hartley
3. Sheridan
4. Kennedy
5. Shaw
6. Haskell
7. Rees
8. Crane

9.Ellis
10. Wilkinson
11. Sackey
12. Flutey
13. Tait
14. Simpson
15. Lewsey

That team could smash the 6 nations

dundeesmiffy:

"I however, and not that bothered about it, seeing as I'm Scottish, haha. I sincerely hope he isn't any part of the British and Irish Lions tour, on the same principal...even if I don't consider myself British."


Scotland is a part of Great Britain, therefore you are British. I will prove this to you, go look at your passport, what does it say?

 

[Bullitt]

lol @ your backline.

 

[Sir Speedy]

What people see in Sackey is beyond me. I lol @ England if he's the best wing you've got.

 

[Bullitt]

What people see in Sackey is beyond me. I lol @ England if he's the best wing you've got. [/b]

I've been saying that since the world cup (when I made a U-turn of opinion atwhich even the Labour govenment would cringe after seeing his abysmal performances), of course people throw abuse at me when I say it.

JSD, Ojo, Ashton & Strettle all offer more then Sackey.

 

[steynboi]

sackey is crap, he was nothing before he joined wasps he was just a standard rugby player and is still a standard rugby player he is nothing compared to habana, sivivatu and that lot.

 

[gingergenius]

What people see in Sackey is beyond me. I lol @ England if he's the best wing you've got.
[/b]

He's quick, strong, scores lots of tries and has a very underrated defence. Unless Horgan's on fire he should walk into the Lions team.

EDIT:

reads Mite's post, see's Ashton, scoffs at a guy who's never even played premiership rugby and the obvious Saints bias clouding things...

JSD perhaps yes but he's always injured and has yet to prove himself internationally.
Ojo.. what do you see about him that makes him better than PS?
Strettle, again perhaps yes but he's always getting himself injured and doesn't score so many tries, he should have scored in NZ.

Can any of you name me one chance Sackey's had to score that he hasn't finished off?

 

[Sir Speedy]

<div class='quotemain'>
What people see in Sackey is beyond me. I lol @ England if he's the best wing you've got.
[/b]

He's quick, strong, scores lots of tries and has a very underrated defence. Unless Horgan's on fire he should walk into the Lions team.

[/b][/quote]
I don't doubt his finishing ability; I agree that given in any try-scoring situation, 99 times out of 100 he'll finish it, but since half the tries he scores are sitters that the majority of the British population could score I find him unbelievably overrated by Wasps fans and the English population.
The wings for the Lions should be:

Shane Williams
JSD

If there's any justice in the World at least.

While we're at it, I suggest we put Dan Parks at 12 and Chris Paterson at fullback.
Oh, and don't forget Adam Jones at tight-head.

 

[EnglandWillWin2011]

lol @ your backline.
[/b]

Yours is 2 players different to mine, Wilkinson is a better fly-half than Flood when playing well, and I think it's ridiculous to write him off just now. To me Tait is far superior to Hipkiss, I think he could be regarded as world class in the future, Hipkiss will probably be always regarded as mediocre.